Crede close to going to Brewers

[Vance Law]

Every time I read comments like this about Crede, I think Maggs, who signed a top 10 contract after a surgery that was considered experimental in the US. Crede does have value and if Scott Boras was our GM, we could get a ton for him.

 

There was an escape-hatch clause where the Tigers could void Maggs contract after the first season if he spent 25 days on the DL with the same knee problem. Maggs was also a much better hitter/star/coveted player. And everyone can find room for one more outfielder with that upside. There are few teams whose 3rd baseman is bad enough to be worth the gamble, and worth giving us anything of value. Where could he possibly go? Brewers, Phillies, Giants. Anywhere else?

[Chombi]

yeah, everyone blasted the tigers for the contract, and to their credit it worked out....but dont forget maggs contract takes a huge hit if he gets injured...something other teams won't have in line for crede....also crede isn't half the hitter maggs was before the injury...i mean i hope you are right, i really hope we can get a guy like capuano for him or more but imo i just dont see it happening

 

That is dead on about them not being comparable. I typed that all up in my long posts but deleted it once I reread your post and noticed I misread it.

 

I will disagree with you on Capuano. He is shaky man. I don't want any part of that.

[Marky Mark]

Capuano vs Floyd?

 

Cappy any day. Just consider him your 5th starter and you'll feel better.

[DBAHO]

With KW making the decision that Fields won't play LF during winter ball, and that his future is only at 3b, it's really disappointing that KW didn't have a better plan for Crede. At this point, we'd be better off to let Crede play 3b, and put Fields in LF.

Where would Quentin play under that scenario?

[fathom]

Where would Quentin play under that scenario?

 

You wouldn't have made that trade....I like Quentin, but it's amazing the expectations people have for him right now.

[Chombi]

I'd rather take the gamble on Floyd. In my eyes he is an easy fix but obviously it can't be the case since it's not happening. I just think he needs to hide the ball more and "reach into the backpocket" as my Dad would say when he throws. Right now he is doing like a bad Keith Foulke impersination and he gets bombed for it.

 

Now to the reason I was posting.

 

All this trade talk for Crede should slow down. He isn't the best 3rd baseman on the market so I'd wait to see how things shake out. Inge and Rolen are ahead of him. Key player there is Rolen in my eyes.

 

We should let Rolen be dealt and go after the Cards. They are looking for a replacement. How about Missouri hero Joe Crede. Every Card fan I know loves him so I'd assume it's shared in the Front office but maybe not.

 

Anyways, they are looking to deal Ankiel or Duncan and even Edmonds. Edmonds doesnt solve our age or future problem but I wouldn't mind throwing him out in CF as a last resort. Actually f*** it. I don't want Edmonds but Ankiel I wouldn't mind.

[RockRaines]

You wouldn't have made that trade....I like Quentin, but it's amazing the expectations people have for him right now.

its not just us, several analysts have said he may out produce Torii Hunter

[greg775]

Our team is snakebit.

If we trade Crede, Josh will turn out to be a sieve at third base.

If we keep Crede and trade Josh, Josh will turn into a 40 homer guy

every year.

 

That said ... why not keep Crede?

 

p.s. Rowand is going to help the Royals big time.

 

[DBAHO]

You wouldn't have made that trade....I like Quentin, but it's amazing the expectations people have for him right now.

Well with the way Fields handled LF in the last 20 games or so, I can see why the Sox may have been a bit apprehensive about giving the LF spot, especially after the debacle that was Scott Podsednik defensively.

 

Quentin is a pretty damn good defender, and too good for LF really.

[fathom]

Well with the way Fields handled LF in the last 20 games or so, I can see why the Sox may have been a bit apprehensive about giving the LF spot, especially after the debacle that was Scott Podsednik defensively.

 

Quentin is a pretty damn good defender, and too good for LF really.

 

Yep, and it's inexcusable that Dye's not getting shifted to LF.

[southsideirish71]

Our team is snakebit.

If we trade Crede, Josh will turn out to be a sieve at third base.

If we keep Crede and trade Josh, Josh will turn into a 40 homer guy

every year.

 

That said ... why not keep Crede?

 

p.s. Rowand is going to help the Royals big time.

 

Because his agent is boras and he wants to go to FA. He will not next us anything in draft picks when he leaves.

 

 

[fathom]

Our team is snakebit.

If we trade Crede, Josh will turn out to be a sieve at third base.

If we keep Crede and trade Josh, Josh will turn into a 40 homer guy

every year.

 

That said ... why not keep Crede?

 

p.s. Rowand is going to help the Royals big time.

 

I have no respect for Rowand if he goes to the Royals just because they would give him another year on a contract.

[greg775]

I have no respect for Rowand if he goes to the Royals just because they would give him another year on a contract.

 

That would be disappointing. But he is just what they need.

Instead of hacks like Reggie Sanders and Dee Brown, Rowand would be progress in KC.

[Chombi]

I have no respect for Rowand if he goes to the Royals just because they would give him another year on a contract.

 

Where is this Rowand/Royals rumor coming from.

 

I can't find a link or anything but I guess I didn't really dig through this long thread either.

 

i say let him go. Odds are it is the same move on his part that the Marlins used on the Tigers today. Only both will backfire on us.

 

Rowand is not worth the signing. Please do not lock up 12-15 mil a year in this guy. There are much better ways to waste money and lose. I swear there are. Let's move on already. He was great for us, let it go. 05 is gone and 07 will never occur for him again.

[greg775]

Chombi, I don't know where the Rowand/Royals thing was, but I read it somewhere.

It said KC is offering an extra year; one of the Chicago papers.

 

I don't understand why you don't want Rowand.

We'd have the new guy in lf or Owens, Rowand in center and Dye in right.

Josh at third, new guy at ss, Richar at 2B and Paulie at first.

Thome at DH and AJ at catcher. Not a bad lineup.

If Dye, Paulie and Thome aren't finished, they along with Fields and Rowand

make a pretty good fivesome in the order with AJ (against righties).

We could use a decent righthanded hitting backup catcher.

But our lineup would be pretty potent on paper if we add Rowand.

[Bubba Philips]

Chombi, I don't know where the Rowand/Royals thing was, but I read it somewhere.

It said KC is offering an extra year; one of the Chicago papers.

 

I don't understand why you don't want Rowand.

We'd have the new guy in lf or Owens, Rowand in center and Dye in right.

Josh at third, new guy at ss, Richar at 2B and Paulie at first.

Thome at DH and AJ at catcher. Not a bad lineup.

If Dye, Paulie and Thome aren't finished, they along with Fields and Rowand

make a pretty good fivesome in the order with AJ (against righties).

We could use a decent righthanded hitting backup catcher.

But our lineup would be pretty potent on paper if we add Rowand.

I am not a Rowand fan I believe his numbers would drop upon returning to the Al. Someone mentioned it before keep a healthy Crede a bargain at 5 million Fields who will be cheap trade Konerko and pay good money for Anduw Jones or a quality center fielder with money to spare........Thought of losing Paulie get over it I was devastated when they trade Aparicio. That is baseball...............

 

[Jeremy]

You wouldn't have made that trade....I like Quentin, but it's amazing the expectations people have for him right now.

 

Defense is certainly a factor too but I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Quentin outhit Crede next season. I don't think that's a product of high expectations for Quentin so much as it is the realization that Crede's a career .259/.305/.446 hitter. Quentin has struggled in the big leagues and his career MLB numers are more or less as good at .230/.316/.425.

[Chombi]

Chombi, I don't know where the Rowand/Royals thing was, but I read it somewhere.

It said KC is offering an extra year; one of the Chicago papers.

 

I don't understand why you don't want Rowand.

We'd have the new guy in lf or Owens, Rowand in center and Dye in right.

Josh at third, new guy at ss, Richar at 2B and Paulie at first.

Thome at DH and AJ at catcher. Not a bad lineup.

If Dye, Paulie and Thome aren't finished, they along with Fields and Rowand

make a pretty good fivesome in the order with AJ (against righties).

We could use a decent righthanded hitting backup catcher.

But our lineup would be pretty potent on paper if we add Rowand.

 

Rowand is overrated. Especially in this city because we love him.

 

Last year was his career year. It was better then I believe 03 or 04'. One of those he hit like 24 homers and I thought he was breaking out but then he came down to earth the next year.

 

It's no mystery that plenty guys have career years in contract years. It's a bad theory but it does have some substance to it. HeIt'll be tough and I doubt he'll come close to it again. He should settle in around a statline of .270 .340 obp clip 18 hrs 75 knocked in...Is that what you want to pay for? Is that going to save this team and make them challenge the Tigers offensively?

 

Basically we are going backwards. He was here before and it was great. Bringing him in as our marquee move hardly makes us contenders. Actually, without other moves...It doesn't.

 

Potent lineup on paper? I can't see why his bat would make this team that much better? He doesn't do enough.

 

I'd much rather play a cheaper Owens in cf and see how it goes. If it doesn't work, there'll be new guys next year available who will prolly be just as overrated we can sign. Rowand will cost us 4-5 years and 50-75 mil lets say which is about 11-14.5 more then Owens or Sweeney.

 

In four years, when this team has finished last 2 times and 3rd or fourth another, how do we deal him? He has had minimal value before. Remember we got an injured Thome who was blocking Ryan Howard. They were very happy to pull the trigger.

 

Now he is 34-35 and beaten up, his bat has most likely declined from its usual mediocre level and his defense is now average. Yet we are still paying him 12-15 mil a year.

 

In the meantime, over those seasons he is here, we still haven't won or really competed...because we wont. We are no where near the level of the Tigers or Indians. Behind the Twins. We are a few levels down with the Royals.

 

Nothing on this team say we can compete anymore. I have been saying it all year. I wanted a firesale before the season started in fear of something like this. Did I expect it to be this bad? No. But I have that personality where if I am not playing to win, I don't play.

 

We aren't playing to win. We are playing to field a decent team who has star power and can attract fans. Rowand is a PR move and a bad one. His contract will kill this team and force other players to be dealt instead if a firesale isnt the path we choose.

 

We are so desperate for hope right now that Aaron Rowand sounds like our savior. Name any other team who would think that about him? There is none. If he was that special, Philly would've kept him. That OF isn't that good.

 

I hope I covered everything. It's lengthy but I think I got most of my opinions out that you asked for.

[Linnwood]

For what it is worth, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel's Brewers Blog also says that the Brewers are looking at Crede.

[witesoxfan]

If the Brewers would give you Hall for Joe Crede, when Hall himself might be a better bet at 3B next year, Doug Melvin will have really, really fallen off the deep end.

[joeynach]

Rowand is overrated. Especially in this city because we love him.

 

Last year was his career year. It was better then I believe 03 or 04'. One of those he hit like 24 homers and I thought he was breaking out but then he came down to earth the next year.

 

It's no mystery that plenty guys have career years in contract years. It's a bad theory but it does have some substance to it. HeIt'll be tough and I doubt he'll come close to it again. He should settle in around a statline of .270 .340 obp clip 18 hrs 75 knocked in...Is that what you want to pay for? Is that going to save this team and make them challenge the Tigers offensively?

 

Basically we are going backwards. He was here before and it was great. Bringing him in as our marquee move hardly makes us contenders. Actually, without other moves...It doesn't.

 

Potent lineup on paper? I can't see why his bat would make this team that much better? He doesn't do enough.

 

I'd much rather play a cheaper Owens in cf and see how it goes. If it doesn't work, there'll be new guys next year available who will prolly be just as overrated we can sign. Rowand will cost us 4-5 years and 50-75 mil lets say which is about 11-14.5 more then Owens or Sweeney.

 

In four years, when this team has finished last 2 times and 3rd or fourth another, how do we deal him? He has had minimal value before. Remember we got an injured Thome who was blocking Ryan Howard. They were very happy to pull the trigger.

 

Now he is 34-35 and beaten up, his bat has most likely declined from its usual mediocre level and his defense is now average. Yet we are still paying him 12-15 mil a year.

 

In the meantime, over those seasons he is here, we still haven't won or really competed...because we wont. We are no where near the level of the Tigers or Indians. Behind the Twins. We are a few levels down with the Royals.

 

Nothing on this team say we can compete anymore. I have been saying it all year. I wanted a firesale before the season started in fear of something like this. Did I expect it to be this bad? No. But I have that personality where if I am not playing to win, I don't play.

 

We aren't playing to win. We are playing to field a decent team who has star power and can attract fans. Rowand is a PR move and a bad one. His contract will kill this team and force other players to be dealt instead if a firesale isnt the path we choose.

 

We are so desperate for hope right now that Aaron Rowand sounds like our savior. Name any other team who would think that about him? There is none. If he was that special, Philly would've kept him. That OF isn't that good.

 

I hope I covered everything. It's lengthy but I think I got most of my opinions out that you asked for.

 

I agree with most of what you say. We all know what Rowand is, he might be a solid OF, but hes no savior. In reality you should expect .270/20/75. Thats it, average to above average. The problem is anyone the sox bring in to fill holes is going to be the same result, short of getting the bigtime guys like a Cabrera, Arod, Santana, etc. The tigers and indians are stacked and posted for 95+ wins, the sox are tying to get more competitive from their 72 win showing last year. It doesn't matter what we do short of acquring 3 future HOF'ers. Nothing is going to change in 2008, in terms of winning a championship. Sure the team might win 80-85 games now against some of the best teams in AL, but it wont translate into real winning. What it will do is allow the team to create the necessary revenue streams. In this market and in this city, this firesale we all talk about probably just wont happen. The marlins/KC model just wont fly in a city and market like this...period, so get used to. This is a business too and revenue streams are important to everything about this team from payroll to media exposure. That being said if we did sign Rowand or anyone else it is a PR stunt its meant to implent a feeling of solidity on this team which had anything but from last year. We do need a competitive team to just survive in this city and take advantage of everything it has to offer. Just by landscape of trades and FA we just aren't going to find anything now or in the near future, barring a miracle, that is going to make this team compete with the likes of CLE, DET, NYY, and BOS.

 

[spiderman]

really? i think the yankees red sox and dodgers have managed to do it pretty effectively over the last 4 years....

 

Absolutely - unless you have a ton of money to throw around which the White Sox do not do.

 

[G&T]

The Angels and Dodgers have both inquired about Rolen, according to Rosenthal, which leads me to believe that Crede must be in that mix as well.

[harfman77]

I still think you hold on to Crede and Fields and move whichever of Thome or Konerko that you can and shift Fields to 1B. Then you can deal Crede in the summer after he has an opportunity to establish himself.

Edited December 5, 2007 by IowaSoxFan

[kwolf68]

I still think you hold on to Crede and Fields and move whichever of Thome or Konerko that you can and shift Fields to 1B. Then you can deal Crede in the summer after he has an opportunity to establish himself.

 

I actually think this is a pretty good idea. Crede's value will never be lower than right now. Fields probably would make a good first baseman, in time better than PK and moving Josh to first softens the blow of dealing a potential future first baseman in Carter. Thome has a rigid NTC however, so moving him would be tough (and the one team he'd wave for-Cleveland-we'd probably have difficulty getting a deal done with). Paulie probably is the most valuable on the market right now from our perspective.