This disgusts me

[EvilMonkey]

 

http://www.dailybulldog.com/stories/UMF_flags.html

 

Kinda convenient that the fire marshal showed up at 4pm to have it removed. I wonder when he first heard about it?

[Reddy]

they have the right to do it, whether you or i agree or not.

 

that's what's great about this country.

[EvilMonkey]

they have the right to do it, whether you or i agree or not.

 

that's what's great about this country.

I no where implied that they didn't. And the idiot who planned this deserves to be scorned by her fellow students, most of whom honored the flag and at least walked around. However, I want to know how this can be considered 'art'. And how come it took all day for the fire marshall to have it removed.

[FlaSoxxJim]

We've had this conversation here before. What I took home from it the last time around is that many people who fall over themselves protecting the symbol of our nation from being trod upon are happy to sit idly while the actual principles on which the nation was founded on are being trod upon by the people in charge.

 

It would be refreshing to see as much outrage over administration-sanctioned detention of people for years on end without charges being brought, secret rendition flights to black sites where torture is the norm and the goal, illegal wiretaps, etc. . .

 

But that is asking too much.

 

Protect the flag, but to hell with what we thought it stood for.

[StrangeSox]

I no where implied that they didn't. And the idiot who planned this deserves to be scorned by her fellow students, most of whom honored the flag and at least walked around. However, I want to know how this can be considered 'art'. And how come it took all day for the fire marshall to have it removed.

 

 

Did you read the article? It was a social experiment.

 

The flag installation was for an art in politics class assignment, taught by Kate Randall, which required students to execute a social experiment.

 

The whole point was to see if people would go out of their way to avoid stepping on the flag, and they did. She didn't just lay them on the ground to make some political statement.

[Kyyle23]

It was pretty interesting that 95-98 percent of students avoided stepping on the flags.

[Texsox]

I no where implied that they didn't. And the idiot who planned this deserves to be scorned by her fellow students, most of whom honored the flag and at least walked around. However, I want to know how this can be considered 'art'. And how come it took all day for the fire marshall to have it removed.

 

Would you feel better if he didn't call it art, but an experiment? Jim's comments ring true to me.

 

I'm planning a flag burning for the 4th of July during the fireworks display. I guess I could call it art, but didn't really think of that, perhaps it would attract a few more people if I did. The event should attract close to 400 people. I currently have about two dozen kids and several adults, from 11-65, planning on burning flags. I have had no shortage of people willling to dionate flags to be burned. At first we had to ask people but after word got around we were receiving calls and people just dropping them off. I have notified the Fire Marshall and it appears we will be well within our rights and will not endanger anyone. We also have at least two tv stations agreeing to cover the event.

 

The coverage will probably not be that wide and you would not have even known about it if I did not tell you. A youtube vid seems like a great idea.

[Texsox]

It was pretty interesting that 95-98 percent of students avoided stepping on the flags.

Which, interesting enough was about the same number I got when back in college a new mascot was painted on the lobby floor. We counted during the first week how many people avoided stepping on it, and it was about 99%

[EvilMonkey]

Would you feel better if he didn't call it art, but an experiment? Jim's comments ring true to me.

 

I'm planning a flag burning for the 4th of July during the fireworks display. I guess I could call it art, but didn't really think of that, perhaps it would attract a few more people if I did. The event should attract close to 400 people. I currently have about two dozen kids and several adults, from 11-65, planning on burning flags. I have had no shortage of people willling to dionate flags to be burned. At first we had to ask people but after word got around we were receiving calls and people just dropping them off. I have notified the Fire Marshall and it appears we will be well within our rights and will not endanger anyone. We also have at least two tv stations agreeing to cover the event.

 

The coverage will probably not be that wide and you would not have even known about it if I did not tell you. A youtube vid seems like a great idea.

Tex, you are not burning the flags as an expression of your free speech, or in an attempt to win an NEA grant. Totally different concept there, so lets move on.

 

Why is there a need for such an experiment? Don't you already know what the reactions will be? So all you do when you do that is push buttons hoping for a reaction. WOuld you and others be so ho-hum about it were the flags Iranian or Palastinian? I guess we won't know, since the moment those flags were to hit the floor, the PC police would be all over them. Oh, and the usual beheading statements would come out, and CAIR would issue press releases, and the principal would say the school is sorry, and arrange for CAIR to give a speech at the school.

 

What we could use is a line from the Filibuster standards in real life. 4. I will not post statements for the purpose of angering others. Apply that to 'experiments', or 'art'. This so-called experiment was pointless, and only served to piss off a bunch of people to varying degrees. While you and Jim might think some people get worked up over the flag for disingenuous reasons, for others, like the vet in the video, that flag means alot, and doing what was done is just like a personal insult to him. Political and social discourse is already at an all-time low, why push this button?

[Reddy]

Tex, you are not burning the flags as an expression of your free speech, or in an attempt to win an NEA grant. Totally different concept there, so lets move on.

 

Why is there a need for such an experiment? Don't you already know what the reactions will be? So all you do when you do that is push buttons hoping for a reaction. WOuld you and others be so ho-hum about it were the flags Iranian or Palastinian? I guess we won't know, since the moment those flags were to hit the floor, the PC police would be all over them. Oh, and the usual beheading statements would come out, and CAIR would issue press releases, and the principal would say the school is sorry, and arrange for CAIR to give a speech at the school.

 

What we could use is a line from the Filibuster standards in real life. 4. I will not post statements for the purpose of angering others. Apply that to 'experiments', or 'art'. This so-called experiment was pointless, and only served to piss off a bunch of people to varying degrees. While you and Jim might think some people get worked up over the flag for disingenuous reasons, for others, like the vet in the video, that flag means alot, and doing what was done is just like a personal insult to him. Political and social discourse is already at an all-time low, why push this button?

 

no you DONT know what the reactions will be. i for one am surprised that 95-98% of students didn't step on them. That means for all the bulls*** and hate that young people spout out about this country, turns out they still have respect for it.

 

you don't see value in that?

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

Trust me dude. I have no love lost for purveyors of this sort of thing, but when you rail against them and others do in the media, you are giving them exactly what they want..........attention. The best way to make this sick crap go away is to just ignore it.

[GoSox05]

It disgusts me that people actually want to stop people from expressing their rights. It's a free country.

[lostfan]

I don't think Alpha said anything about them not having the right to do things like this though. But, yeah, there are people that want to suppress rights which is the wrong way to go. However, if you want to scorn, ridicule, or be disgusted by something, that's perfectly acceptable too. I notice whenever somebody says something controversial and faces a backlash they try to hide behind the 1st amendment (or somebody tries to hide them for them).

[EvilMonkey]

I don't think Alpha said anything about them not having the right to do things like this though. But, yeah, there are people that want to suppress rights which is the wrong way to go. However, if you want to scorn, ridicule, or be disgusted by something, that's perfectly acceptable too. I notice whenever somebody says something controversial and faces a backlash they try to hide behind the 1st amendment (or somebody tries to hide them for them).

You are correct, I didn't say she shouldn't be allowed to do that, just that I think it was a stupid thing to do, and she should be subject to whatever ridicule and scorn that people who hated it feel free to throw her way. Sure, you have a right to 'free speech', but the people subjected to your crappy experiment or art also have that same right to let you know how they feel.

[Texsox]

Tex, you are not burning the flags as an expression of your free speech, or in an attempt to win an NEA grant. Totally different concept there, so lets move on.

 

Why is there a need for such an experiment? Don't you already know what the reactions will be? So all you do when you do that is push buttons hoping for a reaction. WOuld you and others be so ho-hum about it were the flags Iranian or Palastinian? I guess we won't know, since the moment those flags were to hit the floor, the PC police would be all over them. Oh, and the usual beheading statements would come out, and CAIR would issue press releases, and the principal would say the school is sorry, and arrange for CAIR to give a speech at the school.

 

What we could use is a line from the Filibuster standards in real life. 4. I will not post statements for the purpose of angering others. Apply that to 'experiments', or 'art'. This so-called experiment was pointless, and only served to piss off a bunch of people to varying degrees. While you and Jim might think some people get worked up over the flag for disingenuous reasons, for others, like the vet in the video, that flag means alot, and doing what was done is just like a personal insult to him. Political and social discourse is already at an all-time low, why push this button?

The fear of loss is a great motivator. Seeing the flag, belly exposed, and vulnerable is a great metaphor for your rights that are also being made vulnerable.

 

BTW, look around at all the worn and tattered flags being displayed. Look at the flags being displayed at night without a light. Out of order, etc. Cotton flags in the rain. Giant flags that are really being used as advertisements for gas stations and auto dealers. If you really want to express outrage, there are plenty of opportunties to do that.

 

And no, I am not burning the flag as an expression of my free speech. We are retiring those tattered flags I see everywhere. Funny, some folks were too cheap to take down their old flag and buy a new one.

[EvilMonkey]

The fear of loss is a great motivator. Seeing the flag, belly exposed, and vulnerable is a great metaphor for your rights that are also being made vulnerable.

 

BTW, look around at all the worn and tattered flags being displayed. Look at the flags being displayed at night without a light. Out of order, etc. Cotton flags in the rain. Giant flags that are really being used as advertisements for gas stations and auto dealers. If you really want to express outrage, there are plenty of opportunties to do that.

 

And no, I am not burning the flag as an expression of my free speech. We are retiring those tattered flags I see everywhere. Funny, some folks were too cheap to take down their old flag and buy a new one.

I agree that more people need to take better and proper care of their flags. I have brought bad flag etiquette to the attention of several people around my previous residence. Most people looked puzzled. There are not many people with flags at my current place, but the few that are there seem to be in good shape and displayed correctly.

[Texsox]

I agree that more people need to take better and proper care of their flags. I have brought bad flag etiquette to the attention of several people around my previous residence. Most people looked puzzled. There are not many people with flags at my current place, but the few that are there seem to be in good shape and displayed correctly.

 

So which disgusts you more. a flag display designed to provoke emotions of national pride, outrage, get people talking about the flag

 

or

 

a display designed to get you to pull in and buy gas there?

BTW, I fly a huge flag, so I'm a better American then anyone with a smaller flag

 

And I'm going to add flag smilies to every post to prove what a great American I am.

[EvilMonkey]

So which disgusts you more. a flag display designed to provoke emotions of national pride, outrage, get people talking about the flag

 

or

 

a display designed to get you to pull in and buy gas there?

BTW, I fly a huge flag, so I'm a better American then anyone with a smaller flag

 

And I'm going to add flag smilies to every post to prove what a great American I am.

First, I don't think displays like the one I linked are meant to show national pride, and if they are, they are not meant to show it in a positive light. "Oh look at the knee-jerk conservatives genuflecting to a piece of cloth!" . I am very disgusted when it is abused in order to piss someone off. We've seen it before, it is nothing new. Then I have different levels of distaste for the others. People who display them at their homes and don't take care of them the right way started off with good intentions and just got lazy or something. That should be OK with liberals, though, since it is all about intention and feeling good. As for the businesses, I think to some extent, depending on the business, it IS a display of American Pride. I have flag decals on my front doors, which I have to change every few months when they start to peel. Yeah, some of the HUGE flags seem like overkill, like the one by Berlins House of Tools that you can see from I-80.

[santo=dorf]

It disgusts me that people actually want to stop people from expressing their rights. It's a free country.

Glad someone else read the article and understood the point of the experiment. Now class, who would like to explain to me why it was so significant her father supported the experiment?

[Texsox]

First, I don't think displays like the one I linked are meant to show national pride, and if they are, they are not meant to show it in a positive light. "Oh look at the knee-jerk conservatives genuflecting to a piece of cloth!" . I am very disgusted when it is abused in order to piss someone off. We've seen it before, it is nothing new. Then I have different levels of distaste for the others. People who display them at their homes and don't take care of them the right way started off with good intentions and just got lazy or something. That should be OK with liberals, though, since it is all about intention and feeling good. As for the businesses, I think to some extent, depending on the business, it IS a display of American Pride. I have flag decals on my front doors, which I have to change every few months when they start to peel. Yeah, some of the HUGE flags seem like overkill, like the one by Berlins House of Tools that you can see from I-80.

 

 

Is it about what it shows or the emotion that the viewer feels? I saw people showing national pride when viewing that display. Did you see that display elicit any anti-American hatred? It reminds me in a small way of watching the towers come down. Stores sold out of American flags within hours of that happening. Seems to me that most people who saw it were puffing up their chests and talking about pride in the country. People were walking around it and thinking about the flag and how to properly show respect.

 

Viewing art is about the emotions that one feels. This one sparked your pride in America. Would you have felt that same adrenalin rush of American pride if it was a beautiful pastoral scene with an American flag on a green, grassy, hill?

 

So if liberals just want to feel good about their display of the flag, I guess conservatives really like this one.

[EvilMonkey]

Is it about what it shows or the emotion that the viewer feels? I saw people showing national pride when viewing that display. Did you see that display elicit any anti-American hatred? It reminds me in a small way of watching the towers come down. Stores sold out of American flags within hours of that happening. Seems to me that most people who saw it were puffing up their chests and talking about pride in the country. People were walking around it and thinking about the flag and how to properly show respect.

 

Viewing art is about the emotions that one feels. This one sparked your pride in America. Would you have felt that same adrenalin rush of American pride if it was a beautiful pastoral scene with an American flag on a green, grassy, hill?

 

So if liberals just want to feel good about their display of the flag, I guess conservatives really like this one.

I was happy that it was reported that most people avoided the flags. Towards the end of the video there are shots of 3 or 4 students just standing around on the flag trying to look cool or something. And it was hard to hear the actual talking in a lot of the video, but it sounded like the principal was trying to make the old vet feel bad for being there. I think you mentioned it earlier, we need some kind of better definition about art. Yes, this was an 'experiment', but it was an art experiment. She should get an F for originality.

[Texsox]

I don't get hung up on what they call it. What is interesting is many of the people that will get that pissed off, will not vote, have never mailed their congressman, will just parrot whatever some talking head says on TV. They will stick a dozen magnets on their car, but not mail $5 to one of the causes.

[EvilMonkey]

They will stick a dozen magnets on their car, but not mail $5 to one of the causes.

I hate those damn car magnets.

[Texsox]

I hate those damn car magnets.

I saw one I liked, actually it was the advertisement, I did not buy it, but I wish I had. It said

 

[santo=dorf]

Make sure you get all the mud off your shoes!