Crede likely to start on opening day

[Reddy]

Well he plays on that team doesn't he? I would not want him on the Sox. His K's are a killer in the middle of that lineup.

 

!?!?!?!?!? you wouldnt want adam dunn on the sox? what planet are you freaking on? who cares about K's when you walk 100 times, hit 40 homers and drive in 100?

 

 

so i assume it was Jim Thome's fault last year that we won 72 games. he was on this team you know.

[SoxWS05]

!?!?!?!?!? you wouldnt want adam dunn on the sox? what planet are you freaking on? who cares about K's when you walk 100 times, hit 40 homers and drive in 100?

so i assume it was Jim Thome's fault last year that we won 72 games. he was on this team you know.

Not to start anything over Adam Dunne, but I bet if you find a Reds board there are a hundred fans complaining about him and how he should of been traded to years ago, now his big salary his hindering there chances of signing another starting pitcher or the development of some AAA player

[southsideirish71]

Not to start anything over Adam Dunne, but I bet if you find a Reds board there are a hundred fans complaining about him and how he should of been traded to years ago, now his big salary his hindering there chances of signing another starting pitcher or the development of some AAA player

 

Using a message boards opinion as a barometer of a players value is slightly askew logic at best. Go to a Yankees board, you will see a thread talking about getting rid of that bum Arod.

[iamshack]

Ok, so I just wasted several minutes of my life reading through this entire s***storm.

 

This thread is like every negative poster on Soxtalk's wet dream.

 

Why is it that some people actually enjoy when the organization does something they disagree with so they have a chance to tell everyone else how much smarter they are than the general manager?

 

As much as all the pro-Fields people want to poke fun at "Crede's Crew," and facetiously compare Joe to Brooks Robinson, one would think Josh Fields was David Wright or Ryan Braun.

 

The world will not end if Josh has to go to Charlotte for a few hundred ab's, guys. Just like the world will not end if Joe is traded to SF or LAD.

 

But wow, why do some of you even watch the team or read the newspaper if it makes you so damned miserable?

 

Some of you are incredibly-gifted whiners.

[Kyyle23]

Ok, so I just wasted several minutes of my life reading through this entire s***storm.

 

This thread is like every negative poster on Soxtalk's wet dream.

 

Why is it that some people actually enjoy when the organization does something they disagree with so they have a chance to tell everyone else how much smarter they are than the general manager?

 

As much as all the pro-Fields people want to poke fun at "Crede's Crew," and facetiously compare Joe to Brooks Robinson, one would think Josh Fields was David Wright or Ryan Braun.

 

The world will not end if Josh has to go to Charlotte for a few hundred ab's, guys. Just like the world will not end if Joe is traded to SF or LAD.

 

But wow, why do some of you even watch the team or read the newspaper if it makes you so damned miserable?

 

Some of you are incredibly-gifted whiners.

 

 

pfft you are no fun

[RockRaines]

Ok, so I just wasted several minutes of my life reading through this entire s***storm.

 

This thread is like every negative poster on Soxtalk's wet dream.

 

Why is it that some people actually enjoy when the organization does something they disagree with so they have a chance to tell everyone else how much smarter they are than the general manager?

 

As much as all the pro-Fields people want to poke fun at "Crede's Crew," and facetiously compare Joe to Brooks Robinson, one would think Josh Fields was David Wright or Ryan Braun.

 

The world will not end if Josh has to go to Charlotte for a few hundred ab's, guys. Just like the world will not end if Joe is traded to SF or LAD.

 

But wow, why do some of you even watch the team or read the newspaper if it makes you so damned miserable?

 

Some of you are incredibly-gifted whiners.

It comes down to for the White Sox Josh Fields>Joe Crede. No whining needed.

 

The only positive is that KW at least is waiting for some value for Crede, thats if Crede ever hits the ball.

[fathom]

Ok, so I just wasted several minutes of my life reading through this entire s***storm.

 

This thread is like every negative poster on Soxtalk's wet dream.

 

Why is it that some people actually enjoy when the organization does something they disagree with so they have a chance to tell everyone else how much smarter they are than the general manager?

 

As much as all the pro-Fields people want to poke fun at "Crede's Crew," and facetiously compare Joe to Brooks Robinson, one would think Josh Fields was David Wright or Ryan Braun.

 

The world will not end if Josh has to go to Charlotte for a few hundred ab's, guys. Just like the world will not end if Joe is traded to SF or LAD.

 

But wow, why do some of you even watch the team or read the newspaper if it makes you so damned miserable?

 

Some of you are incredibly-gifted whiners.

 

It's sad, as there was actual legitimate baseball conversation in this thread. I can't wait for someone to open up the all-negative thread so we have to stop reading comments that have nothing to do with the Sox or baseball, and are just attacks on what people think.

[lvjeremylv]

You can't in all good faith send Josh Fields down to AAA after the season he had last year.

You mean the season he had in which he struck out 125 times in 373 AB? A rookie who strikes out 33% of the time needs more seasoning in AAA. Sure he hit 23 home runs, but that doesn't come close to canceling out all those strikeouts. And it's not like he put up a .400 OBP - it was .308, and he offers no speed.

 

Granted, Crede's OBP and speed are also not up to par, but you're acting like Fields had a season like Tulowitzki or Braun. The fact is he's a free swinger who needs more work to cut down his swing and get those whiffs to an acceptable level. Not to mention that his glovework at 3B is not where Joe's is. Our 3-5 in the rotation are going to need all the help they can get in the field, and having Joe at 3B bodes better for them than Josh. Crede puts the bat on the ball and is one of the best defensive 3B in the league.

[RockRaines]

You mean the season he had in which he struck out 125 times in 373 AB? A rookie who strikes out 33% of the time needs more seasoning in AAA. Sure he hit 23 home runs, but that doesn't come close to canceling out all those strikeouts. And it's not like he put up a .400 OBP - it was .308, and he offers no speed.

 

Granted, Crede's OBP and speed are also not up to par, but you're acting like Fields had a season like Tulowitzki or Braun. The fact is he's a free swinger who needs more work to cut down his swing and get those whiffs to an acceptable level. Not to mention that his glovework at 3B is not where Joe's is. Our 3-5 in the rotation are going to need all the help they can get in the field, and having Joe at 3B bodes better for them than Josh. Crede puts the bat on the ball and is one of the best defensive 3B in the league.

Fields OPS by month

June .607

July .823

Aug .773

Sept .936

 

SLG by month

.333

.490

.509

.568

 

 

He's improving with time, produced better than Crede offensively already and is in spring training as well. He's a better player for the Sox, hands down.

Edited March 19, 2008 by RockRaines

[iamshack]

It comes down to for the White Sox Josh Fields>Joe Crede. No whining needed.

 

The only positive is that KW at least is waiting for some value for Crede, thats if Crede ever hits the ball.

 

Well, I like Fields. I think he has some major power potential, and I think he has the athletic ability to continue to improve defensively at 3b. But I don't believe he is such a complete hitter at this point that he has nothing to gain by getting ab's in Charlotte, or that his progress will somehow be "stunted." For all those that rip Jerry Owens' statsheet apart last year because of his September success, take a look at Josh Fields' August and September.

 

He hit 9 bombs and 24 RBI in August, which is very solid from that standpoint, but he also put up a whopping .773 OPS that month. How one does that with 9 homers in a month, I did not think was possible. In September, which many commentators have told us is a skewed month for statistics because of all the call-ups he improved to .936, which is obviously much better.

 

I don't believe Joe has any permanent role on this team in 08' unless the team is competing with Detroit and Cleveland, in some part because of Joe. Otherwise, he will be moved and "the future" will begin with the ascension of Josh Fields.

Edited March 19, 2008 by iamshack

[RockRaines]

Well, I like Fields. I think he has some major power potential, and I think he has the athletic ability to continue to improve defensively at 3b. But I don't believe he is such a complete hitter at this point that he has nothing to gain by getting ab's in Charlotte, or that his progress will somehow be "stunted." For all those that rip Jerry Owens' statsheet apart last year because of his September success, take a look at Josh Fields' August and September.

What would be the benefit of him getting at bats against inferior competition vs getting at bats and continuing to improve in the majors where he belongs? He's already as good as Crede has been offensively, if not better, why make him take a step back in AAA? That makes zero sense. AAA isnt the magical land of baseball learning, he has nothing left to prove in the minors.

[iamshack]

He's improving with time, produced better than Crede offensively already and is in spring training as well. He's a better player for the Sox, hands down.

 

You cannot honestly argue their springs against one another. That's just not fair, considering Joe's coming back from injury. Secondly, it's not exactly a David vs. Goliath comparison. Fields is hitting .242 to Crede's .135.

[Kyyle23]

You cannot honestly argue their springs against one another. That's just not fair, considering Joe's coming back from injury. Secondly, it's not exactly a David vs. Goliath comparison. Fields is hitting .242 to Crede's .135.

 

well, .100 points in the batting average is a lot

[iamshack]

What would be the benefit of him getting at bats against inferior competition vs getting at bats and continuing to improve in the majors where he belongs? He's already as good as Crede has been offensively, if not better, why make him take a step back in AAA? That makes zero sense. AAA isnt the magical land of baseball learning, he has nothing left to prove in the minors.

 

So now you're going to argue that Josh has nothing left to learn as a hitter? There is no one in the minor leagues from which he could learn something? He needs to learn more plate discipline. He needs to learn how to put the ball in play to the opposite field more. He needs to work on his footwork and timing at 3rd base.

 

Look, I don't disagree that Josh wouldn't substantially hurt the team if he were the starting third baseman. But I also don't believe that he had nothing more to learn as a baseball player, whether it be at Charlotte or not.

[iamshack]

well, .100 points in the batting average is a lot

 

Not when you're talking about it being .240 vs. .135 it's not, no. And that's ONLY because Josh is 6 for his last 14. They both have been disappointing this spring.

Edited March 19, 2008 by iamshack

[fathom]

So now you're going to argue that Josh has nothing left to learn as a hitter? There is no one in the minor leagues from which he could learn something? He needs to learn more plate discipline. He needs to learn how to put the ball in play to the opposite field more. He needs to work on his footwork and timing at 3rd base.

 

Look, I don't disagree that Josh wouldn't substantially hurt the team if he were the starting third baseman. But I also don't believe that he had nothing more to learn as a baseball player, whether it be at Charlotte or not.

 

Fields has quite a few homers to the opposite field. He's also our best breaking ball hitter. Quite simply, he struggles against good, high fastballs. The only level he can get experience with that is in the majors.

Edited March 19, 2008 by fathom

[lvjeremylv]

Fields OPS by month

June .607

July .823

Aug .773

Sept .936

 

SLG by month

.333

.490

.509

.568

He's improving with time, produced better than Crede offensively already and is in spring training as well. He's a better player for the Sox, hands down.

That is a good sign that he improved as the season went on, but I still am not willing to accept a hitter who offers only power to strike out 33% of the time. That's just unacceptable unless your name is Ryan Howard. This spring he's struck out 9 times in 33 at-bats, so that's a *slight* improvement. I still think a few months down in AAA will do nothing but help him. He can work on his fundamentals and try to learn some discipline at the plate.

 

And I don't think it's fair to judge Crede on how he's playing this Spring. The main thing is that he shows he's healthy after coming off BACK SURGERY. Cut the guy some friggin slack. He played hurt for a couple of seasons, tanked last year, and it was time to have the surgery done. I think it will take probably the month of April before he finds his stroke at the plate, and from there he can up his trade value and come summer, we can deal him for someone better than is being offered now, and Josh can come back to the club an improved hitter. Sounds win-win to me.

 

I have Josh on my fantasy team, but it's a keeper league so I'm willing to forgo the first half of the 2008 season if it means my fantasy team will be better in the long-run, and I think Sox fans should be willing to do the same.

[iamshack]

Fields has quite a few homers to the opposite field.

 

Right, and he struck out 125 times, too. Maybe he could hit a few singles and doubles to the opposite field instead of his all or nothing approach.

[iamshack]

Fields has quite a few homers to the opposite field. He's also our best breaking ball hitter. Quite simply, he struggles against good, high fastballs. The only level he can get experience with that is in the majors.

 

That's bs and you know it, Fathom. He struck out 196 times in 647 ab's in Charlotte. There's plenty of experience he could gain there.

[fathom]

Fields had a 1.07 OPS vs LHP. His bat needs to be in the lineup, period.

[fathom]

That's bs and you know it, Fathom. He struck out 196 times in 647 ab's in Charlotte. There's plenty of experience he could gain there.

 

Actually, a few weeks ago, he was saying that he's not used to facing 95/96 mph fastballs like he's been seeing in ST so far. He said that he didn't see that in the minors, and then when he came up last year, pitchers were throwing close to 91/92 mph. No one on this site knows more about the Intl League than me, and I guarantee you there's not a lot of fireballers down there. There's a reason crafty southpaws like J.P. Howell dominate that league.

[fathom]

FWIW, Crede has a career OPS against LHP of .790. Fields OPS is almost .300 higher than his. This really should be a no-brainer for a team that blows vs LHP.

[iamshack]

Fields had a 1.07 OPS vs LHP. His bat needs to be in the lineup, period.

 

Unfortunately, that was in only 106 ab's. The .677 OPS against RHP came in 267 ab's.

[TitoMB345]

Seriously, I am sick and tired of seeing our young players go to waste.

 

Maybe someone else needs to be let go... and he doesn't play baseball.

 

Flame on.

[iamshack]

Actually, a few weeks ago, he was saying that he's not used to facing 95/96 mph fastballs like he's been seeing in ST so far. He said that he didn't see that in the minors, and then when he came up last year, pitchers were throwing close to 91/92 mph. No one on this site knows more about the Intl League than me, and I guarantee you there's not a lot of fireballers down there. There's a reason crafty southpaws like J.P. Howell dominate that league.

 

So what is he striking out on 196 times down there?