OFFICIAL: Sox Sign Linebrink - 4 yrs, 19 mil

[SoxFan562004]

http://www.baseball-reference.com/l/linebsc01.shtml

 

good career numbers and he pitched better with MIL in the 2nd half last year in a hitter friendly ball-park.

 

The bullpen was a complete disaster last year outside of Jenks. KW signed a quality reliver, for in this market, a reasonable contract. I think it's a good move.

[bigruss]

Bye Scotty...Hello Scotty!

 

In terms of that trade of players there we won!

plus that only cost us what? an extra 1.75 mill?

 

I like the signing in that linebrink is one of the best reliever on the market, hopefully improving our dismal bullpen. Now I think with one more addition our bullpen has the ability to really be good, and hopefully we sign or trade for another dependable starter who is under the radar to help these guys out too.

 

[SkokieSox]

This site is hilarious. The majority of the posts are people b****ing when other teams sign people at prices and years we don't want, and then more b****ing when we sign the #1 free agent reliever that isn't a closer. Its impossible to make a realistic move that will be seen as a good one. Everyone lives in fantasy land.

 

So true... In actuality, he probably could have gotten more elsewhere.

[gosox41]

http://www.baseball-reference.com/l/linebsc01.shtml

 

good career numbers and he pitched better with MIL in the 2nd half last year in a hitter friendly ball-park.

 

The bullpen was a complete disaster last year outside of Jenks. KW signed a quality reliver, for in this market, a reasonable contract. I think it's a good move.

 

 

I don't like it. This move was made basically because of the poor state of the Sox farm system. Linebrink has been good, but I believe in the theory that middle relievers are usually hit or miss any given year. $5 mill per year (roughly) for 5 years is crazy. If the Sox had built any sort of farm system the last 7 years under KW, then this signing wouldn't have been necessary.

 

While I think he will be decewnt for a year or 2, I don't think he will be the reliver he was for San Diego.

 

But again, this is what happens when a team can't produce a middle reliever in a farm system. And the team right now has enough holes that the $5 mill per year could have been used elsewhere to help fill one of those, but that's only if we had a farm system.

 

 

 

Bob

[max power]

I don't like it. This move was made basically because of the poor state of the Sox farm system. Linebrink has been good, but I believe in the theory that middle relievers are usually hit or miss any given year. $5 mill per year (roughly) for 5 years is crazy. If the Sox had built any sort of farm system the last 7 years under KW, then this signing wouldn't have been necessary.

 

While I think he will be decewnt for a year or 2, I don't think he will be the reliver he was for San Diego.

 

But again, this is what happens when a team can't produce a middle reliever in a farm system. And the team right now has enough holes that the $5 mill per year could have been used elsewhere to help fill one of those, but that's only if we had a farm system.

Bob

Yeah but that is all 20/20 hindsight bulls***. The fact that we didn't produce a middle reliever isn't the issue because we can't go back in time and make one magically appear. We had to sign one and address the past mistake or not sign one at all. Those were the present options a day ago.

[max power]

He should still be accountable for not producing a middle reliever. I'm just saying, it shouldn't be considered when evaluating this deal.

[gosox41]

Yeah but that is all 20/20 hindsight bulls***. The fact that we didn't produce a middle reliever isn't the issue because we can't go back in time and make one magically appear. We had to sign one and address the past mistake or not sign one at all. Those were the present options a day ago.

 

 

Well for starters, I've been bringing up the lack of Sox farm system for years. I'm sure you'll see some repsonses from them here. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out a good farm system helps fill in holes.

 

While I haven't been positng here until recently, I've been at other boards saying the same think and the minor league "experts' have criticized me for it.

 

So, you're right. What's done is done. But the key is for Sox management to learn from their 7 years of mistakes and help prevent this from happening again. The reality is the reason the team has so many holes and was forced into bringing a guy like Dye back is becuase they had nothing in the minors that was major league ready to step in. same thing with Linebrink. A good reliever, but not a top tiered one.

 

So all the years of neglect of the farm system is an issue. And while we can't go back and change it, the Sox damn well better learn something so we're not forced into these corners again. Remember this team still needs a SP, another reliever and 2 OFer's.

 

Oh year, they're also almost maxed out their payroll and are coming off an embarassing 90 loss system.

 

Maybe I haven't been to far off base the last 5-6 years in my critique of KW and his farm system. Or maybe I'[m just sick of just watching the Sox invest money in guys that any good farm system can easily produce.

 

I hope KW has a good plan to fll the rest of these holes, because if this team finishes under .500 with a $100 mill payroll a second year in a row, I'd expect a lot of pissed off people around here.

 

Bob

[Gene Honda Civic]

http://www.baseball-reference.com/l/linebsc01.shtml

 

good career numbers and he pitched better with MIL in the 2nd half last year in a hitter friendly ball-park.

No he didn't. His WHIP was 1.5 in MIL

[max power]

I expect a lot of more pissed off people at their owners meetings.

[max power]

No he didn't. His WHIP was 1.5 in MIL

Either way, its 25 innings. We are going to have to wait and see how the park plays out in his numbers.

Edited November 22, 2007 by max power

[SoxFan562004]

No he didn't. His WHIP was 1.5 in MIL

lower ERA and higher ERA+, 20 points higher in ERA+. Still pitched well IMO

Edited November 22, 2007 by SoxFan562004

[Gene Honda Civic]

lower ERA and higher ERA+, 20 points higher in ERA+. Still pitched well IMO

Who uses ERA to evaluate a relief pitcher?

[SoxFan562004]

Who uses ERA to evaluate a relief pitcher?

true, but I like the ERA+ number to evalute pitchers. Whatever, you're right!

[Dick Allen]

The only source for this signing is Levine right now. Even on the various websites where it is posted they say according to ESPN1000.

[max power]

The only source for this signing is Levine right now. Even on the various websites where it is posted they say according to ESPN1000.

This is true. Heh, would be funny if it weren't true. I bet all the people who are pissed off would switch to "WTF Kenny?!?! Can't you get a deal done!?!"

Edited November 22, 2007 by max power

[caulfield12]

Well for starters, I've been bringing up the lack of Sox farm system for years. I'm sure you'll see some repsonses from them here. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out a good farm system helps fill in holes.

 

While I haven't been positng here until recently, I've been at other boards saying the same think and the minor league "experts' have criticized me for it.

 

So, you're right. What's done is done. But the key is for Sox management to learn from their 7 years of mistakes and help prevent this from happening again. The reality is the reason the team has so many holes and was forced into bringing a guy like Dye back is becuase they had nothing in the minors that was major league ready to step in. same thing with Linebrink. A good reliever, but not a top tiered one.

 

So all the years of neglect of the farm system is an issue. And while we can't go back and change it, the Sox damn well better learn something so we're not forced into these corners again. Remember this team still needs a SP, another reliever and 2 OFer's.

 

Oh year, they're also almost maxed out their payroll and are coming off an embarassing 90 loss system.

 

Maybe I haven't been to far off base the last 5-6 years in my critique of KW and his farm system. Or maybe I'[m just sick of just watching the Sox invest money in guys that any good farm system can easily produce.

 

I hope KW has a good plan to fll the rest of these holes, because if this team finishes under .500 with a $100 mill payroll a second year in a row, I'd expect a lot of pissed off people around here.

 

Bob

 

 

Well, there's about 15 MLB organizations that haven't won a World Series in the last 20+ years that would beg to differ on that analysis.

 

The White Sox fans have been systematically conditioned for so long that we don't feel we deserve a $100 million payroll...or maybe it's because we won in it all with a much lower one.

 

When I heard about the Torii Hunter years and total money, I knew that the money was going to start flying even more crazily than last year...let's face it baseball is flush with cash, it's almost on par with the NFL in terms of profitability. How else can you explain Torii Hunter and Gary Matthews, Jr., making almost $150 million between them?

 

There have been 7 years of mistakes, but the successes like Crede and Buehrle and Rowand...and the smart acquisitions going into 2005, that's what did it for us. If you think about it, Durham/Ordonez/Caballo had already been jettisoned for basically NOTHING substantial in return...w/ the exception of Pods in 2005.

 

Yes, you can look at guys like Sweeney, Anderson and Valido and say if two of those three guys were ready...or if Joe Borchard ever became what he was supposed to be, we wouldn't have needed Thome so badly from the LH side, and then we'd still have Rowand, etc. If we had Rowand, then we would have traded away Anderson and a certain D-Backs CFer (Chris B. Young) who's more overhyped than Eric Davis around some parts.

 

When you look at things realistically, Young and McCarthy are still the only two players out there that most fans would like back from our farm system....at least 50% would take them back, I would think, if not more.

 

Dye is not an easily-replaced player. Or Buehrle. Maybe even Konerko. Even if Sweeney hit .280 with 15 homers and 80 RBI's, it wouldn't come close to approximating what JD did in 2005 and 2006. There aren't many organizations that haven't bottomed out that are consistently producing young All-Stars every season.

 

Linebrink was one of, if not THE best, set-up man in baseball over the past five years...not the last couple, but as a composite, at least in the Top 5.

 

After the LH reliever debacle in 2006, Jeff Nelson, seeing Hermanson try to come back, Politte, Cotts, Marte, the likes of Sean Tracey and Agustin Montero and EVERYTHING we suffered through last year...to do nothing BUT HOPE? C'mon, who wouldn't be out there trying to crucify KW for that blunder 3 years in a row?

 

A name that doesn't come up, something that went unnoticed relatively....David Riske. Many claim he's one of the most underrated relievers in the game, and he certainly could have helped settle things down last year. But I still don't think a bullpen of Riske, Luis Vizcaino and El Duque would have got the White Sox to 81 wins the way the offense collapsed last year. MAYBE. But we still wouldn't have been close to the playoffs.

 

 

 

 

[elrockinMT]

I think the Linebrink deal shouldn't have been that big of a surprise. There isn't a lot out there on the FA market this year as far as relievers are concerned. I heard of the Sox interests in Scott earlier. Moves have to be made to shore up the pen so I am glad we did something. Question now is do we stay with pitchers we have now in the pen, go with our rookies or sign/trade for one more reliever? Vizcaino, Gange???

Edited November 22, 2007 by elrockinMT

[iamshack]

Funny caption under Linebrink's picture on whitesox.com.

 

"In his eight-year career, Scott Linebrink has converted four saves in 30 opportunities."

 

Way to spin it for the Sox fans, intern!

[RME JICO]

Funny caption under Linebrink's picture on whitesox.com.

 

"In his eight-year career, Scott Linebrink has converted four saves in 30 opportunities."

 

Way to spin it for the Sox fans, intern!

I thought that was funny as well. Is that supposed to be a positive comment?

[WHITESOXRANDY]

I think it sounds better than "he s*** his pants in 26 out of 30 opportunities to do so".

[iamshack]

I think it sounds better than "he s*** his pants in 26 out of 30 opportunities to do so".

 

We didn't sign him to close for us. Why not list his career era or something? It's not like there aren't multiple ways to spin his numbers, despite their downward trending.

[Gene Honda Civic]

Does anyone even know what a save opportunity is? I'll give you a hint, you don't have to be a closer or pitch in the 9th inning to pitch in a Save Opp.

[gosox41]

Well, there's about 15 MLB organizations that haven't won a World Series in the last 20+ years that would beg to differ on that analysis.

 

The White Sox fans have been systematically conditioned for so long that we don't feel we deserve a $100 million payroll...or maybe it's because we won in it all with a much lower one.

 

When I heard about the Torii Hunter years and total money, I knew that the money was going to start flying even more crazily than last year...let's face it baseball is flush with cash, it's almost on par with the NFL in terms of profitability. How else can you explain Torii Hunter and Gary Matthews, Jr., making almost $150 million between them?

 

There have been 7 years of mistakes, but the successes like Crede and Buehrle and Rowand...and the smart acquisitions going into 2005, that's what did it for us. If you think about it, Durham/Ordonez/Caballo had already been jettisoned for basically NOTHING substantial in return...w/ the exception of Pods in 2005.

 

Yes, you can look at guys like Sweeney, Anderson and Valido and say if two of those three guys were ready...or if Joe Borchard ever became what he was supposed to be, we wouldn't have needed Thome so badly from the LH side, and then we'd still have Rowand, etc. If we had Rowand, then we would have traded away Anderson and a certain D-Backs CFer (Chris B. Young) who's more overhyped than Eric Davis around some parts.

 

When you look at things realistically, Young and McCarthy are still the only two players out there that most fans would like back from our farm system....at least 50% would take them back, I would think, if not more.

 

Dye is not an easily-replaced player. Or Buehrle. Maybe even Konerko. Even if Sweeney hit .280 with 15 homers and 80 RBI's, it wouldn't come close to approximating what JD did in 2005 and 2006. There aren't many organizations that haven't bottomed out that are consistently producing young All-Stars every season.

 

Linebrink was one of, if not THE best, set-up man in baseball over the past five years...not the last couple, but as a composite, at least in the Top 5.

 

After the LH reliever debacle in 2006, Jeff Nelson, seeing Hermanson try to come back, Politte, Cotts, Marte, the likes of Sean Tracey and Agustin Montero and EVERYTHING we suffered through last year...to do nothing BUT HOPE? C'mon, who wouldn't be out there trying to crucify KW for that blunder 3 years in a row?

 

A name that doesn't come up, something that went unnoticed relatively....David Riske. Many claim he's one of the most underrated relievers in the game, and he certainly could have helped settle things down last year. But I still don't think a bullpen of Riske, Luis Vizcaino and El Duque would have got the White Sox to 81 wins the way the offense collapsed last year. MAYBE. But we still wouldn't have been close to the playoffs.

 

I think the team deserves a $100 mill + payroll. But I do think there is a problem if they finish under .500 2 years in a row with that high of a payroll. It's inexcuseable. The issue isn't the money then, it's the GM.

 

As for Crede, Buehrle, etc all those guys have one thing in common, they all came in under the Schueler era. I'm not asking for All Stars every year, but how about productive players. If Sweeneyc ould hit .280 with 15 HR's, I'd take it based on how our OF is now. I would like to invest Dye's money in more starting pitching.

 

 

 

Bob

[scenario]

We didn't sign him to close for us. Why not list his career era or something? It's not like there aren't multiple ways to spin his numbers, despite their downward trending.

The intern is probably a closet Tribe fan... or Cub fan.

[Balta1701]

Does anyone even know what a save opportunity is? I'll give you a hint, you don't have to be a closer or pitch in the 9th inning to pitch in a Save Opp.

It certainly is kinda wierd how if you blow a hold, it counts as a blown save, so you wind up with every middle relief guy in the league putting up numbers like that.