3/25 roster rumbles

[lostfan]

I mean I worry as well, what if Uribe puts up .270 with 30HR's this season?

 

Do the Sox re-sign him to a big contract? Because I think he would pack it in ALA Beltre, because he hasn't performed any other season when his contract hasn't been on the line.

Hell no.

[BearSox]

I mean I worry as well, what if Uribe puts up .270 with 30HR's this season?

 

Do the Sox re-sign him to a big contract? Because I think he would pack it in ALA Beltre, because he hasn't performed any other season when his contract hasn't been on the line.

trade him at the deadline... and hopefully Crede and Dye will follow him.

[scenario]

So that leaves the team now with decisions on... the last bullpen spot (Masset, Wassermann, Carrasco)... backup C (Hall, Lucy, Phillips)... 2B (Uribe, Ramirez, Ozuna) and the last two bench spots (Uribe, Ramirez, Ozuna, Quentin, Anderson).

 

Phillips was assigned to minor league camp today.

[santo=dorf]

I think that means Quentin and Anderson are BOTH ON THE TEAM FOR OPENING DAY.

Probably still behind Ramirez on the depth chart.

[Reddy]

I suppose now is a bad time to let you know Edwards dropped out of the race?

 

WWHHHAAAAT?????

[Dick Allen]

I mean I worry as well, what if Uribe puts up .270 with 30HR's this season?

 

Do the Sox re-sign him to a big contract? Because I think he would pack it in ALA Beltre, because he hasn't performed any other season when his contract hasn't been on the line.

I'm Uribe's biggest fan, but I would never give him a huge contract. If he has a big year, if your out of it, trade him at the deadline, if your in it, thank him very much for his efforts for $4.5 million at the end of the year and be done with it. Too many people are worried about guys leaving and getting nothing in return. You do get the player's performance that last year of his contract. I would guess most playoff teams have a couple of key performers playing on the last year of a contract, or at least were playing on the last year coming into that season.

[Reddy]

I'm Uribe's biggest fan

 

he has fans?

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

I mean I worry as well, what if Uribe puts up .270 with 30HR's this season?

 

Do the Sox re-sign him to a big contract? Because I think he would pack it in ALA Beltre, because he hasn't performed any other season when his contract hasn't been on the line.

 

I will take those kind of worries any day of the week.

[Shamrock4Life]

Ok sending Fields down does not bother me at all. We have Crede, he is gone at the end of the year no matter what, same with Uribe and Hall. So having Fields and Phillips in AAA is not that big of deal. They both do not earn Major League Service Time, thus putting off their arbitration years, iirc. Also unless we get a damn good deal fro Crede, he is not being moved until May 1st. Hall probably didn't accept his assignment to the minors (thus the two closed door meetings today). He already cleared waivers then also going in that line of thinking. I wouldn't be surprised to see Crede put on the waiver wire sometime soon, if he hasn't already been on there. This would free both up to either get claimed, probably would let Hall go and up Crede back off waivers, or, if cleared, able to trade them after the deadline, if i understand the rules correctly. We already blew our load with Uribe on this though.

 

I don't like the idea of Quinten being on the 25 man to open the season, I would rather bring in another arm in the bullpen for April, since Ramirez is going to get limited time at 2nd with Uribe there and would make a good/serviceable 4th outfielder until Owens is completely healthy, which after a week long minor league assignment/extended spring training, will be in mid to late April. Hopefully Anderson can stake his new claim to the CF job by then.

 

The key to all these moves is looking at how they set up the future, not just how they set up this year. There are a lot to the "rules" of Major League Baseball, as evidenced by the whole Uribe waiver wire saga, that we don't understand that I am sure are affecting many of these personal moves. And you are a dumb ass manager of a business if you don't under stand all the rules.

 

This team should be pretty damn good come 2010, even without depth in the minors. The Tigers should have passed their time by then and you never know the Indians could start selling off some of their players that are ARB eligible and becoming free agents. Just a thought.

Edited March 26, 2008 by Shamrock4Life

[witesoxfan]

Ok sending Fields down does not bother me at all. We have Crede, he is gone at the end of the year no matter what, same with Uribe and Hall. So having Fields and Phillips in AAA is not that big of deal. They both do not earn Major League Service Time, thus putting off their arbitration years, iirc. Also unless we get a damn good deal fro Crede, he is not being moved until May 1st. Hall probably didn't accept his assignment to the minors (thus the two closed door meetings today). He already cleared waivers then also going in that line of thinking. I wouldn't be surprised to see Crede put on the waiver wire sometime soon, if he hasn't already been on there. This would free both up to either get claimed, probably would let Hall go and up Crede back off waivers, or, if cleared, able to trade them after the deadline, if i understand the rules correctly. We already blew our load with Uribe on this though.

 

You'd be correct on the waiver, but there's no real need to have Crede clear them now when the Sox have 4 months to deal him still. The Sox put Uribe on waivers to see if teams actually did want him, and to see if they could deal him to said team that claims him.

 

Crede wouldn't clear, and the Sox don't want to give him up for nothing; they've already turned down giving him up for garbage on multiple occasions, so putting him on waivers doesn't make a lot of sense in that regard.

 

Phillips is also almost 31, so worrying about service time with him is something the White Sox aren't going to do.

 

The Sox haven't dealt Crede yet because they haven't gotten what they feel is a good enough offer. KW is probably valuing him like a top 10 3Bman with 2-3 years left on his contract who just so happens to be coming off a back injury, when really Crede might not be a top 15 3Bman in the league when healthy, and is probably among the bottom 10 starting 3Bman in the league to start the year, has 1 year left on his deal, and is going to get a ridiculous deal considering who his agent is. The value of KW and whoever has called is probably so far off it's unreal.

 

I don't like the idea of Quinten being on the 25 man to open the season, I would rather bring in another arm in the bullpen for April, since Ramirez is going to get limited time at 2nd with Uribe there and would make a good/serviceable 4th outfielder until Owens is completely healthy, which after a week long minor league assignment/extended spring training, will be in mid to late April. Hopefully Anderson can stake his new claim to the CF job by then.

 

Having 2 backup outfielders is almost a necessity, and I'm not about to count Ozuna as an outfielder.

[Vance Law]

I don't like the idea of Quinten being on the 25 man to open the season, I would rather bring in another arm in the bullpen for April, since Ramirez is going to get limited time at 2nd with Uribe there and would make a good/serviceable 4th outfielder until Owens is completely healthy, which after a week long minor league assignment/extended spring training, will be in mid to late April. Hopefully Anderson can stake his new claim to the CF job by then.

 

Huuuuh? 8 relievers?

 

and it's Quentin, folks

 

[harfman77]

I would have rather have had Bourgeouis on the team and Quentin rehab that shoulder a while longer. And then get him everday at bats in Charlotte until a trade/injury opens a spot for him. Lexi and Ozuna can play OF, and Swish can play all three OF positions if needed, I am sure BA could as well.

 

Personally I would rather have our AAA team start with Fields, Richar, and Ramirez across the IF, Quentin in RF and Lucy doing the catching. Give all these kids playing time together as they will be a large part of the core of this team next season as they will likely all be starters in Chicago next season. Then bring them up as the roster space allows. But I think it is important to build that chemistry among the youg players.

[NorthSideSox72]

Its interesting to read the Trib's take on the recent roster moves. The way they describe it, Ramirez is going to be a utility guy, so Anderson will be the starter in CF. Quentin will be the other OF.

 

Also, regarding the Toby Hall issue... the meetings apparently resulted in the team deciding that he is indeed healthy enough to play, so he's got that roster spot. Phillips was sent to minor league camp.

 

And so there is really now just one roster spot left open - the last bullpen spot. Will they take Wassermann, who has been more effective in 2007 and this spring but has options remaining, or Masset, who is probably better equipped for long outings and is out of options but who sucked in 2007 and this spring?

 

I'm pretty happy about Anderson and Quentin being on the team, and that Ramirez is looked at as a utility guy. And with Richar injured, I think Uribe actually makes the most sense at 2B. Too bad they couldn't move Crede, but, Fields could benefit from some AAA time anyway. So overall, when you look at the Opening Day roster, I think that the decisions made worked out pretty well.

 

[RockRaines]

If BA and Carlos get out to fast starts and Jerry is still on the DL, I dont think you will see him much this season. Both of those guys have the ability to be 100 percent better players, and if they do that, Jerry is in Charlotte.

[Princess Dye]

If BA and Carlos get out to fast starts and Jerry is still on the DL, I dont think you will see him much this season. Both of those guys have the ability to be 100 percent better players, and if they do that, Jerry is in Charlotte.

 

yr argument for keeping Masset is that no one else around fills his role. Who fills Owens' role as leadoff hitter?

 

again, you could slot someone in. But to me it's a bigger detriment to slot someone else in here.

 

Swisher vs. LHP is a .348 OBP last yr, he hit .250.... career #s lower

 

i'm confident Owens will get a long look when healthy to provide something better than that vs. righties. even if the other young OFs start strong.

Edited March 26, 2008 by Princess Dye

[NorthSideSox72]

Carrying 7 relievers (instead of 6), the need for a true "long reliever" is lessened. Someone like Masset has less value to the team than he would if they had a 6 man pen.

 

[Dick Allen]

yr argument for keeping Masset is that no one else around fills his role. Who fills Owens' role as leadoff hitter?

 

again, you could slot someone in. But to me it's a bigger detriment to slot someone else in here.

 

Swisher vs. LHP is a .348 OBP last yr, he hit .250.... career #s lower

 

i'm confident Owens will get a long look when healthy to provide something better than that vs. righties. even if the other young OFs start strong.

You have options for a leadoff hitter. Swisher, Cabrera, Ozuna vs. LHP. You need someone in the bullpen that can go 3 or 4 innings even if it isn't a very effective 3 or 4 innings, especially with the back end of the current rotation.

[Steve9347]

If Masset could record some outs this spring I'd say keep him. As it is, he's never shown much value since being a White Sox, and I don't really care if some other team pounces on him, because that would just make their Major League team that much worse.

[Princess Dye]

You have options for a leadoff hitter. Swisher, Cabrera, Ozuna vs. LHP. You need someone in the bullpen that can go 3 or 4 innings even if it isn't a very effective 3 or 4 innings, especially with the back end of the current rotation.

 

A true long reliever is more important than a true leadoff hitter? I doubt that's your intended point, but it kinda comes off that way.

 

The three guys you mention aren't stealing any bases. Now, Owens... if he can have even a .350 OBP, he's going to have a way better chance of taking second regularly than any of those guys. He doesnt have to have an amazing OBP to make us significantly better than a three inning reliever would.

 

 

Also keep in mind that moving Cabrera and Swisher up to leadoff takes them out of what they do best as well.

Edited March 26, 2008 by Princess Dye

[StrangeSox]

A true long reliever is more important than a true leadoff hitter? I doubt that's your intended point, but it kinda comes off that way.

 

The three guys you mention aren't stealing any bases. Now, Owens... if he can have even a .350 OBP, he's going to have a way better chance of taking second regularly than any of those guys. He doesnt have to have an amazing OBP to make us significantly better than a three inning reliever would.

Also keep in mind that moving Cabrera and Swisher up to leadoff takes them out of what they do best as well.

 

Stealing a few bases isn't nearly as important as hitting for some power, getting on base at a higher clip, and providing stellar, All-Star caliber defense in CF. Owens might be able to take second if he gets himself on base, but Anderson's much more likely to get himself to second on a hit to the gaps or get himself all the way home.

Edited March 26, 2008 by StrangeSox

[southsider2k5]

With the 3-4-5 we have in the rotation the long man is a must. Even if his innings aren't great, we need someone who can give us innings to save the rest of the pen for what they are needed for.

[southsideirish71]

Stealing a few bases isn't nearly as important as hitting for some power, getting on base at a higher clip, and providing stellar, All-Star caliber defense in CF.

 

Owens might be able to take second if he gets himself on base, but Anderson's much more likely to get himself to second on a hit to the gaps or get himself all the way home.

 

Well Owens has to steal bases, because he can barely hit anything but singles. Check the amount of XBH he has had for a "speed guy". I am waiting to see Owens hit the ball out of the infield a bit more and not have the bad groin for more than a day before I am willing to give him a chance.

 

 

 

[StrangeSox]

Well Owens has to steal bases, because he can barely hit anything but singles. Check the amount of XBH he has had for a "speed guy". I am waiting to see Owens hit the ball out of the infield a bit more and not have the bad groin for more than a day before I am willing to give him a chance.

 

Thats what I was saying. He HAS to be able to steal bases because he isn't very good at most other aspects of baseball.

[Dick Allen]

A true long reliever is more important than a true leadoff hitter? I doubt that's your intended point, but it kinda comes off that way.

 

The three guys you mention aren't stealing any bases. Now, Owens... if he can have even a .350 OBP, he's going to have a way better chance of taking second regularly than any of those guys. He doesnt have to have an amazing OBP to make us significantly better than a three inning reliever would.

Also keep in mind that moving Cabrera and Swisher up to leadoff takes them out of what they do best as well.

Personally, I would much rather have Swisher lead off than bat 6th. Why not have the high OBP guy bat before the guys who drive in the runs than after them? I don't care if he doesn't steal, he can hit himself to second or homer much more often than Owens will. Maybe if Owens was a premiere guy it could be an issue, but September and spring training aside, he's been below mediocre. The long man in the White Sox bullpen is going to be more important than usual if this team is any good this season due to the fact that the rotation isn't filled with innings eaters and the bullpen is stocked with 1 inning guys. 2 or 3 short outings by the starters in a 6 or 7 game stretch can really tax the bullpen if there is no one who can go 3 or 4 inning in it. I don't want Masset on the team, but if Wasserman can't give you those innings, the Sox are pretty much stuck with him.

Edited March 26, 2008 by Dick Allen

[Princess Dye]

Personally, I would much rather have Swisher lead off than bat 6th. Why not have the high OBP guy bat before the guys who drive in the runs than after them? I don't care if he doesn't steal, he can hit himself to second or homer much more often than Owens will. Maybe if Owens was a premiere guy it could be an issue, but September and spring training aside, he's been below mediocre. The long man in the White Sox bullpen is going to be more important than usual if this team is any good this season due to the fact that the rotation isn't filled with innings eaters and the bullpen is stocked with 1 inning guys. 2 or 3 short outings by the starters in a 6 or 7 game stretch can really tax the bullpen if there is no one who can go 3 or 4 inning in it. I don't want Masset on the team, but if Wasserman can't give you those innings, the Sox are pretty much stuck with him.

 

But Swisher against righties? OBP not that much more impressive than Owens' career OBP... so when you factor in the steals, i want to see if Jerry can make a leap this year offensively.

 

The way I see it, if it doesnt work out in a few months, we'll likely know we're out of it...and you're going to see Fields up and see the other OFs get playing time.

 

If Owens does make a leap this year, the team can be very good. It depends I guess whether you value being the most complete team possible right now, or more focusing on developing guys foremost.

 

 

 

 

EDIT: also against righties you want Swisher's power to be unleashed, since that's who he hits HRs off. I can see having him leadoff against lefties and sitting Owens, however. That's when he has OBP up and power down.

Edited March 26, 2008 by Princess Dye