Official 2007-08 College Basketball Thread

[Soxbadger]

Wisconsin got the benefit of a few close calls there at the end (in contrast to the games against Purdue). I really dont comment on the refs of a game that I have a vested interest in, but earlier in the game I felt Indiana may have gotten the benefit on a few calls in the paint and early in the second DJ White pushed off on an over the back which would of been his 4th but never was called. (Atleast thats my opinion.)

 

With the shooting disparity, Rex is right it was mostly due to the way the game was played. Indiana let Wisconsin shoot 3's and was really trying to deny entry passes. The refs let that type of play go for both sides, if Wisconsin had driven more they would have shot more ft's.

 

The 2 most questionable for Wisconsin were the Hughes (travel/double dribble) and the push on White (which was some what away from the ball).

 

My only guess is that ref might of thought there was contact on Hughes, didnt call the foul and then felt there was no way he could call a travel...

 

At the end of the day in basketball there are so many questionable calls, the ones that happen at the end just are remembered more.

 

 

[Rex Hudler]

Not sure if Sampson will be fired Friday, but I do not expect him to survive this. In fact, I would be shocked if he does.

 

If he is fired, my guess is that Dan Dakich is named interim coach.

 

Now let's play the "what if" game. What if Dakich coaches this team deep into the NCAA Tournament (let's say Elite Eight for example)? Are we back in the same spot we were with Mike Davis? Obviously, Dakich is a former IU player so there are differences, but does the IU administration find themselves in a tough spot with an interim coach again?

 

Just for fun, let's play the "name" game. In no particular order and completely off the top of my head....

 

Sean Miller

Scott Drew

Tony Bennett

Mark Few

Jay Wright

Tom Crean

Randy Wittman

Brad Brownell (stretch, but a childhood neighbor)

Brian Gregory

Mike Brey

Dana Altman

Kevin Stallings

 

Damn my head hurts after that one....

[Buehrle>Wood]

I almost want to throw Chris Lowery in there, but no way would IU follow the game plan of Purdue and Illinois. And the season they are having certainly does not help at all.

[Rex Hudler]

I almost want to throw Chris Lowery in there, but no way would IU follow the game plan of Purdue and Illinois. And the season they are having certainly does not help at all.

 

I very thought about him and came to the same conclusion regarding SIU's season. He is another childhood acquaintance and went to the same HS as Brad Brownell, for what that's worth.

Edited February 14, 2008 by Rex Hudler

[dasox24]

In a day that has been hard for IU fans, I thought this might be a nice laugh. I don't care what y'all say, I love Bob Knight.

 

Edited February 14, 2008 by dasox24

[CWSGuy406]

Just for fun, let's play the "name" game. In no particular order and completely off the top of my head....

 

Sean Miller

Scott Drew

Tony Bennett

Mark Few

Jay Wright

Tom Crean

Randy Wittman

Brad Brownell (stretch, but a childhood neighbor)

Brian Gregory

Mike Brey

Dana Altman

Kevin Stallings

 

Damn my head hurts after that one....

 

I almost want to say "take him". Zero NCAA tourney wins without Wade, not a top recruiter and still can't coach against a zone.

 

I probably make him sound more terrible than he really is -- he's done a lot of good for the program -- but there's just some things that irk me about Crean.

 

Sorry for trying to thread-jack.

 

[Heads22]

Scott Drew would be an interesting grab.

[Jimbo's Drinker]

IU is a top 5 job, they can get anyone they want.

[Rex Hudler]

IU is a top 5 job, they can get anyone they want.

 

So who do you suggest?

 

I submit that it is a high level job and while there may be difficulties it is primed for a new coach that will go about things the right way. That said, timing is everything and as many other big-time programs have found, it is not always as easy as just plucking who you want.

[Jimbo's Drinker]

I think it would be great to see Bobby Knight return.

 

Sean Miller has to be at the top of the list in my opinion.

[farmteam]

The names I wouldn't mind hearing are:

 

Scott Drew

Tony Bennett

Sean Miller

 

My bet would be on one of the top two. I just hope it isn't Dakich (I'm fine with him being the interim to finish out the season, but no more than that).

 

What about Jank?

[Jimbo's Drinker]

What about Mark Few??

[IlliniKrush]

What, no Aboz showing? Oh wait, this has nothing to do with Illinois, so he's not around.

 

At least the majority of IU fans are incredibly pissed and want him gone. I won't jump all over IU fans...but the school got what was coming to them.

 

And you'd rather have your own school do as much damage as possible and then hope the NCAA doesn't drop a hammer or two. So firing him immediately would be a good start.

 

 

[farmteam]

Wisconsin got the benefit of a few close calls there at the end (in contrast to the games against Purdue). I really dont comment on the refs of a game that I have a vested interest in, but earlier in the game I felt Indiana may have gotten the benefit on a few calls in the paint and early in the second DJ White pushed off on an over the back which would of been his 4th but never was called. (Atleast thats my opinion.)

 

With the shooting disparity, Rex is right it was mostly due to the way the game was played. Indiana let Wisconsin shoot 3's and was really trying to deny entry passes. The refs let that type of play go for both sides, if Wisconsin had driven more they would have shot more ft's.

 

The 2 most questionable for Wisconsin were the Hughes (travel/double dribble) and the push on White (which was some what away from the ball).

 

My only guess is that ref might of thought there was contact on Hughes, didnt call the foul and then felt there was no way he could call a travel...

 

At the end of the day in basketball there are so many questionable calls, the ones that happen at the end just are remembered more.

 

You are correct. The three I was angry with were the non traveling call, the play where DJ got sandwiched going up for the rebound (looked like a blatant over the back), and the one where Butch (I think it was him, might have been Stiemsma) pretty much threw DJ out of the way. However, those were all near the end, and thus fresh in my memory (and like I said, I'm looking for something to blame, and refs are always the easiest target). It was more even earlier in the game. Also, I think IU got the benefit of a few out of bounds calls that should have gone Wisconsin's way.

 

I didn't mean to take anything away from Brian Butch -- he hit a big shot when his team needed it, and Ellis couldn't reciprocate.

[Soxbadger]

Tony Bennett?

 

Does he have any connections to Indiana at all?

 

And I guess that would be a nice job to take for 5-10 years before he takes over after Bo Ryan.

 

(Edit)

 

And that Butch shot was just luck.

 

That play looked horrible, but some times its better to be lucky than good.

Edited February 14, 2008 by Soxbadger

[SoxFan1]

Grand Valley State is 26-0. Suck on that.

[ChiSox_Sonix]

Well i'm glad ESPN felt the St. Johns-Cincy game was a better choice than UCONN-ND last night but whatever. Glad that UCONN won. 8 game winning streak vs 8 quality opponents too. Assuming they handle South Florida on saturday they should be a top 15 team (maybe as high as 12-13) by the next poll.

[RockRaines]

That is what I heard last night, but not from a source I trust enough to have said it. We'll see, but there is a lot of smoke on that story.

 

IU fans: If he's fired, what names will come up besides the obvious like Matta and Sean Miller?

Matta?

[Jenksismyhero]

IU is a top 5 job, they can get anyone they want.

 

 

In 2008? I doubt it. Maybe 20 years ago.

 

Who wants to walk into a program and spend a minimum of three years a) dealing with the sanctions/penalties that are inevitable, and B) building back up the recruits. IU was going to be an average team next year with a couple of good recruits coming in. It'll be tough to keep recruits on board with a coaching change (obviously it depends on who they bring in).

 

I just hope, for the sake of the Big Ten and the quality of coaches in the league, that they make their decision based on performance and not hype. Don't pull a Kentucky and grab a guy who was all hype.

 

 

 

[thedoctor]

Matta?

 

given that he's a big name and grew up as an indiana fan i do think his name will come up and maybe iu makes a call. that said, i don't think there's a snowballs chance he goes.

[Rex Hudler]

given that he's a big name and grew up as an indiana fan i do think his name will come up and maybe iu makes a call. that said, i don't think there's a snowballs chance he goes.

 

I don't either. I think now is a time IU could go with a good solid coach that doesn't have to be a big name.

 

On a separate note:

 

Am I in never, never land thinking that if IU fires Sampson that the penalties won't be that bad or possibly not more than a loss of a scholarship or two with probation? Here is my thinking. It is obvious that Sampson and his staff were the problem here. The NCAA report stated that they believe Sampson lied to IU investigators as well as the NCAA. IU has a clean history with no major violations in the past 45+ years. Sampson made mistakes and unfortunately they were the same kind of mistakes he previously made. His actions in essence tell you that he chose to be selective in how he was going to follow the sanctions placed upon him. Now if he didn't fully understand them, then he is stupid or IU did a terrible job covering them. My guess is that doesn't even apply. So I am wondering, if IU fires Sampson, self-imposes say another scholarship and extends that to two years, what else is necessary? The problem has been eradicated in that scenario, IU is punishing iteslf going forward for making the hire. Is that enough? I'm trying to take off my crimson colored glasses here and look at this objectively. I'm interested in the thoughts of anyone else will do try and be objective as well.

 

 

[thedoctor]

I don't either. I think now is a time IU could go with a good solid coach that doesn't have to be a big name.

 

On a separate note:

 

Am I in never, never land thinking that if IU fires Sampson that the penalties won't be that bad or possibly not more than a loss of a scholarship or two with probation? Here is my thinking. It is obvious that Sampson and his staff were the problem here. The NCAA report stated that they believe Sampson lied to IU investigators as well as the NCAA. IU has a clean history with no major violations in the past 45+ years. Sampson made mistakes and unfortunately they were the same kind of mistakes he previously made. His actions in essence tell you that he chose to be selective in how he was going to follow the sanctions placed upon him. Now if he didn't fully understand them, then he is stupid or IU did a terrible job covering them. My guess is that doesn't even apply. So I am wondering, if IU fires Sampson, self-imposes say another scholarship and extends that to two years, what else is necessary? The problem has been eradicated in that scenario, IU is punishing iteslf going forward for making the hire. Is that enough? I'm trying to take off my crimson colored glasses here and look at this objectively. I'm interested in the thoughts of anyone else will do try and be objective as well.

 

i think what probably will determine the severity is whether they decide that there was a lack of institutional control of not. if so, i could see a severe penalty that results in a loss of scholarships and a postseason ban of more than a year. if not, i think the penalties would be similar to what you suggest.

 

but i'm no expert so any of my thoughts on penalties are pure speculation. in general, i don't think the ncaa is as willing to give out severe penalties any more. they see what happened with smu.

[whitesoxfan99]

I don't either. I think now is a time IU could go with a good solid coach that doesn't have to be a big name.

 

On a separate note:

 

Am I in never, never land thinking that if IU fires Sampson that the penalties won't be that bad or possibly not more than a loss of a scholarship or two with probation? Here is my thinking. It is obvious that Sampson and his staff were the problem here. The NCAA report stated that they believe Sampson lied to IU investigators as well as the NCAA. IU has a clean history with no major violations in the past 45+ years. Sampson made mistakes and unfortunately they were the same kind of mistakes he previously made. His actions in essence tell you that he chose to be selective in how he was going to follow the sanctions placed upon him. Now if he didn't fully understand them, then he is stupid or IU did a terrible job covering them. My guess is that doesn't even apply. So I am wondering, if IU fires Sampson, self-imposes say another scholarship and extends that to two years, what else is necessary? The problem has been eradicated in that scenario, IU is punishing iteslf going forward for making the hire. Is that enough? I'm trying to take off my crimson colored glasses here and look at this objectively. I'm interested in the thoughts of anyone else will do try and be objective as well.

 

I think firing Sampson and imposing sanctions would definitely reduce the penalty. The problem still would remain that IU hired a known cheater and he continued to cheat under their watch. It doesn't exactly set a great example for other programs if simply firing the guy once he gets caught and imposing a one scholarship reduction is sufficient to not receive further penalties. Because really, 1 scholarship is not significant since teams often don't have 13 guys on scholarship and only 9 or 10 guys typically play.

[Jenksismyhero]

I think if the allegations are true, they're looking at a loss of few scholarships (maybe one or two for a couple of years) and a minimum of one year post-season ban.

 

Espn has a good article about how lying to investigators is one of the bigger no-no's. Now the writer of the piece fails to accurately compare the violations - he's talking about Baylor (telling kids to lie about a murder), Minnesota (writing papers/taking tests) and Ohio State (the most ridiculous one imo, giving a kid 6k to go home to the other side of the world) - but it still shows how the NCAA comes down strong on programs that lie to it. Except for Ohio State, the schools he talked about got major penalties - often multi-year loss of scholarships and post-season bans AFTER the school had already given self-imposed penalties.

 

I also wonder how the NCAA would view Indiana keeping Sampson around this year, even if they just suspend him. You'd think allowing a cheater to continue just because he has a good team and some good players (a "one year window") would make them react stronger against it.

 

And does anyone know if this current team will be affected? Lets assume they make the final four or the championship, is that something that can later be taken away by the NCAA because of Sampsons actions?

[hitlesswonder]

I don't either. I think now is a time IU could go with a good solid coach that doesn't have to be a big name.

 

What about Lon Kruger? I think he might be a good fit for Indiana right now...

 

A high-risk high-reward choice would be Grant from VCU.