Honel Released

[bigruss]

Chicago White Sox

Released: RHP Kris Honel

Reinstated from inactive list: RHP Kris Honel

 

Another high-profile high school pitcher from the 2001 draft who flamed out, Honel has at least spent the majority of his pro career at Double-A Birmingham, where he’s gone a miserable 8-10, 5.81 with 134-127 K-BB in 172 innings. The 16th overall pick from a suburban Chicago private school, Honel has missed large swaths of every season since 2004 with serious—but publicly undiagnosed—arm ailments.

 

too bad, wouldve been nice if he panned out, we couldve used him recently if all went to plan

[Gene Honda Civic]

too bad, wouldve been nice if he panned out, we couldve used him recently if all went to plan

Didn't this happen in August, or was that just a rumor? He asked for a release back then anyways, he wanted to be with his friend from Providence in the Cubbies organization.... He's toast, so it's not like it's any loss at this point.

[Greg The Bull Luzinski]

Another quality draft pick in the toilet. I think most of us expected this one to be a bust though.

[Gene Honda Civic]

Another quality draft pick in the toilet. I think most of us expected this one to be a bust though.

I think people have forgotten what a good prospect he once was.

 

He's one of the Sox best first round selections since the Thomas/Ventura/Fernandez/McDowell days. He was great prior to getting injured.

[gosox41]

Another quality draft pick in the toilet. I think most of us expected this one to be a bust though.

 

 

I remember hearing Hahn in an interview a few years ago when Honel was healthy, probably in 2003. He said he was a younger Mark Prior.

 

 

He was right. Both guys are constantly hurt.

 

 

Bob

[sayitaintso]

I remember hearing Hahn in an interview a few years ago when Honel was healthy, probably in 2003. He said he was a younger Mark Prior.

He was right. Both guys are constantly hurt.

Bob

Prior actually made to to the majors, and had some success. While Honel never made it past AA. Other than that, including the injuries, they are similar.

[hitlesswonder]

I think people have forgotten what a good prospect he once was.

 

He's one of the Sox best first round selections since the Thomas/Ventura/Fernandez/McDowell days. He was great prior to getting injured.

 

Agreed -- Honel wasn't a bad pick, he's just one of the many pitchers whose arms don't hold together long enough for them to get to the majors. Even great scouting organizations aren't able to pick who will get hurt and who won't. No one ever thought Prior wold go through what he has...

[bighurt4life]

Agreed -- Honel wasn't a bad pick, he's just one of the many pitchers whose arms don't hold together long enough for them to get to the majors. Even great scouting organizations aren't able to pick who will get hurt and who won't. No one ever thought Prior wold go through what he has...

 

not true, lots of people thought that Prior might run into injury problems at some point

Edited December 18, 2007 by bighurt4life

[witesoxfan]

not true, lots of people thought that Prior might run into injury problems at some point

 

I actually recall several analysts and publications talking about how his picture perfect mechanics would lead to a long career in the majors.

[GoodAsGould]

not true, lots of people thought that Prior might run into injury problems at some point

 

Yeah, like wite said.... All anyone ever did was praise Prior for his mechanics and talk about he will never get injured because of them.

[southsider2k5]

I actually recall several analysts and publications talking about how his picture perfect mechanics would lead to a long career in the majors.

 

There was also a pretty prominent ex-pitcher who said he wouldn't last, and I can't remember if it was Tom House or Mike Marshall.

[YASNY]

There was also a pretty prominent ex-pitcher who said he wouldn't last, and I can't remember if it was Tom House or Mike Marshall.

 

It's funny, but I was trying sort that out in my mind just a few minutes ago. If I remember correctly, House worked with Prior ... and Marshall was very critical of House's methods.

[Calderon]

How could anyone have ever predicted that a high-school right-hander from a cold weather climate that was throwing a knuckle curve seemingly since birth would be an injury risk?

[Soxfest]

100% Buster he can now be in a trivia question with Scott Ruffcorn!

[southsider2k5]

It's funny, but I was trying sort that out in my mind just a few minutes ago. If I remember correctly, House worked with Prior ... and Marshall was very critical of House's methods.

 

That would explain why those two names were associated with Prior in my mind.

[ptatc]

It's funny, but I was trying sort that out in my mind just a few minutes ago. If I remember correctly, House worked with Prior ... and Marshall was very critical of House's methods.

 

This is correct. House (who began his coaching career in the south suburbs) worked alot with Prior. There are many people (including myself) who do not agree with his conditioning and training methods. These are the "towel drills" and throwing a football to work on your curveball drills.

 

[Punch and Judy Garland]

Honel did not have great work ethic. That was his problem as much or more than the injuries.

[Chisoxfn]

There was also a pretty prominent ex-pitcher who said he wouldn't last, and I can't remember if it was Tom House or Mike Marshall.

Actually, House was the one who developed his mechanics and was the person who said that he would pretty much never get hurt. He had awesome mechanics, the problem was he got overworked by Baker and a young age and the end result caused him to alter his mechanics a bit and well injuries popped up all over the place.

 

[3E8]

Prior had poor mechanics even at USC, so I don't think Dusty is to blame

[ptatc]

Prior had poor mechanics even at USC, so I don't think Dusty is to blame

 

He did not have poor mechanics if you go by House's theory of mechanics. Rothschild, the Cubs current pitching coach is a disciple from this theory of pitching made popular by House and his star pupil Nolan Ryan.

 

Many people would say he had great mechanics and that his problem is that he had never been hurt before and had no idea how to deal with the normal aching and pain that goes along with pitching 200 MLB innings. He never really had an injury. His surgery was to clean out and tighten up the shoulder, which some thought was unnecessary. This is why the "injury" was dragged out for so long.

 

Again my view of his mechanics are different but there are different schools of thought on this topic.

 

[3E8]

Well then I guess I don't go by House's theory of mechanics. Star pupil Nolan Ryan has a totally different arm action than Prior. Here is a quote from our resident scout:

 

Mark Prior - Notice the throwing elbow ABOVE the shoulder - this puts MASSIVE stress on his shoulder. Also notice his excessively HARD landing on his front side that is about to happen - this put MASSIVE stress on the elbow: http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/p...ior-Posters.jpg

 

Why is this so bad? #1 It puts too much stress on the shoulder, #2 You must bring your elbow DOWN from where Prior's is to come thru the throwing zone with any kind of velocity - creating elbow strain & a "flat" path to the plate (Notice how his elbow has "dropped" to get into the throwing zone - causing elbow stress & a "flat" pitch:) http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/t...Mark_Prior1.jpg

 

And here is a picture from Prior's USC days, worse even than the pic Bureau posted:

 

[ptatc]

Well then I guess I don't go by House's theory of mechanics. Star pupil Nolan Ryan has a totally different arm action than Prior. Here is a quote from our resident scout:

And here is a picture from Prior's USC days, worse even than the pic Bureau posted:

 

 

I agree. I don't like what he teaches. I look at the body before, I look at the arm. The arm should be going along for the ride as momentum is transferred from the lower body. One of the things I look at when evaluating a pitcher's mechanics is how his front foot lands. If you look at your picture he lands on his hell. This stops the momentum and creates alot of stress in the back and up into the arm. I think some of the drills they do lead to over striding which is what you see here.

 

There are many theories about pitching mechanics. The more people you talk to the more opinions you find. Being from the medical side of things, I look at stress and where they are centered and where they are dissipated. The job of our resident scout as you call him is to project them to the major league level while mine is to fix them hopefully before an injury. It's just a different point of view.

Edited December 22, 2007 by ptatc

[Rex Hudler]

I agree. I don't like what he teaches. I look at the body before, I look at the arm. The arm should be going along for the ride as momentum is transferred from the lower body. One of the things I look at when evaluating a pitcher's mechanics is how his front foot lands. If you look at your picture he lands on his hell. This stops the momentum and creates alot of stress in the back and up into the arm. I think some of the drills they do lead to over striding which is what you see here.

 

There are many theories about pitching mechanics. The more people you talk to the more opinions you find. Being from the medical side of things, I look at stress and where they are centered and where they are dissipated. The job of our resident scout as you call him is to project them to the major league level while mine is to fix them hopefully before an injury. It's just a different point of view.

 

The way he was landing on his front foot was the first thing I noticed in the picture as well. The back leg should drive the pitcher forward to land on the ball of his front foot, not the heel.

 

Honel did not have great work ethic. That was his problem as much or more than the injuries.

 

Agreed. Honel's problem was as much or more between the ears than it was injuries.

Edited January 19, 2008 by Rex Hudler