Al Lopez's Ghost Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 I was listening to Boers & Bernstein at 4:30 today, and Boers said that this deal is being discussed by the Angels and Sox: Konerko and Garland for Figgins, Kochman and Shields. FWIW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 I'd hate having any reliever be a big part of a trade, but it gives the Sox quite a few years of service time, improved defense at 1B, and cuts like $20 mill in salary. I don't know how much retooling is happening though, and then would Figgins be the CFer or what? Thankfully there's about a month and a half left until the real offseason actually starts, so there's time for more craziness to come out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 That would be an awful trade. You need to get some younger players, and adding only one of them in a trade for 2 of your biggest players just wouldn't be beneficial. When you take into account the rumored players in the Teixiera trade to the Angels, we should be able to get a better package. There's no doubt in my mind that any trade to the Angels would bring back Ervin Santana. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 If Kenny is serious about competing next year, I don't see why he'd deal one of our best bats and our #2/#3 starter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanOfCorn Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 Four words...Bill Stoneman, won't happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(fathom @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 02:52 PM) That would be an awful trade. You need to get some younger players, and adding only one of them in a trade for 2 of your biggest players just wouldn't be beneficial. When you take into account the rumored players in the Teixiera trade to the Angels, we should be able to get a better package. There's no doubt in my mind that any trade to the Angels would bring back Ervin Santana. Agreed. As written this is an awful trade. It needs at least 1 more high level player coming to us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSoxfan1986 Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 That would be an awful trade. I'm all for dealing Konerko and Garland, but I want guys like Santana, Adenhart, Conger, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RME JICO Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 (edited) The Sox would have to at least get a top level prospect (Wood?) to make it close. If you assume you are letting go a declining Konerko, and Garland who has had one good year in the last 6; while at the same time receiving a leadoff CF who hit .330 this year, a 1B who had a .840 OPS, and a solid Setup man - its not that bad. At the same time you are cutting a ton of locked in salary to use elsewhere. You also just got a lot younger. A Shields-Jenks combo at the end of the game would be sweet. Also, a leadoff hitter with a .393 OBP and 41 SB would be nice to see. It is close, but the Sox would need a high level prospect. Edited October 9, 2007 by RME JICO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Pratt Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(RME JICO @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 05:23 PM) The Sox would have to at least get a top level prospect (Wood?) to make it close. If you assume you are letting go a declining Konerko, and Garland who has had one good year in the last 6; while at the same time receiving a leadoff CF who hit .330 this year, a 1B who had a .840 OPS, and a solid Setup man - its not that bad. At the same time you are cutting a ton of locked in salary to use elsewhere. You also just got a lot younger. A Shields-Jenks combo at the end of the game would be sweet. Also, a leadoff hitter with a .393 OBP and 41 SB would be nice to see. It is close, but the Sox would need a high level prospect. I concur. I'd love it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 (edited) Why's it an awful trade? Kotchman was a better player this year than Konerko and going forward I'd rather have Kotchman. I don't like the other part being (essentially) Garland for Figgins + Shields, but the deal would clear close to $50 million off the books (3*$12 + 1*$12). It's an extremely tempting offer, that's for sure, and not even close to being as awful as some of you are making it out to be. At the very least, this makes me happy to know that Konerko isn't off limits this winter. There's some teams out there who could use a guaranteed 25-35 homer guy (Yankees, Halos, Dodgers) and I'd love to see the Sox 'cash in' a bit. Edited October 9, 2007 by CWSGuy406 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 That deal would have to be a starting point. The plus side is the Sox are washing a lot of payroll, but they also would need to find a way to get a top prospect in that deal (someone like Brandon Wood or Adenhart). I definitely would be a fan of Shields/Kochman/Figgins all becoming members of the Sox as they are all very solid players and most are still very cheap and will be cheap for at least a few more seasons. I'd also be a bigger fan of that deal if it were Santana/Kochman/Figgins/Wood or Adenhart as opposed to Shields (I love Shields, but I'd be more concerned with semi-replacing Santana than I would be adding another reliever). Than the Sox would have 20M in payroll to blow on a CF'er to add some pop to the lineup or a variation of other players. You would also than stick with Uribe for another year and plan on giving Wood more and more playing time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 (edited) This deal would free up a lot of money. It would appear that the Sox would become weaker against LHP though. It would depend on what KW did with the extra money, but I think I would lean toward doing it. Edited October 9, 2007 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatScott82 Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 How about Garland, Crede and Broadway for Figgins, Shields and Santana.. Then you can put Figgins out in LF, still have room to sign Rowand or Hunter and still have Konerko on the team. Not to mention finally having a decent setup man to get to Jenks... I doubt Pauly would be involved with any deal this offseason but you never know... Any Konerko-Garland package better bring back much more than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 05:28 PM) Why's it an awful trade? Kotchman was a better player this year than Konerko and going forward I'd rather have Kotchman. I don't like the other part being (essentially) Garland for Figgins + Shields, but the deal would clear close to $50 million off the books (3*$12 + 1*$12). It's an extremely tempting offer, that's for sure, and not even close to being as awful as some of you are making it out to be. At the very least, this makes me happy to know that Konerko isn't off limits this winter. There's some teams out there who could use a guaranteed 25-35 homer guy (Yankees, Halos, Dodgers) and I'd love to see the Sox 'cash in' a bit. I think if KW trades Paulie, he will only trade him to a place he really wouldn't mind going. The Angels definitely fit that. He has limited no trade protection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(GreatScott82 @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 05:34 PM) How about Garland, Crede and Broadway for Figgins, Shields and Santana.. Then you can put Figgins out in LF, still have room to sign Rowand or Hunter and still have Konerko on the team. Not to mention finally having a decent setup man to get to Jenks... I doubt Pauly would be involved with any deal this offseason but you never know... Any Konerko-Garland package better bring back much more than that. You aren't going to be able to trade Crede until he shows he's healthy. I'm pretty sure if the Angels offered KW the trade you proposed, he would take it in a heartbeat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(GreatScott82 @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 03:34 PM) How about Garland, Crede and Broadway for Figgins, Shields and Santana.. Then you can put Figgins out in LF, still have room to sign Rowand or Hunter and still have Konerko on the team. Not to mention finally having a decent setup man to get to Jenks... I doubt Pauly would be involved with any deal this offseason but you never know... Any Konerko-Garland package better bring back much more than that. No. Add in another top player from the Angels' side and then it's better, but this is just as slanted as the first onje. And it leaves us without a first baseman at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 (edited) Is it also worth pointing out that Shields put up horrendous numbers in the 2nd half? .300 batting average against him, 7.36 ERA. Edited October 9, 2007 by Balta1701 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 05:36 PM) No. Add in another top player from the Angels' side and then it's better, but this is just as slanted as the first onje. And it leaves us without a first baseman at all. Paulie would still be here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 03:38 PM) Paulie would still be here. Oh, gotcha. Ok, that would work better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 05:38 PM) Is it also worth pointing out that Shields put up horrendous numbers in the 2nd half? .300 batting average against him, .736 ERA. He came back at the end. He was having mechanical issues. He would be the second best pitcher in the bullpen by far if KW acquired him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 05:39 PM) Oh, gotcha. Ok, that would work better. I'm thinking it would would a little too much better for the Angels to bite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Pratt Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 05:39 PM) He came back at the end. He was having mechanical issues. He would be the second best pitcher in the bullpen by far if KW acquired him. I absolutely love Scot Shields. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 05:41 PM) I absolutely love Scot Shields. So do I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Oct 9, 2007 -> 03:33 PM) This deal would free up a lot of money. It would appear that the Sox would become weaker against LHP though. It would depend on what KW did with the extra money, but I think I would lean toward doing it. I don't know if thats possible, but you are right as Kochman is a lefty. Hell, did anyone think that after making that move the Sox would have freed up at least 20M in payroll and they would also have just one open position (SS). Could that be a sign of one Alex Rodriguez coming in. You'd have: Figgins - CF Fields - LF Dye - RF Kochman - 1B AJP - C Richar - 2B Arod - SS Crede - 3B Thome - DH Note that the above is not a batting order, just a defensive allotment. You'd also see that the order would be pretty stacked and the only weak hitters would be Richar (and he has some tools to be a good hitter). The only major defensive question would be at SS and Arod was once a gold glove SS. The rotation would not be as good (unless you find a way to get a solid young starter to replace Garland). However, the team would have added speed at every one of those positions (and gotten younger at each position, aside from SS). I'm not saying they would get Arod, but this type of deal would make it a possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 The trade would be a financial boon for the Sox. They'd have their CFer for the next few seasons, unless they wanted to ditch Crede altogether, put Figgins (or Fields) at 3B (with the other in left) and go after one of the FA CFers. If they made this happen, I'd just go with Figgins in center, Fields in left and Crede at third, and would look focus the rest of the winter's efforts on improving at SS. The rotation is going to take a hit if Garland is traded, no doubt, but the team is going to be lacking in some area(s) next year unless Kenny can work miracles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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