Obama's Pastor

[lostfan]

Actually today a radio DJ was playing big chunks of that same sermon and it really doesn't sound like it's what it's made out to be AT ALL. It doesn't excuse the particular language he used but really now the overall message was totally different. Hell, at the end of the sermon he starts talking about tolerance and loving each other for crying out loud.

[Jenksismyhero]

Have you watched the two sermons that Fox took their soundbytes from, Jenks?

 

If you haven't, just take 15 minutes to watch them. I think your opinions might change a bit.

 

Lol, Uma, Oprah, Opera, Oprah, whatever.

 

I did watch them. Which way are you going with that? Are you saying I should be more upset about them, or that I'm taking them too seriously?

 

Depending on what you say I'll give you my dissertation.

[Gregory Pratt]

I did hear her mention in an interview in the past that she had a tough choice. and her "future" factored into her staying with him. Now, what "future" would require you not divorce your husband? Senate? naaaa. McCain is there. Working in the private sector? naa... Running for president? YEP! that's it. We didnt know it back then, but even THEN she was planning on running for president.

 

PS: I am currently trying to track down the quote or soundbite from that interview. I have NO idea where I heard it, but I did hear it.

 

If you are interested in learning about the Clinton marriage, I'd recommend reading Anderson's Bill and Hillary: The Marriage. Why do they stay together? Well, why does anyone stay with anyone else? Plenty of reasons. Love, politics (of life and electorate), ambition, family, consistency, bonds created by time and a daughter -- these all play a part. That Hillary ONLY stayed with Bill is simply not true; that it was the primary consideration is up for debate by scholars and biographers and students. Regardless of how important it was, as a percentage, I object to this characterization of her and his marriage. I'm not a big fan of Bill or Hillary, although Bill gets criticized more harshly by me, but that she didn't dump him because she wanted to run for President is unfair.

[iamshack]

Lol, Uma, Oprah, Opera, Oprah, whatever.

 

I did watch them. Which way are you going with that? Are you saying I should be more upset about them, or that I'm taking them too seriously?

 

Depending on what you say I'll give you my dissertation.

 

I am not the person who had anything to do with the Oprah thing, so don't try to confuse anyone!

 

Actually, I don't think they are anything other than inflammatory rhetoric. I didn't find them to be offensive, or racist, or anything like that.

 

 

[DrunkBomber]

Just saw a blurb for the 10 NBC news that Wright said something new and theyll talk about it on the news. ANyone know what it is?

[DrunkBomber]

Rev. Wright Slurs Italians In 2007 Eulogy

 

CHICAGO -- He's made controversial comments about the U.S. government as well as Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Hillary Clinton. The Rev. Jeremiah Wright -- Sen. Barack Obama's former pastor -- has come under fire once again, NBC5's Rob Stafford reported.

 

Wright's latest controversy comes from a eulogy he wrote for Asa Hilliard. The article appeared in a November/December 2007 edition of Trumpet, a magazine run by Wright's daughters. He was quoted as calling Italians "garlic noses" and saying Jesus' crucifixion was "a public lynching Italian-style."

 

The comments were written before Obama publicly denounced other controversial statements by Wright.

 

On behalf of the Joint Civic Committee of Italian Americans, Domnic DiFrisco spoke about Wright's statements. He said he was "saddened by the words of a purported Christian minister."

 

Chicago's Italian American Human Relations Foundation called the comments an example of hatred, but member Louis Raygo said he does not hold Obama responsible.

 

"Do I blame him for the words of somebody else? No. And this doesn't come as an endorsement of Mr. Obama or a non-endorsement. I just don't like guilt by association," Raygo said.

 

In a Thursday interview with CNBC's Maria Bartiromo, Obama called new stories about Wright a distraction.

 

"Part of what I hope to do in this campaign and as president is to get us beyond these divisions that distract us from our common challenges and our common opportunities and move the country forward," Obama said.

 

But on Wednesday, Obama, speaking to a crowd of supporters, appeared to defend Wright.

 

"This was somebody who was preaching three sermons a week for 30 years and so it got boiled down -- they found five or six of his most offense statements," Obama said.

 

DiFrisco, who supports Obama, said that if the senator doesn't do more to separate himself from Wright, he'll lose votes from Italian Americans.

 

"Barack Obama is being closely linked to a man who spews hatred. And it is so unlike his character that we need to know why he didn't change pews earlier," DiFrisco said.

 

[NorthSideSox72]

Just saw a blurb for the 10 NBC news that Wright said something new and theyll talk about it on the news. ANyone know what it is?

I doubt most people care.

 

[DrunkBomber]

I doubt most people care.

Youre probably right. Nobody has talked about this guy at all. Out of all the people to be an apologist for I honestly dont get it?

[NorthSideSox72]

Youre probably right. Nobody has talked about this guy at all. Out of all the people to be an apologist for I honestly dont get it?

What are you talking about? I assume the "nobody has talked about this guy at all" thing is sarcasm, but, my point was, most people have gotten over it one way or another. They made their judgement, and life goes on. They decided its irrelevant, or decided it makes them think less of Obama, or whatever. Therefore, most people don't care anymore.

 

And despite your protestations otherwise, I have seen no one here be an apologist for Rev Wright.

 

[DrunkBomber]

What are you talking about? I assume the "nobody has talked about this guy at all" thing is sarcasm, but, my point was, most people have gotten over it one way or another. They made their judgement, and life goes on. They decided its irrelevant, or decided it makes them think less of Obama, or whatever. Therefore, most people don't care anymore.

 

And despite your protestations otherwise, I have seen no one here be an apologist for Rev Wright.

I wasnt drudging up old news or anything. Its something new that came out tonight so I added it to the thread and you decided to throw in that nobody cares like Im harping on something from the past.

[DrunkBomber]

re-read your post - you say that the quotes "weren't taken out of context". How do you know? How much of this guys sermons have you seen?

 

No one is contending that his words in the videos are not racist. They are, and they are terrible things for someone to say. It may mean that Rev Wright is a racist slimeball. Or, it may mean that in his 20 years of sermonizing, he's said a few stupid things - kind of like all the rest of us.

 

If you can't see that distinction, then I think you need to look up the definition of the word "context". Then try the phrase "jumping to conclusions". No one is saying he ISN'T a racist... they are saying that he MIGHT be.

IMO this is very close to acting as an apologist.

[HuskyCaucasian]

Flashback: Wright's Letter To NYT About Obama

[YASNY]

How Mainstream Media Continue to Deify Obama

 

Just a snippet:

 

Can you imagine what the Philadelphia Daily News would be writing if John McCain had a 20-year association with someone like David Duke and refused to end that association? Would they write: "He didn't throw David Duke under the bus. John McCain embraced David Duke despite his flaws, despite their disagreements." This comparison makes it clear that the Daily News is so blinded by its own bias and its attempt to set up the coronation of Mr. Obama that it has lost its ability to think and reason rationally and logically. It ought to stick to sports, which it does best.

Edited March 28, 2008 by YASNY

[lostfan]

Mmkay really, in all honesty, Wright is nothing at all like David Duke or any other white supremacist leader. For someone to think that is cognitive dissonance in action.

[southsider2k5]

Mmkay really, in all honesty, Wright is nothing at all like David Duke or any other white supremacist leader. For someone to think that is cognitive dissonance in action.

 

That's kind of an interesting side point that might be worth exploring. How differently are people like Rev Wright treated when they say racist and controversial things, versus someone like say Don Imus or Geraldine Ferraro?

[lostfan]

That's kind of an interesting side point that might be worth exploring. How differently are people like Rev Wright treated when they say racist and controversial things, versus someone like say Don Imus or Geraldine Ferraro?

White people are held to a pretty silly standard a lot of times, at least those that are public figures anyway.

 

I wouldn't say Imus and Ferraro are the best examples though, Imus painted himself into his own corner (although I think the level of backlash was kind of crazy) and Ferraro, while there might've been some degree of truth in what she was saying, was only pointing it out to use as a subtle strike against Obama which is an inappropriate and unnecessary. And then she tried to act like that wasn't what she was trying to do. Of course she was, why even bring it up otherwise?

 

A better example would be when Rush Limbaugh said Donovan McNabb was overrated and that the media has a tendency to want to see black QBs do well. Honestly in my mind there was nothing controversial about what he said, only because Limbaugh said it and they were just waiting for a reason to get on him about something. If it was Stephen A. Smith saying it nobody would've even noticed.

[YASNY]

Mmkay really, in all honesty, Wright is nothing at all like David Duke or any other white supremacist leader. For someone to think that is cognitive dissonance in action.

 

There's a lot more in that column than just the Duke comparison.

[lostfan]

I didn't read the article (don't have time to, I'm at work), I'm just talking about that specific quote. I don't really like that kind of intentionally polarized rhetoric, it's a pet peeve of mine. Ironically it's just as divisive as anything Wright's said.

[YASNY]

I didn't read the article (don't have time to, I'm at work), I'm just talking about that specific quote. I don't really like that kind of intentionally polarized rhetoric, it's a pet peeve of mine. Ironically it's just as divisive as anything Wright's said.

 

The point I was trying to emphasize, the bold text part, was the pointing out of the bias on the part of the other paper. I agree, I believe the Duke remark, and there is a Hitler remark in the column, that are 'over the top' in my opinion. I personally wouldn't have gone there.

[lostfan]

The point I was trying to emphasize, the bold text part, was the pointing out of the bias on the part of the other paper. I agree, I believe the Duke remark, and there is a Hitler remark in the column, that are 'over the top' in my opinion. I personally wouldn't have gone there.

I can agree with pro-Obama bias though, some of the media's been trying to self-police itself in the last few weeks (CNN sometimes) but some of the coverage is still pretty unapologetically biased. I actually think it's kind of funny.

[Controlled Chaos]

Obama’s Former Pastor Getting $1.6M Home in Retirement

by FOXNews.com

Thursday, March 27, 2008

 

 

 

The four- bedroom, 10,000-plus square foot home that Trinity United Church of Christ is building for Reverend Jeremiah Wright. (FNC Photo)

 

 

By Jeff Goldblatt

 

This was supposed to be the week that the Rev. Jeremiah Wright Jr. returned to the pulpit to preach for the first time since his anti-American sermons generated nationwide outrage and drew condemnation from his longtime parishioner, Barack Obama.

 

But, citing security concerns, Wright canceled his speaking engagements in Florida and Texas. A spokeswoman at his former church in Chicago said his schedule is pending.

 

A two-week FOX News investigation, however, has uncovered where Wright will be spending a good deal of his time in retirement, and it is a far cry from the impoverished Chicago streets where the preacher led his ministry for 36 years.

 

FOX News has uncovered documents that indicate Wright is about to move to a 10,340-square-foot, four-bedroom home in suburban Chicago, currently under construction in a gated community.

 

While it is not uncommon for an accomplished clergyman to live in luxury, Wright’s retirement residence is raising some questions.

 

“Some people think deals like this are hypocritical. Jeremiah Wright himself criticizes people from the pulpit for middle classism, for too much materialism,” said Andrew Walsh, Associate Director of the Leonard E. Greenberg Center for the Study of Religion in Public Life with Trinity College in Hartford, Conn.

 

“So he’s entitled to be tweaked here. So the question really is, how unusual is this? Somewhat unusual,” he said.

 

According to documents obtained from the Cook County Register of Deeds, Wright purchased two empty lots in Tinley Park, Ill., from Chicago restaurant chain owner Kenny Lewis for $345,000 in 2004.

 

Documents show Wright sold the property to his church, Trinity United, in December 2006, with the proceeds going to a living trust shared with his wife, Ramah.

 

The sale price for the land was just under $308,000, about $40,000 less than Wright’s original purchase two years earlier.

 

Public records of the sale show Trinity initially obtained a $10 million bank loan to purchase the property and build a new house on the land.

 

But further investigation with tax and real estate attorneys showed that the church had actually secured a $1.6 million mortgage for the home purchase, and attached a $10 million line of credit, for reasons unspecified in the paperwork.

 

There is apparently nothing wrong with that, according to non-profit tax expert Jack Siegel of Charity Governance Consulting, who examined public documents FOX News obtained from the Cook County Register of Deeds and the Village of Tinley Park.

 

“At least looking at it from a public document standpoint, there’s clearly not a problem that jumps out or some sort of wrongdoing,” Siegel said.

 

Siegel characterizes the transaction as unusual, however, because of the way Wright sold the property to Trinity and the way the deal was financed, with the attached $10 million line of credit.

 

Because churches are classified as private businesses, Trinity isn’t required to reveal its intended use for the line of credit. Nor, because it’s a non-profit entity, is it required to provide that information to the IRS.

 

A spokesman for ShoreBank, the Chicago-based financial institution that secured mortgages for the loans, said the deals were aboveboard.

 

Wright did not respond to repeated calls for comment, and Trinity United refused to discuss the specifics of the home it is building for him and the way the deal was financed.

 

The church referred FOX News to its denominational headquarters in Cleveland, which provided a statement of support:

 

“It is customary and appropriate in many Christian denominations, including the United Church of Christ, for local churches to offer housing provisions for retiring clergy, especially in cases where pastors have served long-term pastorates. We support efforts by our 5,700 local churches to ensure that retiring pastors and spouses have continuing housing, adequate pension and health care, as an expression of our continuing appreciation for their years of service. Each local UCC congregation is free to honor a retiring pastor in ways it feels most appropriate to address the needs of that clergyperson’s circumstances,” wrote the Rev. J. Bennett Guess, spokesman for UCC’s national office.

 

“This is about how these kinds of churches work,” notes Walsh. “These pastors who made big successful churches are real valuable commodities. Is it morally wrong? Well, Protestants don’t have the idea that their religious leaders should live modestly or aesthetically. We’re not talking Buddhist monks or Catholic priests here. There’s no tradition that says they have to live poor.”

 

Tradition at Trinity United centers on a congregation that’s unashamedly black and unapologetically Christian, according to the church’s website. There are also no apologies from the church for the home it’s building for its former senior pastor, who nurtured a religious empire that grew to have more than 8,000 congregants.

 

 

[lostfan]

Unless the church is doing something illegal, which apparently they are not, I see absolutely zero wrong with that and I actually don't even think it's newsworthy.

 

By the way, it sounds like the guy he bought the house from is the owner of Kenny's Ribs. I love that place.

[YASNY]

Unless the church is doing something illegal, which apparently they are not, I see absolutely zero wrong with that and I actually don't even think it's newsworthy.

 

By the way, it sounds like the guy he bought the house from is the owner of Kenny's Ribs. I love that place.

 

Agreed. The church has the right to do as it sees fit.

[NorthSideSox72]

Just as an interesting note to the subject... it appears a key member of the Bush Administration is in concert with Obama's views on race relations in the US a this time.

 

[iamshack]

Great! The Reverend is going to be a Tinley Parkian! A neighbor!