CREDE CREDE CREDE

[Greg The Bull Luzinski]

Seems more like they're in win-never mode. I mean I could see them going after a guy like Miguel Cabrera when he was available, or trying to sign ARod when he was a FA, or even trying to snag Troy Glaus, Scott Rolen, or Eric Chavez for next to nothing, but Brandon Inge? WTF are they thinking? Their obsession with mediocre/slightly above average veterans on bad contracts is mind boggling. Hopefully we can enter the picture and offer up Contreras, MacDougal, and Crede for Kemp, Kershaw, Loney, Broxton, and Billingsley. That would be a great deal for the Dodgers based on the way they're going, but then again they probably wouldn't take Crede unless we stupidly extended him for another three years first.

 

Hopefully for Dodger fans' sake the discussions are only an attempt to unload Pierre or something.

 

If KW pulled off that deal, he would be raping the Dodgers and leaving his man juice all over their back.

[The Ginger Kid]

Seems more like they're in win-never mode. I mean I could see them going after a guy like Miguel Cabrera when he was available, or trying to sign ARod when he was a FA, or even trying to snag Troy Glaus, Scott Rolen, or Eric Chavez for next to nothing, but Brandon Inge? WTF are they thinking? Their obsession with mediocre/slightly above average veterans on bad contracts is mind boggling. Hopefully we can enter the picture and offer up Contreras, MacDougal, and Crede for Kemp, Kershaw, Loney, Broxton, and Billingsley. That would be a great deal for the Dodgers based on the way they're going, but then again they probably wouldn't take Crede unless we stupidly extended him for another three years first.

 

Hopefully for Dodger fans' sake the discussions are only an attempt to unload Pierre or something.

Colletti has said Martin and Kemp are untouchable right now.

[Balta1701]

Follks...KHP was clearly being sarcastic with that deal. He's noting how stupid the Dodgers are being for constantly blocking their young guys with mid to low grade players.

[scenario]

Oakland beat San Francisco 23-5 today.

 

Desperation to add a little punch to the Giants lineup could be taking shape soon.

 

I say we offer them both Crede and Uribe (since Omar is injured and out 4-6 weeks).

 

Give Aaron some company.

 

 

[RockRaines]

The green isn't necessary there.

Sure it is, there is no way in hell the Sox ever trade Fields at this point, if they keep Crede (who hasnt sucked his whole career like stated) Fields would be in AAA. Basically there wasnt much truth or sense to the post, so yes, green was necessary.

[Swingandalongonetoleft]

If I didn't see it with my own eyes, and had to get my info from this board, I wouldn't believe that the Sox won in '05. Everyone got lucky, had fluke years, and had the ball bounce their way. But I guess the next year when the Cards won with like a 30-132 record it was legit, and when the BoSox were cooked in the '04 ALCS, it was raw talent that pushed them over the edge, and I could go on and on but I respect the webmaster's space, so I won't. Actually, I will. The Rocks were in the World Series last year. Only capable players are required to win. Crede is capable. From the looks of it, so is Fields, and therein lies our riddle. A-Rod is capable too, but Crede has more rings than he does. To dismiss Crede in the fashion that some of the previous posters have is borderline retarded. I'm not "blaming" our '05 run on Joe, I'm just trying to illustrate the fact that there have been much worse ballplayers that have been part of a winning squad, and much better ones that haven't. Now, if you wanna talk about our 3-4-5 and that groups impact on the season, it's a different story. One way or the other we're set at 3rd. Both scenarios have their risk factor. Crede's back, or Fields rookie season being a fluke.

[Kyyle23]

Damn, Zito got absolutely lit up

[Dick Allen]

I disagree. Good and putrid essentially cancel out. Mediocre != good, and mediocre != decent. Mediocre == "well, at least he's not Timo Perez."

According to your standards Josh Fields has had exactly 2/3 of a mediocre season in his career and really nothing else. So you move out Crede for garbage to make room for "well, at least he's not Timo Perez."

Edited March 2, 2008 by Dick Allen

[BearSox]

Damn, Zito got absolutely lit up

That's been happening to him for the past couple of seasons now.

[Kyyle23]

That's been happening to him for the past couple of seasons now.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/z/zitoba01.shtml

 

i dunno, last season looked about par for him except for the wins and losses.

[Kalapse]

http://www.baseball-reference.com/z/zitoba01.shtml

 

i dunno, last season looked about par for him except for the wins and losses.

When you factor in the league in which he pitched and the enormous ballpark in which he called home he was a below average pitcher last season. A 4.34 ERA in 15 starts in San Francisco for a pitcher who is supposed to be an ace is just terrible. Hell he didn't even make it to 200 IP. Looking at his monthly splits, without his great August (2.50 ERA - by then his team was already sunk and it was largely his fault) his ERA would have been over 5.

[Kyyle23]

When you factor in the league in which he pitched and the enormous ballpark in which he called home he was a below average pitcher last season. A 4.34 ERA in 15 starts in San Francisco for a pitcher who is supposed to be an ace is just terrible. Hell he didn't even make it to 200 IP. Looking at his monthly splits, without his great August (2.50 ERA - by then his team was already sunk and it was largely his fault) his ERA would have been over 5.

 

Yeah, I understand he should be much better for the amount he is getting paid and the park he plays in etc.

 

I still was surprised to see 2/3 of an inning pitched with 8 ER

[Vance Law]

Seems more like they're in win-never mode.

 

Thank you. Neyer had a blog post about this the other day. I couldn't read it because it's Insider Only, but the title is "Inge to Dodgers Makes No Sense." Would love to hear what he has to say.

 

If the Dodgers really are stupid enough to not give the job to LaRoche/Nomar, I can only hope this Inge talk is bs and they're waiting in the weeds to snag Crede.

 

[almagest]

According to your standards Josh Fields has had exactly 2/3 of a mediocre season in his career and really nothing else. So you move out Crede for garbage to make room for "well, at least he's not Timo Perez."

 

Yeah, but that line of thought completely neglects that Fields is younger, cheaper, not represented by Scott Boras, doesn't have potential health issues, and only has 2/3 of a season of ML experience, compared to Crede's 4 full years and 2 partial years. So even if Fields is mediocre, he's still a better choice. And I'd like to find the method by which you predict the stats of a player who doesn't even have one full year at the ML level. Seems kind of silly to say that someone with that little experience has as much of a proven history of mediocrity as someone who's been in the league full time since 2003.

[Dick Allen]

Yeah, but that line of thought completely neglects that Fields is younger, cheaper, not represented by Scott Boras, doesn't have potential health issues, and only has 2/3 of a season of ML experience, compared to Crede's 4 full years and 2 partial years. So even if Fields is mediocre, he's still a better choice. And I'd like to find the method by which you predict the stats of a player who doesn't even have one full year at the ML level. Seems kind of silly to say that someone with that little experience has as much of a proven history of mediocrity as someone who's been in the league full time since 2003.

I'm of the belief Joe Crede will be better than Josh Fields in 2008. I am one of the few that hasn't annointed Josh Fields an All Star yet. Home runs are all he's proven thus far. If Crede plays 2008 anywhere like he did the first 5 months of 2006 before his back gave out again, he would ridiculous to move unless the Sox get something useful for him, which when Noah Lowry and his swollen elbow draws excitement, appears doubtful.

Edited March 2, 2008 by Dick Allen

[southsider2k5]

I'm of the belief Joe Crede will be better than Josh Fields in 2008. I am one of the few that hasn't annointed Josh Fields an All Star yet. Home runs are all he's proven thus far. If Crede plays 2008 anywhere like he did the first 5 months of 2006 before his back gave out again, he would ridiculous to move unless the Sox get something useful for him, which when Noah Lowry and his swollen elbow draws excitement, appears doubtful.

 

Sure. Let Crede play, pay him the $5 million a year, block Fields, and get nothing at all for Crede.

 

It makes sense to me.

[Dick Allen]

Sure. Let Crede play, pay him the $5 million a year, block Fields, and get nothing at all for Crede.

 

It makes sense to me.

Sign Crede to a $5 million contract instead of nontendering him. See if he can play during spring training. If he can, trade him for garbage maybe even throw in some money, or just pay him the $5 million to sit down.

 

Yeah that makes sense.

 

The White Sox refuse to pay over slot in the draft. Would they risk $5.1 million in order to acquire a couple of C prospects?

Edited March 2, 2008 by Dick Allen

[GreatScott82]

With all of this Crede being traded talk... i was thinking what if Kenny shocks us all and trades Fields? Crede keeps talking about how he wants to play the rest of his career here. What if hell freezes over and KW and Crede agree to an extension before the end of spring training? Obviously if he traded Fields, Crede would have to sign first.. But lets face it, we can get a lot more back by trading Fields than trading Crede at this point. Im just thinking waaaay outside the box... i know this probably most likely NOT happen. But hey if Briggs can re-sign with the Bears after all that leaving talk.. anything is possible.

 

Edited March 2, 2008 by GreatScott82

[Kalapse]

With all of this Crede being traded talk... i was thinking what if Kenny shocks us all and trades Fields? Crede keeps talking about how he wants to play the rest of his career here. What if hell freezes over and KW and Crede agree to an extension before the end of spring training? Obviously if he traded Fields, Crede would have to sign first.. But lets face it, we can get a lot more back by trading Fields than trading Crede at this point. Im just thinking waaaay outside the box... i know this probably most likely NOT happen. But hey if Briggs can re-sign with the Bears after all that leaving talk.. anything is possible.

Briggs tested free agency, something Crede and his agent are also set on doing.

[GreatScott82]

Briggs tested free agency, something Crede and his agent are also set on doing.

Your probably right. Especially with Boras as his agent. Is Lowry really the key to the Sox success? I dont think so, he would be a decent #5 in the AL central. The Sox NEED a legitimate #3 starter and I think you can get that by trading Fields as a centerpiece of a package.

What happens if they do go that route and Crede decides to leave after 2008 also. So we spend one season with a one year veteran 3rd basemen and then go throw all your marbles at Miguel Cabrera via free agency after 2009. The Tigers havent signed him long term yet... kind of makes you wonder. Ozzie wants him on the Sox badly...

[Kalapse]

Your probably right. Especially with Boras as his agent. Is Lowry really the key to the Sox success? I dont think so, he would be a decent #5 in the AL central. The Sox NEED a legitimate #3 starter and I think you can get that by trading Fields as a centerpiece of a package.

What happens if they do go that route and Crede decides to leave after 2008 also. So we spend one season with a one year veteran 3rd basemen and then go throw all your marbles at Miguel Cabrera via free agency after 2009. The Tigers havent signed him long term yet... kind of makes you wonder. Ozzie wants him on the Sox badly...

Cabrera and the Tigers are working on a long term deal and I doubt Dombrowski and the Tigers want to give up Miller and Mayban for a renta-player so I wouldn't put any eggs in the Miggy basket.

 

As for trading Fields for a legit #3 starter, I've seen a few people mention this scenario on here before. But what team can you think of right now that would be willing to part with a top of the rotation starter in order to land Josh Fields? It's easy to just say that a team would be willing to make such a deal but can you actually come up with a plausible trade partner.

[WilliamTell]

I'd rather have Crede play than Fields but if the Sox can get a good player or two then I'd say it's ok to trade Crede. If they don't have a deal that'll help the Sox in the future or now, then there's no reason to trade him. Chances are we wouldn't even be having this conversation if Crede didn't get injured or if Fields didn't hit 25 homers last year in roughly 100 games. Obviously it happened so the debate is warrented, but I feel more comfortable with Crede in the lineup still.

[GreatScott82]

Cabrera and the Tigers are working on a long term deal and I doubt Dombrowski and the Tigers want to give up Miller and Mayban for a renta-player so I wouldn't put any eggs in the Miggy basket.

 

As for trading Fields for a legit #3 starter, I've seen a few people mention this scenario on here before. But what team can you think of right now that would be willing to part with a top of the rotation starter in order to land Josh Fields? It's easy to just say that a team would be willing to make such a deal but can you actually come up with a plausible trade partner.

Well first you would have to break it down to which teams absoultely NEED a 3b and the two teams that come to mind are San Fran and LA dodgers.

 

The Giants have 2 guys behind Zito in Lincecum and Cain that can easily fit in to our #3 starter possition. However, I've read before that they were both 'untouchable' but as we know as baseball fans that statement only goes so far. Can Fields and Danks bring one of those guys over? Is that giving up too much? You figure your getting a guy in your rotation who can win 15-16 games and has similar stuff to Josh Beckett. He is also very young and you'll have contractual control over him for 3+ years at a cheap rate before he hits arbatration. Lincecum has nasty stuff as well but i dont think he has the potential to be as dominate as Cain can be. I would offer: Fields and Danks for Cain. OR Fields for Lincecum straight up.

 

The Dodgers have Billingsley who also has great stuff. With LA's depth at SP i think they would pull a move off like this. You figure with Kent and Garciaparra getting older the Dodgers are going to start searching around for some youth in the infield.

 

However, im just throwing names out there. Who knows what Kenny has in store for Crede or Fields... but im sure KW is wieghing ALL of his options at this point. You figure SP is our biggest weakness. And to win the central we are going need SP. We can't just hope Contreras rebounds, Danks takes a HUGE step forward and Floyd finds himself finally. The chances of 3 out of those 3 things happening are probably 20%. The chances of 2 of 3 happening are probably 50% and 1 of 3 66%.

 

 

 

[GreatScott82]

I'd rather have Crede play than Fields but if the Sox can get a good player or two then I'd say it's ok to trade Crede. If they don't have a deal that'll help the Sox in the future or now, then there's no reason to trade him. Chances are we wouldn't even be having this conversation if Crede didn't get injured or if Fields didn't hit 25 homers last year in roughly 100 games. Obviously it happened so the debate is warrented, but I feel more comfortable with Crede in the lineup still.

I agree. Something is telling me that Crede is going to come back strong this season.. Crede is being a true professional about the whole contract situation. I really do hope the Sox can pull off a miracle and sign Crede to an extension as he is a Boras client...

[toasty]

meh.

 

trade tome

 

konerko to DH, put crede @ 1b

 

fields @ 3rd