Ozzie's comments on Alexei

[Princess Dye]

So... it sounds like he doesnt think there's much of a chance Ramirez can handle 2b.

 

 

 

But...why would he say this about Ramirez?

 

 

"It's not the same [playing second base for] Industriales in Havana and playing second base [Opening Day] in Cleveland," manager Ozzie Guillen said.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...g,1,15134.story

 

 

 

 

Has no one in Havana hit a scalding line drive at him? Does no one slide hard? I mean, obviously the talent the league isnt any better, but how is it harder to play 2b at MLB, when the toughest hit balls and toughest situations to be in, as a fielder, are going to be present from time to time in any country's league?

Edited March 12, 2008 by Princess Dye

[RockRaines]

Well, I would ask why all of our AA and AAA players arent on major league rosters to answer your question, because thats about the talent level of the cuban league.

[tealeafreaderii]

I thought the Cubans were a little more polite with their take out slides... and that is the biggest issues?

[Princess Dye]

Well, I would ask why all of our AA and AAA players arent on major league rosters to answer your question, because thats about the talent level of the cuban league.

 

right but the point is just about playing 2b. How much harder can MLB second base be....than Cuban second base?

 

 

The hardest hit ball down there must be as hard hit as here.

 

 

The hard slides... well, that would be about the only issue i could think of. If he's hitting the cover off the ball all spring, I think you look past it and give him a shot opening day.

[Dick Allen]

right but the point is just about playing 2b. How much harder can MLB second base be....than Cuban second base?

The hardest hit ball down there must be as hard hit as here.

The hard slides... well, that would be about the only issue i could think of. If he's hitting the cover off the ball all spring, I think you look past it and give him a shot opening day.

First off, Ozzie hasn't been too impressed with his glove at 2B this spring. I also think there's a comfort level he would have playing in Cuba that he wouldn't have March 31 in Cleveland. He was a star, now he's a guy trying to make a team. The major leagues is the biggest stage, he's bound to be a little tight. I also think Ozzie is referring to offensively as well, as he's probably rarely, if ever, faced a guy with Sabathia's stuff in what could be not the most ideal playing conditions. I wonder what the lowest temperature Ramirez has ever played in.

[southsideirish71]

First off, Ozzie hasn't been too impressed with his glove at 2B this spring. I also think there's a comfort level he would have playing in Cuba that he wouldn't have March 31 in Cleveland. He was a star, now he's a guy trying to make a team. The major leagues is the biggest stage, he's bound to be a little tight. I also think Ozzie is referring to offensively as well, as he's probably rarely, if ever, faced a guy with Sabathia's stuff in what could be not the most ideal playing conditions. I wonder what the lowest temperature Ramirez has ever played in.

 

God forbid if he faced CC, it would be so much better if we put Uribe and his .200BA against CC up there to swing for the fences.

 

We were so impressed with Uribe that after signing him, we immediately traded our best trading chip for his position. Then after finding no suitors we are forced to use him. If it wasn't for the 4 million dollar salary Uribe he would be sitting on the pine as a utility guy.

[Princess Dye]

obviously i'm no expert on Ramirez or his hitting, i dont know who is at this point. but IF he's a contact hitter, we need that. more than what Uribe is gonna be, which is his usual hackaway self. again, the other options at 2b leave us little reason to look away so quickly.

 

For these reasons, I'd even wish Ozuna at 2b over Uribe. Do others feel, like me, that 2b has been Ozuna's least crappy position defensively?

Edited March 12, 2008 by Princess Dye

[southsideirish71]

obviously i'm no expert on Ramirez or his hitting, i dont know who is at this point. but IF he's a contact hitter, we need that. more than what Uribe is gonna be, which is his usual hackaway self. again, the other options at 2b leave us little reason to look away so quickly.

 

For these reasons, I'd even wish Ozuna at 2b over Uribe. Do others feel, like me, that 2b has been Ozuna's least crappy position defensively?

 

There are over 4 million reasons for Uribe to be the starter.

[RockRaines]

right but the point is just about playing 2b. How much harder can MLB second base be....than Cuban second base?

The hardest hit ball down there must be as hard hit as here.

The hard slides... well, that would be about the only issue i could think of. If he's hitting the cover off the ball all spring, I think you look past it and give him a shot opening day.

How different can high school 2B be vs minor league second base? Speed, handling, turning 2, knowing situations, lots of stuff.

[BearSox]

It's a shame Ramirez won't be making the team out spring, especially since his approach to plate has been the best, by far, out of any players on the Sox down there at Tuscon.

Edited March 12, 2008 by BearSox

[HuskyCaucasian]

KW needs to trade Uribe before ozzie actually considers him as a starter again.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Ramirez has speed, versatility, and has shown better than expected hitting ability including gap to gap power. Before anyones dismisses his hitting as " being only ST " just look at what the anointed one, Josh Fields, is doing this spring. He's still a K machine even against inferior spring pitching. Yet most seem ready to gift wrap the starting 3rd base job to him. Ramirez will be getting a crash course at 2nd base for the rest of the spring in the hopes that he learns the position quickly and shows he can play it as good as he plays shortstop. Uribe is only the leading candidate right now because of his glove, power and experience and Richars visa and back problems . If Ramirez gets sent down and rakes minor league pitching and quickly becomes adept at 2nd he won't be down there long.

[witesoxfan]

Ramirez has speed, versatility, and has shown better than expected hitting ability including gap to gap power. Before anyones dismisses his hitting as " being only ST " just look at what the anointed one, Josh Fields, is doing this spring. He's still a K machine even against inferior spring pitching. Yet most seem ready to gift wrap the starting 3rd base job to him. Ramirez will be getting a crash course at 2nd base for the rest of the spring in the hopes that he learns the position quickly and shows he can play it as good as he plays shortstop. Uribe is only the leading candidate right now because of his glove, power and experience and Richars visa and back problems . If Ramirez gets sent down and rakes minor league pitching and quickly becomes adept at 2nd he won't be down there long.

 

2 things

 

1. The 3B position seems to be 50/50 between Crede and Fields, and that all depends on whether Crede can be traded or not. If the Sox can't trade, he's starting.

2. Fields hit 23 homers last year in the majors in 4 months. Ramirez has never set foot onto a baseball field, and is, according to almost all accounts, extremely raw as a hitter. I don't really no any other way to put it.

[SleepyWhiteSox]

I see nothing wrong with that statement...

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 things

 

1. The 3B position seems to be 50/50 between Crede and Fields, and that all depends on whether Crede can be traded or not. If the Sox can't trade, he's starting.

2. Fields hit 23 homers last year in the majors in 4 months. Ramirez has never set foot onto a baseball field, and is, according to almost all accounts, extremely raw as a hitter. I don't really no any other way to put it.

 

Point #1. I'm not sure when you say "he's starting " who exactly you mean , I assume if there's no trade Crede will be starting.

 

Point #2. Amend "never set foot onto a baseball field " to a US minor or major league field. All I know is right now Ramirez is showing he can hit often drawing comparisons to Soriano . We've seen him do well in the WBC and now ST. He has a quick bat. I see nothing wrong with him being in the minors to start the season as I said. If Crede is the starter I also hope Josh will spell Crede as 3rd and Thome at DH against tough lefties. He won't be seeing as many curveballs this year and only wish Josh's swing was as quick as Ramirez so I wouldn't worry as much about Josh getting around on fastballs.

[Dick Allen]

God forbid if he faced CC, it would be so much better if we put Uribe and his .200BA against CC up there to swing for the fences.

 

We were so impressed with Uribe that after signing him, we immediately traded our best trading chip for his position. Then after finding no suitors we are forced to use him. If it wasn't for the 4 million dollar salary Uribe he would be sitting on the pine as a utility guy.

I'd bet my home if Ramirez makes the White Sox and plays everyday, you will hate his swing at everything approach, and will say its all Greg Walker.

[southsider2k5]

I see nothing wrong with that statement...

 

I agree with you. There have been plenty of rumblings about his defense not being very good out there, and even during the winter, talk of his going to Charlotte to start the season. Even Hawk and DJ kept talking about how he hit the fastball, but I didn't hear anything about his hitting a breaking pitch. I get the feeling Ramirez will be the kind of guy to hit .400 in April and then .100 in May, when everyone starts throwing him off speed stuff. If he doesn't play good D, what is the point of having him out there if he is htting like that?

[shipps]

I know his defense isnt there yet but will it cost us as many runs as we will gain with him in the lineup?As a fan I find it hard to ignore his offensive capability,but if I was a manager he would be sent down for a month or 2 .There will be someone on our 25 man roster that has proven themselves worthy of AAA baseball by then.

[RockRaines]

I agree with you. There have been plenty of rumblings about his defense not being very good out there, and even during the winter, talk of his going to Charlotte to start the season. Even Hawk and DJ kept talking about how he hit the fastball, but I didn't hear anything about his hitting a breaking pitch. I get the feeling Ramirez will be the kind of guy to hit .400 in April and then .100 in May, when everyone starts throwing him off speed stuff. If he doesn't play good D, what is the point of having him out there if he is htting like that?

He actually has shown flashes of being able to hit the breaking pitch in games lately. As ST goes further along, pitchers work on their breaking pitches and A-ram has already shown he can take those pitches to LF. His gap to gap power, speed, and versatility is a must on this team IMO. He bring Pablo-esque flexability at a younger age, with more power and ability at the plate. I really hope he just continues to progress. He COULD be our starting SS next season.

[Controlled Chaos]

How well does he turn the double play? It's a totally different turn than when playing short. I think that's a big factor. This team just can't afford to give up extra outs and he needs to be proficient at the DP.

[elrockinMT]

He actually has shown flashes of being able to hit the breaking pitch in games lately. As ST goes further along, pitchers work on their breaking pitches and A-ram has already shown he can take those pitches to LF. His gap to gap power, speed, and versatility is a must on this team IMO. He bring Pablo-esque flexability at a younger age, with more power and ability at the plate. I really hope he just continues to progress. He COULD be our starting SS next season.

 

I think it will take more than a few games in ST for him to learn to hit the breaking ball. There is nothing wrong with some time in the minors to get the rough edges off. I would think he has a future in MLB with the Sox although I wouldn't be expecting him to be the one spring boarding us to a championship.

[Balta1701]

I think it will take more than a few games in ST for him to learn to hit the breaking ball. There is nothing wrong with some time in the minors to get the rough edges off. I would think he has a future in MLB with the Sox although I wouldn't be expecting him to be the one spring boarding us to a championship.

We're still sitting in a place where we're very likely to have an opening at SS at the start of 2009, maybe earlier if our MLB team implodes again. Hell, we have 2 MI spots that should be open by the start of next season. There's a place for both him and Richar if they can stay healthy/perform this season in AAA.

[SoxWS05]

We're still sitting in a place where we're very likely to have an opening at SS at the start of 2009, maybe earlier if our MLB team implodes again. Hell, we have 2 MI spots that should be open by the start of next season. There's a place for both him and Richar if they can stay healthy/perform this season in AAA.

 

Remember, we don't worry about 2009 until 2009. The future is now.

[RockRaines]

Keith Law, front page espn.com MLB page

 

Alexei Ramirez has certainly received more than his share of attention this spring, and he's in the mix for the starting second-base job on the South Side, although Ozzie Guillen's comments that his defense is "pretty rough at second base" would seem to point to a stint in AAA.

 

 

Ramirez reminds me in a lot of ways of Alfonso Soriano, although he doesn't have Soriano's explosiveness at the plate. Ramirez is slight of build, but wiry strong, and could probably add some muscle in an MLB-caliber conditioning program. He has very quick wrists and gets the bat to the ball quickly, with very good plate coverage as well. His swing has Soriano's exaggerated finish, and when he connects he has plus raw power to his pull side (left field) and can at least put it to the wall to the opposite field.

 

 

The similarities to Soriano continue through to Soriano's biggest negative as a hitter, his lack of plate discipline, and if anything, Ramirez' discipline might be worse. Because he can get the bat to the ball so easily, he tries to hit everything, and very few players in baseball can succeed with that approach. In today's game, Ramirez swung at a ball that hit him, and then swung at another one that would have hit his jaw if he hadn't fouled it off. He took just two pitches in his first three trips to the plate, one of which was a called third strike. He seems to be a reactive hitter, one who reacts to the pitch as it travels rather than trying to recognize the pitch as it leaves the pitcher's hand. So if he gets a pitch in his zone, he can destroy it. He seems to anticipate fastballs in fastball counts, but he can be beaten by a pitcher who can locate his stuff just out of Ramirez's reach.

 

On defense, he is indeed a bit rough. He has plenty of athleticism to handle second base, but his actions are all wrong for the position, similar to the way B.J. Upton couldn't play second despite being an excellent athlete. Ramirez hampers himself further with a tendency to try to make the flashy play, going for the glove flip during today's game when he would have been better served trying to get the ball out of his glove and then throwing it.

 

If the White Sox give Ramirez a starting job, he's likely to hit for a decent average with 20-homer power, but his OBP would be poor because he's not going to draw many walks. A few weeks or months in AAA to get him comfortable facing American pitching wouldn't hurt him or the big club.

[RockRaines]

heres the rest of the article....

 

 

Other observations from Surprise ...

 

• Josh Hamilton murders fastballs. He took the first pitch he saw, a 92-mph fastball from Gavin Floyd, out to center field, and his other two hits were also smoked. Hamilton isn't just a fastball hitter, but at the least, pitchers need to work him away with offspeed stuff, because throwing him a fastball in or near the zone is asking for trouble.

 

• Speaking of Floyd, he's gone backward since his days as a top prospect. The No. 4 pick in the 2001 draft -- one ahead of Mark Teixeira -- once had one of the best curveballs in the game, but it's dropped all the way to solid average, and he can't get consistent bite on it, throwing just one plus curve (to strike out Michael Young) during his outing. He doesn't command his four-seamer at 91-93 mph, and his straight changeup isn't going to fool hitters.

 

• Kazuo Fukumori worked a short inning, showing an 89-91 mph fastball with some downhill plane and a "shuuto" at 85-86 mph with a solid late break that's more vertical than horizontal, making it almost like a splitter with a little cut. He has some effort to his delivery, and I don't see plus fastball command. But if he stays on top of the ball and can mix in the shuuto, he should be effective.

 

• I've said before that I believe Josh Fields will develop into an above-average offensive third baseman, but he has yet to show progress recognizing breaking balls. That's going to keep his contact rate and his walk rate down, and he doesn't have a great glove on which to fall back.