fathom Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 QUOTE(The Ginger Kid @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 09:55 PM) I think you could package Juan and Joe to SF. But now it's sounding like Crede may not get moved so soon... To this point, KW has really botched what he did with the left side of the infield this offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 02:05 PM) To this point, KW has really botched what he did with the left side of the infield this offseason. What move would you have preferred? And don't say not picking up Uribe's option, because we all know that was picked up for timing purposes/so that we weren't desperate for a shortstop when we were trying to trade for one. Would you have traded Fields? Would you have traded Crede for nothing or not offered him arbitration? Would you have taken an aluminum bat to Joe's back? What else would you have done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 QUOTE(Jenks Heat @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 01:49 PM) McDougal will be given a shot to come north regardless of his spring. I think Wasserman will really have to outpitch Massett to make the team. Massett is, IMO, going to have to look worse than anyone on the roster to avoid making the team, because he's out of options. McDougal and Wasserman each can be sent to the minors without us losing them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 2 hits all day? Kong's batting average drops below .600. Not good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanOfCorn Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 04:05 PM) To this point, KW has really botched what he did with the left side of the infield this offseason. as much as I hate to say it, I don't blame him for Uribe. He probably didn't know the Cabrera for Garland trade was possible and he had to do something. And he wasn't going to be able to trade Crede for a bag of balls until he played a few games. He covered his ass and unfortunately got bit in it, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 02:05 PM) To this point, KW has really botched what he did with the left side of the infield this offseason. you mean not getting, oh, say cabrera and renteria? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 10:08 PM) What move would you have preferred? And don't say not picking up Uribe's option, because we all know that was picked up for timing purposes/so that we weren't desperate for a shortstop when we were trying to trade for one. Would you have traded Fields? Would you have traded Crede for nothing or not offered him arbitration? Would you have taken an aluminum bat to Joe's back? What else would you have done? He should have never picked up Uribe's option, especially if he had the slightest though of possibly trading Garland for a SS. I'm still confident that Crede will be dealt prior to the start of the season, but if for some reason Fields is starting the season in AAA....well, there's going to be at least one very unhappy person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 QUOTE(CanOfCorn @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 10:12 PM) as much as I hate to say it, I don't blame him for Uribe. He probably didn't know the Cabrera for Garland trade was possible and he had to do something. And he wasn't going to be able to trade Crede for a bag of balls until he played a few games. He covered his ass and unfortunately got bit in it, too. If KW was going to be willing to give up Garland for Cabrera, why not see if this was a possibility prior to signing Uribe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Picking up Uribe's option was the right thing to do at the time. Can't go back and rewrite history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 if it makes you feel any better, Gio pitched well today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Getupstretch39 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Just curious....how long did the Sox have before they ran out of time on Uribe's option? What I mean is....is something that KW couldn't wait on before exploring other options? Obviously not I guess but I was curious as to how long teams have to pick up/decline options on players.....if memory serves me right, didn't KW decline the option and Uribe and sign him for $500k less? If it was a re-signing.....why do it so soon? I don't see the market for Uribe being THAT hot where someone would have stepped in with a better offer.... Forgive my ignorance on the time sensitivity of options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Nice to see MacDougal got a scoreless inning. Thome and the rest of the non-hitting team should all be traded though. Mark that one with the green green of losing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 QUOTE(Getupstretch39 @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 02:56 PM) Just curious....how long did the Sox have before they ran out of time on Uribe's option? What I mean is....is something that KW couldn't wait on before exploring other options? Obviously not I guess but I was curious as to how long teams have to pick up/decline options on players.....if memory serves me right, didn't KW decline the option and Uribe and sign him for $500k less? If it was a re-signing.....why do it so soon? I don't see the market for Uribe being THAT hot where someone would have stepped in with a better offer.... Forgive my ignorance on the time sensitivity of options. had like 10 days after the end of the world series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted March 6, 2008 Author Share Posted March 6, 2008 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 05:09 PM) Massett is, IMO, going to have to look worse than anyone on the roster to avoid making the team, because he's out of options. McDougal and Wasserman each can be sent to the minors without us losing them. Agree. Masset and Wassermann isn't the deal - they have very different roles. Its Wassermann and MacDougal, who are similar in role. And as you say, they both can be sent down. MacD with a good inning. I am not sure if that's good or bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Either way, it's good to be having these type of discussions about who's going to be making the pen. It shows for the 1st time, we actually have a little depth there. It's just the guys in the pen, just have to perform. A league average pen last season, and the Sox probably win 5 more game at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Since Masset is out of options... Does that mean he can't start the season with Charlotte (unless he clears waivers)? Or does it mean that he could start the the season in Charlotte, but if called up, he couldn't be returned to AAA without clearing waivers? When does an option get used? It's to move a player from the 25-man to the minor league roster isn't it? And he's not on the 25-man now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 QUOTE(scenario @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 05:38 PM) Since Masset is out of options... Does that mean he can't start the season with Charlotte (unless he clears waivers)? Or does it mean that he could start the the season in Charlotte, but if called up, he couldn't be returned to AAA without clearing waivers? When does an option get used? It's to move a player from the 25-man to the minor league roster isn't it? And he's not on the 25-man now. It means Masset can't be optioned to the minors without being placed on waivers. If a team claims him, they can have 10 days to make a deal. If nobody claims him, then MAsset can asked to be released or go back to Charlotte, which is unlikely. I think he'll be traded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 QUOTE(Jenks Heat @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 09:49 PM) McDougal will be given a shot to come north regardless of his spring. I think Wasserman will really have to outpitch Massett to make the team. Uribe is really getting close to a DFA. Why do you think Uribe is ready to be sent out/down or released? Not with his time in the bigs and the salary he is making. If anything he stays or gets traded, but not released outright. Explain yourself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 (edited) QUOTE(flavum @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 06:37 PM) It means Masset can't be optioned to the minors without being placed on waivers. If a team claims him, they can have 10 days to make a deal. If nobody claims him, then MAsset can asked to be released or go back to Charlotte, which is unlikely. I think he'll be traded. But does he have to be optioned to start the year in Charlotte if he is not currently on the 25-man roster? Edited March 7, 2008 by scenario Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 QUOTE(scenario @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 06:50 PM) But does he have to be optioned to start the year in Charlotte if he is not currently on the 25-man roster? I'm confused. The Sox have to get their 40-man down to 25 by March 30. If Masset doesn't make the team he'll be put on waivers, since he's out of minor league options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 (edited) I found the answer to my first question. Yes, the team burns an option by assigning a player to the minors even if they are not on the 25-man. But... I found this article by Rob Neyer that makes me wonder about Masset's option status: Options When a player is on the 40-man roster but not on the 25-man Major League roster, he is on "optional assignment." One common misconception about the rules is that a player may only be "optioned out" three times. Actually, each player has three option years, and he can be sent up and down as many times as the club chooses within those three seasons. When you hear that a player is "out of options," that means he's been on the 40-man roster during three different seasons, beginning with his fourth as a pro, and to be sent down again he'll have to clear waivers. Checking Masset's history on thebaseballcube.com... Nick first was promoted to the majors by Texas in 2006. That's one year. Last year with the Sox was two. This year is number three - not four. Are we working off the assumption that he is out of options, when he may not be? Anybody have verification of this? Edited March 7, 2008 by scenario Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 Masset and Floyd are the two players out of options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 (edited) I dug a little deeper and it appears that the Rangers did add Masset to their 40 man roster in late 2004. Therefore he has used up his three option years (2005-2007) and can't be sent to the minors this year without first clearing waivers. So we have to bring him north, trade him, or waive him. Edited March 7, 2008 by scenario Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanOfCorn Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 04:27 PM) If KW was going to be willing to give up Garland for Cabrera, why not see if this was a possibility prior to signing Uribe? Ever think that the Angels started those talks? It's possible. Or maybe he wasn't ready to trade Garland but couldn't find anything better. I usually agree with you fathom, but this time, I think you have to give KW the benefit of the doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 QUOTE(CanOfCorn @ Mar 6, 2008 -> 08:02 PM) Ever think that the Angels started those talks? It's possible. Or maybe he wasn't ready to trade Garland but couldn't find anything better. I usually agree with you fathom, but this time, I think you have to give KW the benefit of the doubt. That's exactly what happened. The Angels contacted KW right AFTER Uribe signed and told him they were planning on offering Cabrera. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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