RockRaines Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 04:17 PM) Construct a package of White Sox prospects better than what the Tigers gave up and get back to me... Here's how I would rate the two players they gave up were they in our system... Gio DLS Jurrjens Carter Poreda Hernandez Sweeney Eggy Shelby Jurrjens upside is said to be a 3rd starter at best. Its pretty easy, find out spects that top out at third starter potential. Couple that his already balky shoulder in his early 20's and he is not exactly the best spec. He is a good one, ill give you that, but not nearly worth Renteria's production. ATL gave up too much for what they got in return looking at their lineup and what they lost. Now if that extra money allows them to sign someone else, then it wont be such a bad trade. If you like, I can cite actual experts opinions on it as it comes out as well. Maybe that will at least give some better insight than "your ignorance is showing." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 05:16 PM) Was this really necessary? Can we be civil in here please? Stop being such a pussy, you asslicking f***munch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(jackie hayes @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 03:24 PM) Stop being such a pussy, you asslicking f***munch. Whatever, Jurjens stalker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish71 Posted October 29, 2007 Author Share Posted October 29, 2007 by Will Carroll The Tigers didn’t waste any time making the first big Hot Stove deal — assuming you don’t count the Alex Rodriguez opt-out — by trading for Edgar Renteria. The Braves receive Jair Jurrjens and Gorkys Hernandez in return. I checked with BP prospect guru Kevin Goldstein who said, “Jurrjens is just 21 years old and has already proven the ability to hold his own in the big leagues. The Curacao native isn’t especially big or projectable, but what he is now is pretty darn good, as he throws a low 90s fastball, decent slider, and deceptive changeup. Scouts do wonder is he has a big league out pitch and see him as more of a No. 4 starter type – a role the Braves could use him in immediately. “Hernandez hit .293/.344/.391 in the Midwest League this year for his full-season debut while also leading the Midwest League with 54 stolen bases. He’s an absolutely burner on the base paths, and also a spectacular center fielder with a plus arm. Despite the numbers, he’s still more tools than performance. He needs to either hone his approach to develop into a leadoff man, or develop more power (the bat speed is there) to become a dynamic power/speed combo. Very high upside, but obviously some risk. He’ll likely begin next year at High A Myrtle Beach. Both players were going to be slam dunk top five prospects on the upcoming Detroit prospect rankings.” Frank Wren’s first deal as Braves GM was made with his former boss in Florida, Dave Dombrowski, though sources tell me that this deal began with John Schuerholz and was discussed as far back as the trading deadline. The deal’s timing may have been a surprise, but off-loading Renteria and his $9m contract (plus $11m option for 2009) is one many had anticipated. The move solidifies the Tigers middle infield after moving Carlos Guillen to first and quickly shuts off the bubbling rumors of Alex Rodriguez to Detroit. For the Braves, this opens up a spot for Yunel Escobar, though Brent Lillibridge is still blocked unless a move to CF is made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 05:25 PM) Whatever, Jurjens stalker. Now, what the hell was I supposed to do when my favorite site, "Jeff Weaver's Mom", hasn't been updated in years? As Sarah Silverman says, When God gives you AIDS, make lemonAIDS... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 04:25 PM) Whatever, Jurjens stalker. damn Bucktown hipster Edited October 29, 2007 by RockRaines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(RockRaines @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 04:22 PM) Jurrjens upside is said to be a 3rd starter at best. Its pretty easy, find out spects that top out at third starter potential. Couple that his already balky shoulder in his early 20's and he is not exactly the best spec. He is a good one, ill give you that, but not nearly worth Renteria's production. ATL gave up too much for what they got in return looking at their lineup and what they lost. Now if that extra money allows them to sign someone else, then it wont be such a bad trade. If you like, I can cite actual experts opinions on it as it comes out as well. Maybe that will at least give some better insight than "your ignorance is showing." Maybe you stopped reading after the first line. I explained how those prospects were better than almost all of our system. Insight isn't just a bowl game. ATL gave up Marte for two years of Renteria and two very good prospects... Sounds like they didn't get raped to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 04:30 PM) Maybe you stopped reading after the first line. I explained how those prospects were better than almost all of our system. Insight isn't just a bowl game. ATL gave up Marte for two years of Renteria and two very good prospects... Sounds like they didn't get raped to me. Great. Our system is garbage, what kind of comparison is that? They didnt get equal value for what they gave up, is that an ok analogy for you? If it accompanies other moves, then it may even out which it looks like was their focus from the get go. From a standpoint of player for player, they got the short end of the stick based on Edgar's production this season. Of course if he reverts back to AL Edgar and JJ can be a productive 3rd of 4th starter this season, then they make look like geniuses. I dont put much stock in this kid staying healthy however. And I dont need the snide remarks every time you respond to my posts. Its just not necessary and is quite juvenile. Edited October 29, 2007 by RockRaines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerbaho-WG Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(RockRaines @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 04:12 PM) Really? A young unproven pitcher with a bad rotator cuff and a 3rd starter upside and a "toolsy" Of'er for a proven MLB SS who had a great year isnt getting raped? They certainly didnt win the deal. He's 32, on the downside of his career, and had an outlier year in the weakest league in baseball. This was a stupid trade by the Tigers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 The Braves were BADLY in need of some pitching. Getting a solid, if unspectacular pitcher, with Escobar taking over at ss, could be a big improvement overall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 (edited) QUOTE(jackie hayes @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 02:37 PM) The Braves were BADLY in need of some pitching. Getting a solid, if unspectacular pitcher, with Escobar taking over at ss, could be a big improvement overall. And...saving a lot of money that could be spent in other places (resigning Tex?), and getting an OF that could in a couple years take over the hole being left by Jones....that's not a bad formula. Between Jones walking and Renteria traded...the Braves have freed up at least $20 million in salary compared to 07, depending on what exactly happens with all the money Boston sent over with Renteria. Edited October 29, 2007 by Balta1701 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(29andPoplar @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 01:48 PM) The Braves site says Renteria is due to become a free agent after this coming season (2008). If that is true, Detroit is giving up two talented young players for a rental. The CF prospect is extremely highly regarded. What this speaks to, as much as anything, is the Tigers drafting. They take CF prospects just about every year, just as the Phillies do. Speedy 4/5 tool CF prospects can net just about anything you want in trade. They still have Maybin so this kid was a tradeable asset. Not to be a downer but meanwhile the White Sox sit with Brian Anderson, who might fetch a middle relief prospect at best. All we can do is hope the new scouting direction will give the White Sox more results. It also speaks to Atlanta's scouting and development because I believe they've got someone ready to step in. The Braves have multiple guys ready step in at SS. In fact they have already gotten pretty good production out of at least one of thoes guys (Yunel Escobar) down the stretch last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(fathom @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 01:55 PM) It would have to be a damn good prospect, and unfortunately, we only have two of those. Like what I said about Garland, you can't trade DLS or Gio for a one year contract. Carter is considered a damn good prospect, so there is at least 3 in the Sox system. Poreda (who is untradeable right now as he was drafted this past year) is also very highly thought of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackie hayes Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 05:50 PM) And...saving a lot of money that could be spent in other places (resigning Tex?), and getting an OF that could in a couple years take over the hole being left by Jones....that's not a bad formula. Between Jones walking and Renteria traded...the Braves have freed up at least $20 million in salary compared to 07, depending on what exactly happens with all the money Boston sent over with Renteria. That's true, I wasn't even thinking about Teixeira. I'd still be surprised if he cut an extension, though. Boras loves the free market even more than anyone at Cato or Heritage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 Braves wanted ER gone all year long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg The Bull Luzinski Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 I wonder if the Braves just plucked another John Smoltz out of the Tigers organization. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 04:50 PM) And...saving a lot of money that could be spent in other places (resigning Tex?), and getting an OF that could in a couple years take over the hole being left by Jones....that's not a bad formula. Between Jones walking and Renteria traded...the Braves have freed up at least $20 million in salary compared to 07, depending on what exactly happens with all the money Boston sent over with Renteria. Thats what this could hinge on, what they do with the money saved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted October 29, 2007 Share Posted October 29, 2007 The overreaction here is hilarious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klaus kinski Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Point is-they gave up NOTHING to strengthen them significantly. WE will trade Garland an established starting pitcher, and get less. Thats the faith I have in Williams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 QUOTE(klaus kinski @ Oct 30, 2007 -> 12:27 AM) Point is-they gave up NOTHING to strengthen them significantly. WE will trade Garland an established starting pitcher, and get less. Thats the faith I have in Williams Very similar to their Sheffield trade last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 QUOTE(klaus kinski @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 06:27 PM) Point is-they gave up NOTHING to strengthen them significantly. WE will trade Garland an established starting pitcher, and get less. Thats the faith I have in Williams Nothing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klaus kinski Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 07:36 PM) Nothing? Yeah as of now-nothing-from an 88 win team already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Point is-they gave up NOTHING to strengthen them significantly. WE will trade Garland an established starting pitcher, and get less. Thats the faith I have in Williams ....and yet if the Sox gave up those "NOTHING" prospects, 90% of the people who never seen them pitch would be b****ing about a career NL hitter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Yeah as of now-nothing-from an 88 win team already. Well if that's the case, I guess the Sox gave up NOTHING for Javy Vazquez while significantly improving their 99 win team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Oct 29, 2007 -> 06:03 PM) I wonder if the Braves just plucked another John Smoltz out of the Tigers organization. It looks to me like they just sent Doyle Alexander to Detroit... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.