The environment thread

[NorthSideSox72]

I'll use as much freaking energy as I freaking please. It's my money, and I'll be damned if the government tells me what the hell I should do with.

 

If I want a gas guzzling SUV, I'm getting me one. Cause you know what, I'd prefer to have a lot of steel between me and all the idiots on the road.

 

And if I want to go with the safer incandescent light bulbs because I don't want the mercury possibly effecting my home and family, guess what, I'll use the incandescent light bulbs.

 

And if I want to the AC to be on all summer, guess what, I'm gonna have the AC on all summer.

 

Cause you know why, it's my money and my freedom. Go save all the trees you want, nobody is telling me what to do with my money.

 

Just cause you feel like it's your responsibility to be greener doesn't mean it's mine and everyone else's.

Hey man, you want to sit there on the tracks laughing in your SUV while the train approaches, go ahead. Fortunately, since the majority of Americans realize we're headed for disaster, the majority will support ongoing efforts to make your choices more expensive. We, the majority, feel it is OUR freedom to do that to you. And we don't feel badly about it.

 

[KipWellsFan]

I'll use as much freaking energy as I freaking please. It's my money, and I'll be damned if the government tells me what the hell I should do with.

 

If I want a gas guzzling SUV, I'm getting me one. Cause you know what, I'd prefer to have a lot of steel between me and all the idiots on the road.

 

And if I want to go with the safer incandescent light bulbs because I don't want the mercury possibly effecting my home and family, guess what, I'll use the incandescent light bulbs.

 

And if I want to the AC to be on all summer, guess what, I'm gonna have the AC on all summer.

 

Cause you know why, it's my money and my freedom. Go save all the trees you want, nobody is telling me what to do with my money.

 

Just cause you feel like it's your responsibility to be greener doesn't mean it's mine and everyone else's.

 

Well on your deathbed you'll have to deal with that I guess.

[lostfan]

Ah, BearSox is back. I was wondering where he went.

[BearSox]

Well on your deathbed you'll have to deal with that I guess.

 

lol, what? On my deathbed I'll have to deal with it? Yeah, I'm pretty sure "thou shalt be green" is not a commandment in my religion.

 

But then again, according to all you liberals, the only true religion out there is Barackanity. So yeah, if Barackanity is the true religion, I'm f***ed.

[BearSox]

Hey man, you want to sit there on the tracks laughing in your SUV while the train approaches, go ahead. Fortunately, since the majority of Americans realize we're headed for disaster, the majority will support ongoing efforts to make your choices more expensive. We, the majority, feel it is OUR freedom to do that to you. And we don't feel badly about it.

Hey guess what, there's a lot of dumb f***s, illegals, people w/o licenses and drunks out on the road... When I get the money, I'm buying a nice big SUV. No way I am going to sacrifice safety or myself and eventually my family to make the Earth a little more "greener."

 

Same thing goes for the CFL's. I'll avoid putting a dangerous amount of mercury in my home, even if it means I have to spend a little more on the electric bill.

 

I'm not gonna go around chopping down trees and buying fresh packs of paper and throwing them out for fun, I'm not stupid. But excuse me if I put the safety and well being of myself and my family ahead of being as green as possible.

[BearSox]

Well, that's certainly one way to make sure that the planet runs out. And that you have very, very little money.

 

If you got the money go nuts... unfortunately, right now I don't. However, right now instead of working hard and trying to get a well paying job, I think I might just go on welfare and let the rich people take care of me.

 

Hell, if I have a daughter, I'm gonna send her down to North Carolina so we can get a dollar a day for 6 years if she doesn't get pregnant. That's an easy 2,000 plus. Oh, I forgot though, by that time, the dollar will likely be worthless.

Edited July 4, 2009 by BearSox

[Texsox]

Some people make a contribution to society, others s*** on it. It all depends on the mark an individual wants to make.

[BearSox]

Some people make a contribution to society, others s*** on it. It all depends on the mark an individual wants to make.

 

So now I s*** on society?... that's nice.

 

Yeah, you know me, I go to my local forest and cut down trees for fun! Why stop there? I also push old ladies down stairs, beat up mentally handicapped people, and kill babies for the fun of it!!!! You know, good ole BearSox, loves to s*** on society!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Yeah, you know what I want to do with my life... provide as much bit of safety I can for me and my family. Drive your flimsy hybrids and potentially contaminate your home with all the mercury you please, I don't care. This is America, founded on freedom. See, I still believe in this thing called freedom, and I'll make the best choices I deem for me and my future family. Don't like it, too bad. My money, my business.

 

But you know, because I'm not buying into the whole green movement, I s*** on society!!! Forget about the fact that I'm a hard working individual who minds his own business and wants to create a good, safe life for himself and family... I s*** on society!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

 

Disagree with what I say, fine. But to say I s*** on society? Man oh man, I am really holding myself back from a life time ban, cause I really want to go off on you right now.

 

Seriously? s*** on society? You got murders, rapists, child molesters, politicians without an ounce of ethics, etc., and I s*** on society???? Because I don't buy into the green movement???? Get real dude.

Edited July 5, 2009 by BearSox

[Texsox]

So now I s*** on society?... that's nice.

 

Did you see any of your posts quoted? I was just making an observation about people in general.Actually I have you on ignore, if someone hadn't of mentioned your rant, I would have missed it.

[BearSox]

Did you see any of your posts quoted? I was just making an observation about people in general.

 

Oh come on now, that was obviously in reply to me. Do you see anyone else talking about how they aren't going do all this green stuff in here?

 

I know you didn't quote me, but a monkey missing half of his brain could realize that post was in made in direct reply to my position on all of this.

 

I didn't quote you either, but you realized it was in direct reply to your statement.

 

Oh, and you have me on ignore? That doesn't mean squat, one click and you can see what I posted about, and you can see the quote tags on people replying to me.

 

I wish I could put you on ignore.

Edited July 5, 2009 by BearSox

[shipps]

Bearsox I am not in here much but I think you need to relax and get out of here for a little while just to calm yourself down.

[Texsox]

Hey man, you want to sit there on the tracks laughing in your SUV while the train approaches, go ahead. Fortunately, since the majority of Americans realize we're headed for disaster, the majority will support ongoing efforts to make your choices more expensive. We, the majority, feel it is OUR freedom to do that to you. And we don't feel badly about it.

 

The post I was originally responding to and I will elaborate.

 

Did I really need to mention that there are an infinite number of lifestyles between altruistic and s*** on society? The s*** on society folks are our murders, rapists, etc. The Mother Theresas of the world occupy the other end. In-between are the rest of us. Some are closer to one end of the spectrum, others are closer to the other. We all choose our path in life and what we value. One of the things I enjoy about this site are guys like SS who is so involved in his local schools, YMCA, etc. NSS and Middle of Somewhere adventures, all the coaches, we even have a Peace Corp alumni posting from time to time. I'd rather be known for what I gave away than what I kept.

[southsider2k5]

The post I was originally responding to and I will elaborate.

 

Did I really need to mention that there are an infinite number of lifestyles between altruistic and s*** on society? The s*** on society folks are our murders, rapists, etc. The Mother Theresas of the world occupy the other end. In-between are the rest of us. Some are closer to one end of the spectrum, others are closer to the other. We all choose our path in life and what we value. One of the things I enjoy about this site are guys like SS who is so involved in his local schools, YMCA, etc. NSS and Middle of Somewhere adventures, all the coaches, we even have a Peace Corp alumni posting from time to time. I'd rather be known for what I gave away than what I kept.

 

Hey if you are looking to give away some stuff, you know my address!

[Balta1701]

From the "Good things that happen because of government mandates" file: the government has mandated a phase-out of normal, high energy incandescent bulbs by 2012. Normally, no money was going in to research on new types of IC bulbs because hey, energy's cheap and we can make the bulbs cheap and no one has to worry about the external costs. The government makes policy requiring more energy efficiency, and suddenly money goes in to research, and people start coming up with more efficient versions of IC bulbs to meet the standards and satisfy the people (see; this thread) who are worried about CFL's for whatever reason.

Researchers across the country have been racing to breathe new life into Thomas Edison’s light bulb, a pursuit that accelerated with the new legislation. Amid that footrace, one company is already marketing limited quantities of incandescent bulbs that meet the 2012 standard, and researchers are promising a wave of innovative products in the next few years.

 

Indeed, the incandescent bulb is turning into a case study of the way government mandates can spur innovation.

 

“There’s a massive misperception that incandescents are going away quickly,” said Chris Calwell, a researcher with Ecos Consulting who studies the bulb market. “There have been more incandescent innovations in the last three years than in the last two decades.”

The government stepped in to mandate something to better society and to force people to come to grips with the fact that there are external costs that the consumer isn't bearing (environmental degradation) and the market reacts rapidly. Impressive.

[NorthSideSox72]

From the "Good things that happen because of government mandates" file: the government has mandated a phase-out of normal, high energy incandescent bulbs by 2012. Normally, no money was going in to research on new types of IC bulbs because hey, energy's cheap and we can make the bulbs cheap and no one has to worry about the external costs. The government makes policy requiring more energy efficiency, and suddenly money goes in to research, and people start coming up with more efficient versions of IC bulbs to meet the standards and satisfy the people (see; this thread) who are worried about CFL's for whatever reason.

The government stepped in to mandate something to better society and to force people to come to grips with the fact that there are external costs that the consumer isn't bearing (environmental degradation) and the market reacts rapidly. Impressive.

This is good. You internalize externalities to the consumer, make them responsible for the costs by way of the products they buy, and you encourage innovation and more accurate views into the true costs of their choices.

 

government stepping in doesn't always create such good things of course, but in this case, it sure did.

 

[Balta1701]

This is good. You internalize externalities to the consumer, make them responsible for the costs by way of the products they buy, and you encourage innovation and more accurate views into the true costs of their choices.

 

government stepping in doesn't always create such good things of course, but in this case, it sure did.

Which is of course why I'm hopeful that even the weak version of a cap and trade bill the House just passed will be more effective than anyone thinks. Turn the market loose, make the costs of coal fired electricity and oil fired automobiles something the customer has to bear more directly, give it a few years, and I think we'll be shocked at how rapid and effective the changes are.

[KipWellsFan]

Which is of course why I'm hopeful that even the weak version of a cap and trade bill the House just passed will be more effective than anyone thinks. Turn the market loose, make the costs of coal fired electricity and oil fired automobiles something the customer has to bear more directly, give it a few years, and I think we'll be shocked at how rapid and effective the changes are.

 

Important global effect too.

 

"Whoa, America's actually doing something now? I guess we have to now..."

Edited July 7, 2009 by KipWellsFan

[kapkomet]

Important global effect too.

 

"Whoa, America's actually doing something now? I guess we have to now..."

You're naive as hell if you think that the Chicomms will just roll over and do things "because America's doing it" - just as an example.

[Balta1701]

You're naive as hell if you think that the Chicomms will just roll over and do things "because America's doing it" - just as an example.

Except for the fact that they're already doing exactly that.

[kapkomet]

Except for the fact that they're already doing exactly that.

Oh, except 100's of coal fired plants that they have going right now. Yea. Ok.

[Balta1701]

Oh, except 100's of coal fired plants that they have going right now. Yea. Ok.

Many of which they're efforting to make more efficient or to replace with clean energy technology. They're investing more money in clean energy than any other country in the world except Germany. A number of those new coal fired power plants they're opening are designed to produce energy more efficiently than the older ones they're replacing. Here is the summary of their current steps that I posted here a few weeks ago. They're quite frankly doing more than we are to clean up, and if we continue to bury our heads in the sand, they're going to beat the Hell out of us.

[NorthSideSox72]

Oh, except 100's of coal fired plants that they have going right now. Yea. Ok.

Its simple economics. China is started to heavily support the manufacture of alternate sources like solar and wind, because they want into the market (why I've been saying we need to move quickly). To support such business, clearly, China will make sure they use a lot of it. So yeah, actually, they will definitely be doing that (though not for any environmental reasons).

 

[Balta1701]

Its simple economics. China is started to heavily support the manufacture of alternate sources like solar and wind, because they want into the market (why I've been saying we need to move quickly). To support such business, clearly, China will make sure they use a lot of it. So yeah, actually, they will definitely be doing that (though not for any environmental reasons).

Cleaning up their cities though will provide them environmental benefits, something they've probably taken in to account.

[NorthSideSox72]

Cleaning up their cities though will provide them environmental benefits, something they've probably taken in to account.

I honestly think that's a side effect to them, a nice bonus, but not a primary or even secondary motivation. They will probably use it to make it LOOK like its a primary motivation, especially to their own people, who are living in cities with pollution and health issues that are staggeringly bad in some cases.

 

[kapkomet]

Go green!

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090707/ap_on_...ens_wind_energy

 

Now if this were so promising, why would he cancel it? He says they got off the blocks too quick, but I call BS on that one, and furthermore, he's seen what's in the Cap and Trade (Tax and Kill) bill. It's all a big redistribution of wealth boondoggle. PERIOD.

 

But it's a "job creator". Uh huh, so how many millions of jobs are we going to kill to create a fraction of the green jobs?