The environment thread

[StrangeSox]

No sun spots in the month of August - First time since 1913.

 

http://www.dailytech.com/Sun+Makes+History...rticle12823.htm

[Balta1701]

I do think its a good idea to try to put them pretty far offshore, when practical. Out of view. But that shouldn't stop it from happening. I don't recall the exact situation for Teddy, but, if he just outright went against it without trying to work out a compromise, then that's just stupid.

They were far enough offshore that the eye would see them as about a centimeter tall speck on the horizon. But because it was off of some of the richest shoreline in the country, shoreline that just happened to have Kennedy land on it, the guys in Mass were able to come up with enough money and enough faux-reasons to stop them. (Classic example, they argued that there was lubricating oil required for those turbines which could spill. That is 100% true. However, there's already a platform near those areas that is taking in oil and gas shipped from overseas, which has already had spills much larger than could happen if every single turbine happened to spill).

[BigSqwert]

China Planning Electric Vehicle Charging Stations

 

China is rushing in to build its own network of electric charging stations. Xinhua, the government's official newspaper, announced last week that the State Grid Corporation, the world's largest electric power transmission and distribution company, is speeding up its plans to build electric car charging stations.

 

The stations will be located in Shanghai, Beijing, Tianjin and other large cities.

 

The power charging stations will be built as a pilot project to initially serve electric buses and sedans in a trial run with plans to eventually cover the entire nation. Each station will cost the equivalent of about $37,000 to $44,000.

 

The country showcased its charging station networks around venues during the 2008 Beijing Olympics last month to power the 600 electric vehicles used, including 55 buses powered by electric-lithium-cells.

 

China hopes to bring in 10,000 fuel cell, electric and hybrid cars as well as infrastructure to power the vehicles in 10 chosen cities around the country within two years, according to the ministry of science and technology.

 

The experiment will help the government agencies work out policies for developing more new energy cars, says Wan Gan, the country's minister of science and technology. The minister hopes that within five years, alternative energy vehicles will account for one in every ten of the country's car productions.

 

LINK

[Balta1701]

CO2 emissions last year jumped by an amount that was so high it was outside of the upper bound predicted by the IPCC in their worst case scenario a year ago.

[EvilMonkey]

CO2 emissions last year jumped by an amount that was so high it was outside of the upper bound predicted by the IPCC in their worst case scenario a year ago.

You will never get the type of positive change you want nuntil you can bring on board all the poor coutries. Handicapping the US and Europe while China and India proceed full steam ahead is just economic disaster on a different level. The Eu already tried to find every way possible to get out of their Kyoto committments. Now they are trying harder. http://www.euractiv.com/en/climate-change/...-175773?Ref=RSS

Edited September 30, 2008 by Alpha Dog

[NorthSideSox72]

You will never get the type of positive change you want nuntil you can bring on board all the poor coutries. Handicapping the US and Europe while China and India proceed full steam ahead is just economic disaster on a different level. The Eu already tried to find every way possible to get out of their Kyoto committments. Now they are trying harder. http://www.euractiv.com/en/climate-change/...-175773?Ref=RSS

That argument is akin to saying you can't stop driving like an asshole because other people still drive like assholes.

 

Someone has to go first, and the others are a lot more likely to take it easy if some people have the balls and the brains to see the big picture.

 

We're supposed to lead. Let's lead.

 

 

[EvilMonkey]

That argument is akin to saying you can't stop driving like an asshole because other people still drive like assholes.

 

Someone has to go first, and the others are a lot more likely to take it easy if some people have the balls and the brains to see the big picture.

 

We're supposed to lead. Let's lead.

I didn't say that the US couldn't cut their emmissions, but that the supposed world goal will never be reached by just the US and EU cutting off thier balls while everyone else can hang free.

[NorthSideSox72]

I didn't say that the US couldn't cut their emmissions, but that the supposed world goal will never be reached by just the US and EU cutting off thier balls while everyone else can hang free.

I think the economic impact of civilized nations cutting emissions while developing nations aren't doing so as much has been greatly exaggerated.

 

[mr_genius]

I think the economic impact of civilized nations cutting emissions while developing nations aren't doing so as much has been greatly exaggerated.

 

IMO the key is to getting alternative energy, or more efficient energy use, to become in the economic interest of developing countries. If it's cheaper to use something other than fossil fuels, they'll do it.

[Balta1701]

IMO the key is to getting alternative energy, or more efficient energy use, to become in the economic interest of developing countries. If it's cheaper to use something other than fossil fuels, they'll do it.

And THE only way that is going to happen is if the nations that are wealthy enough to pay for the R&D spend the money to develop those systems for themselves...and then start using their trading power to "encourage" other nations to join in.

[NorthSideSox72]

And THE only way that is going to happen is if the nations that are wealthy enough to pay for the R&D spend the money to develop those systems for themselves...and then start using their trading power to "encourage" other nations to join in.

This. Or a little differently, WE need to be on the leading edge, and sell-sell-sell it all over the world. The more we sell, the cheaper it will get, the more poor countries can jump in on it.

 

[EvilMonkey]

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/10/01/am...straight-month/

[EvilMonkey]

http://www.futurepundit.com/archives/005606.html

Thin, rollable PV cells here soon! This could be really cool, and make solar available cheaply, to all. Might now power your whole house or anything, but if it covered 40%-50%, that would be cool too.

[lostfan]

I really wish solar was a lot cheaper, I can't wait until when/if it is.

[NorthSideSox72]

http://www.futurepundit.com/archives/005606.html

Thin, rollable PV cells here soon! This could be really cool, and make solar available cheaply, to all. Might now power your whole house or anything, but if it covered 40%-50%, that would be cool too.

I had heard about these. Basically, instead of trying to increase the efficiency rates, they try to make the cells cheaper and more flexible. It takes more to get the job done, but they are far less expensive.

 

I'm glad to see they are working in both directions on this. This will make all types of cells cheaper as time goes on.

 

[NorthSideSox72]

Oh and, remember, Congress just renewed and enhanced the federal tax breaks for solar panels. So make sure to include that in your math.

 

[Balta1701]

Things you never knew about...

The small island nation of Fiji with its population of about 150,000 -- is now controlled by a military regime that took control via the 2006 Fijian coup d'état. With such an unstable government -- people suffer while some industries prosper. One of these prospering companies is Fiji Water. Water imported into the US from the small island nation of Fiji is ranked number 2 in bottled waters. France, of course, is number 1.

 

Today, about one-third of Fiji's people lack access to clean drinking water, leading to incidents of typhoid and other water-related diseases.

 

The irony of these statistics is that Fiji Water exported about 130 million liters of Fiji water in the past year. To present a "green face" to the world -- Fiji Water returns a token amount of money to bring clean water to certain areas of Fiji. However, according to a recent BBC investigation, the Fiji capital of Suva has an undependable water system with failing infrastructure.

 

And, let's not overlook the "transnational" power Fiji Water wields over the relatively powerless rulers of Fiji.

 

In early July of 2008, the Fijian government proposed a tax on bottled water in order to generate income and to help improve and conserve the island's water resources. In a span of a couple of weeks -- the government had to abort the bottled water tax because of overt economic threats by the bottled water lobby.

[NorthSideSox72]

Things you never knew about...

So, effectively, they are a nation controlled by a corporation. One that Americans buy products from, under the illusion that its more environmentally friendly.

 

f***ing awesome.

 

I don't buy much bottled water, but if I do in the future, it won't be from Fiji.

 

[Balta1701]

I don't buy much bottled water, but if I do in the future, it won't be from Fiji.

I had exactly the same thought (I only buy Bottled water for either field trips to areas without water supplies or for emergency prep typically).

[Balta1701]

Washington - According to the latest "Monthly Electricity Review" issued by the U.S. Energy Information Administration (October 3, 2008), net U.S. generation of electricity from renewable energy sources surged by 32 percent in June 2008 compared to June 2007.

 

Renewable energy (biomass, geothermal, hydropower, solar, wind) totaled 41,160,000 megawatt-hours (MWh) in June 2008 up from 31,242,000 MWh in June 2007. Renewables accounted for 11.0 percent of net U.S. electricity generation in June 2008 compared to 8.6 percent in June 2007. Compared to June 2007, wind power grew by 81.6 percent in June 2008 while solar and conventional hydropower experienced increases of 42.6 percent and 34.7 percentrespectively. Geothermal energy also enjoyed a slight increase (0.8percent) while biomass (wood + waste) remained relatively unchanged.

Link. According to Senator Obama's energy plan, their goal is to have 10% of U.S. electricity coming from renewable sources by 2012. Thanks to the energy price spike, despite having an administration opposed to its growth, and subsidies that appeared to be disappearing until they were stuck in to the bailout bill...the U.S. has already passed that goal.

 

Don't tell me we can't make an alternative energy system work. It's already happening, faster than predicted. The Obama campaign's goals now look laughable.

[NorthSideSox72]

Link. According to Senator Obama's energy plan, their goal is to have 10% of U.S. electricity coming from renewable sources by 2012. Thanks to the energy price spike, despite having an administration opposed to its growth, and subsidies that appeared to be disappearing until they were stuck in to the bailout bill...the U.S. has already passed that goal.

 

Don't tell me we can't make an alternative energy system work. It's already happening, faster than predicted. The Obama campaign's goals now look laughable.

Of course they can work. Market forces rule. Expensive oil and gas and decreasing costs of alternative tech means that more alternatives will be used.

 

But we still need to push hard. 10% is all great and fine, but the ultimate goal should be that infrastructure energy - electricity - should eventually be 100% non-fossil-fuel.

 

And, we need to make sure we support the nascent alternative energy industries in the US, so that the job creation and revenues growth can continue at a strong pace. This means changes to laws and regulations, tax structure, etc.

 

[southsider2k5]

Of course they can work. Market forces rule. Expensive oil and gas and decreasing costs of alternative tech means that more alternatives will be used.

 

But we still need to push hard. 10% is all great and fine, but the ultimate goal should be that infrastructure energy - electricity - should eventually be 100% non-fossil-fuel.

 

And, we need to make sure we support the nascent alternative energy industries in the US, so that the job creation and revenues growth can continue at a strong pace. This means changes to laws and regulations, tax structure, etc.

 

Its sad, but George Bush's energy policy has been the best thing for green energy that the US has ever seen.

[NorthSideSox72]

Its sad, but George Bush's energy policy has been the best thing for green energy that the US has ever seen.

Not sure I'd go that far. Its succeeding now more in spite of it, than because of it. And what incentives have been out there to date were enacted by Congress over the years, as part of larger legislation - and only a few have been at the behest of Dubya. Bush was all about Ethanol, which using corn, is not very helpful.

 

BTW, not saying that any other President has been notably better. They've all been pretty useless. Its a tallest midget contest.

 

[Balta1701]

BTW, not saying that any other President has been notably better. They've all been pretty useless. Its a tallest midget contest.

He didn't get it enacted...but I'd like to nominate this guy for the title of history's greatest monster the winner.

[NorthSideSox72]

He didn't get it enacted...but I'd like to nominate this guy for the title of history's greatest monster the winner.

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