Baseball's safest record

[southsider2k5]

This is from my hometown newspaper, from a guy who is a pretty solid writer. I thought this would make for interesting discussion here.

 

http://thenewsdispatch.com/main.asp?Sectio...amp;TM=42736.28

 

Baseball's Safest Records

Adam Parkhouse

Sports Editor, The News-Dispatch

 

On the local baseball scene, it's been quite a year for the long ball.

 

There are four kids in the area who have been blasting balls over fences at a staggering rate for high school players: La Porte's Ian Nielsen, Michigan City's Jordan Hines and Marquette's Jack Bobillo and Eric Skwiat.

 

To have four guys like that in the area is pretty amazing. The home run is still the sexiest record in all of sports. After all, chicks dig the long ball, right?

 

At any rate, these four breaking records on a daily basis has gotten me thinking about the record books at the Major League level. I'm a junkie for baseball history. My buddy Dan and I have long debated the merits of certain records and we pride ourselves on being as knowledgable in this area as just about anyone.

 

So, in the spirit of records, I thought I'd introduce five major baseball marks that I feel will never be broken. These have sufficiently debated among my inner circle, so I'm pretty confident in these choices. Let me know what you think.

 

• No. 1 - Career wins by a pitcher, Cy Young, 511.

 

In all of sports, this is the single most unbreakable major record, in my opinion. I defy you to come up with a single statistic in basketball, football, hockey or golf or anything else that is more difficult to break than this.

 

Let me give you some perspective here.

 

The great Roger Clemens (keep your snickers to yourself) played 24 seasons - two more than Young - and has just 354 wins, or 157 short of Young. Greg Maddux has played in 23 seasons with five fewer wins than Clemens.

 

Now, the argument here is that Young played in a different era. That's very true, but in sports we don't divide records up by era. So Young will never - ever - be caught.

 

• No. 2 - Consecutive games played, Cal Ripken Jr., 2,632.

 

Anyone that plays fantasy baseball knows why this won't be done again. We're in an era of pampered players that get random days off just because. Even if someone were to stay completely healthy, they wouldn't approach Ripken's mark (which averages out to playing every game for more than 16 seasons) simply because there are too many days off.

 

Now, Dodgers outfielder Juan Pierre played in every game from 2004 to 2007, but that still leaves him remarkably short of thinking about passing Ripken. Again, this is an era debate, and fact is, guys just don't play 162 games anymore. Let alone do it for 16 consecutive seasons.

 

• No. 3 - Career strikeouts by a pitcher, Nolan Ryan, 5,714.

 

The big, strong Texan with the blazing fastball played 27 seasons and is the only member of the 5,000-strikeout club. Clemens is second at 4,672, and Randy Johnson is the first active guy on the list at No. 3 with 4,644. The Big Unit is widely believed to be at the end of his career rope, and he's still more than 1,000 K's away.

 

Now, this isn't so much an era thing, although it sort of applies. Ryan spent a lot of time pitching in an era where four-man rotations were more prevalent, and of course now it's almost exclusively a five-man rotation. But still, Ryan pitched more than 300 innings in a season only twice, though he struck out 300 batters in a season on six occasions.

 

It seems now a guy with 250 strikeouts will likely lead the league, meaning that pitcher would have to keep up a 250-strikeout pace for nearly 23 seasons. Not gonna happen.

 

• No. 4 - Career stolen bases, Rickey Henderson, 1,460.

 

This probably should be higher on the list, but maybe some unbelievable speed demon will come along someday that can challenge Henderson. However, that's unlikely.

 

Henderson is the only member of the 1,000-stolen base club, and the only active player on the all-time list is 41-year-old Kenny Lofton, who trails the future Hall of Famer by a mere 838 thefts. Basically, Lofton would have to duplicate his career total of 622 again, and then steal another 216 bases to tie Henderson. Unbelievable.

 

The next active player? Barry Bonds. Wow.

 

• No. 5 - Career triples, Sam Crawford, 309.

 

Crawford played from 1899 to 1917 with the Reds and Tigers, and the main reason why this record is safe is because of ballpark size.

 

Crawford played in the Dead Ball Era which contained spacious parks with massive outfields. Basically, hit it over the outfielders' heads and run all day.

 

The first active player on the career list is Lofton, in 106th place with 116 three-baggers. The next active player doesn't appear until No. 218, when Johnny Damon checks in with his 88.

 

So congrats to Young, Ripken, Ryan, Henderson and Crawford. You hold MLB's most unbreakable major records. Good luck to anyone who wants to make a run at these ridiculous numbers.

 

By the way, thanks to www.baseball-reference.com for the stats, pretty much the greatest Web site in the world. If you're a baseball nut and you haven't been to this site, then you're not nutty enough.

 

Contact Sports Editor Adam Parkhouse at [email protected] or 874-7211, Ext. 461.

[lostfan]

I think Henderson's 131 stolen bases in a season is pretty safe too. Nowadays even reaching triple digits is virtually impossible.

[rangercal]

No. 1 - Career wins by a pitcher, Cy Young, 511.

 

In all of sports, this is the single most unbreakable major record, in my opinion. I defy you to come up with a single statistic in basketball, football, hockey or golf or anything else that is more difficult to break than this.

 

Most technical fouls in a season - 41, Rasheed Wallace

[Palehosefan]

That and Gretzky's 93 goals, 163 assists, or the 215 point season for him will be almost impossible to reach in hockey as well.

 

I think Carlos Gomez could make a run for 100+ stolen bases in a season in a year or two.

 

As for the wins record, there's just no chance for anyone. Even if players start playing consistently into their mid 40's, they would still have to average just about 21 wins for 25 seasons.

[ChiSox_Sonix]

Fernando Tatis' 2 GS in one inning will never be beaten either. Forget the guy's name but 2 straigh no-hitters is probably safe as well.

[maggsmaggs]

How about Cy Young's career losses 316. Who the hell would break that?

[southsider2k5]

Fernando Tatis' 2 GS in one inning will never be beaten either. Forget the guy's name but 2 straigh no-hitters is probably safe as well.

Johnny Vander Meer

 

[shipps]

Fernando Tatis' 2 GS in one inning will never be beaten either.

It will be repeated.

[Balta1701]

I can totally understand the argument for Cy's numbers being on top because of the differing eras. But on some of the others...I think they're still catchable if someone has a little luck and determination. I think DiMaggio's streak has to fall somewhere in there with Ryan and Ripken.

[Gregory Pratt]

Ripken's is not unbreakable. All it will take is someone whose name and ability allow him to call some shots and play through, with some health luck. I'm not sure Ryan's Ks will ever be beaten.

[Steve9347]

I can't argue with this one. I don't see anyone ever approaching that record.

[Balta1701]

Ripken's is not unbreakable. All it will take is someone whose name and ability allow him to call some shots and play through, with some health luck. I'm not sure Ryan's Ks will ever be beaten.

Here's how I'd think about it...how far removed are we from that Era. The author notes Randy Johnson as a comparison, even though he's 1000 k's behind. If you look at Johnson's stats, he didn't really break in to the big leagues until he was 25. And, it took him from that point 3-4 years or so to really develop the control he needed to become a dominant pitcher, so his k's go up from 130 to 194, 228, 241, 308. In other words, there's several hundred k's there that could have come about by a team being able to develop his control earlier in his career. And he lost probably 3 or so partial seasons to injuries after that point, not even counting the seasons he's lost in recent years.

 

If you could bring up a Randy Johnson 3 years younger, develop him in to a pitcher rather than a thrower a couple years earlier, and then have him have a little better injury luck, you're basically at Ryan's numbers.

 

Likely? No. But possible. Randy Johnson is proof that the era hasn't changed THAT much, like it has with Cy, to make it totally impossible.

[lostfan]

Ripken's is not unbreakable. All it will take is someone whose name and ability allow him to call some shots and play through, with some health luck. I'm not sure Ryan's Ks will ever be beaten.

Ripken's is unlikely to be broken but certainly not impossible. It was only last year that Tejada had the longest active streak of consecutive games until he got hurt. Ironically he just so happened to play SS for the Orioles.

[knightni]

Sadaharu Oh's single season Japanese record will never be reached...by an American.

 

On three occasions, foreign players have challenged his single-season home run record of 55 (Americans Randy Bass in 1985, 54 HRs, and Karl "Tuffy" Rhodes in 2001, 55 HRs; and Venezuelan Alex Cabrera in 2002, 55 HRs). Each of these men played against teams managed by Oh late in the season with the record on the line. In each instance Oh's pitchers were either instructed or refused to throw hittable pitches, in order to safeguard Oh's record. Reacting to treatment of Bass in 1985, Japanese baseball commissioner Hiromori Kawashima termed Oh's team's behavior "completely divorced from the essence of...fair play."

 

The Bass/Oh record incident was used as a plot point in the Tom Selleck movie Mr. Baseball in which Selleck's character, preparing to break his team's manager's record for consecutive home run games, starts getting walked by pitchers when he comes to bat. And similar to Bass, Selleck would challenge the pitchers to throw strikes by gripping the bat upside down.

 

In the case of the Rhodes incident, Oh's pitching coach, Yoshiharu Wakana, took the blame by saying he gave the order to pitch around Rhodes. He then bluntly added, "I just didn't want a foreign player to break Oh's record.". Hawks pitcher Keizaburo Tanoue went on record saying that he wanted to throw strikes to Rhodes and felt bad about the situation.

 

In the wake of the most recent incident involving Cabrera, ESPN listed Oh's single-season home run record as #2 on its list of The Phoniest Records in Sports.

[daa84]

How about Cy Young's career losses 316. Who the hell would break that?

nobody will come close...this is the record that will certianly never ever fall....its less likely than 511 wins imo.....316 losses requires a guy to lose 20 games for 15 straight years.....considering 20 losses has happened like twice in the last 30 years it has no chance...no manager would ever stick with a guy that long

 

that said im not sure its a "record" in the sense that who the hell wants to hold it?

Edited May 12, 2008 by daa84

[ChiSox_Sonix]

Sam Crawford 51 career inside-the-park HRs and 12 in one season...of course that is because of the different eras.

[witesoxfan]

How about Cy Young's career losses 316. Who the hell would break that?

 

Jamie Navarro

[Benchwarmerjim]

he is not a player, but Connie Mack's 7755 games 3731 wins 3948 losses are probably safe

[easyw]

the Connie Mack and Cy Young records are most untouchable...

 

[Texsox]

Thanks for posting that, it was a great read.

 

In a bit of irony, a crappy article, full of half truths, mistakes, and lies actually sparks more cobversation that one that nails it the first time.

[Rooftop Shots]

This may be happen again in the future, but you never know. Wasn't it about 2 years ago where (I believe it was Bill Mueller from Boston) to be the first player in MLB history to hit a grand slam from both sides of the plate in one game. It's a rareity to be placed in that predicament, let alone to be able to pull something like that off.

Also how about the Sox Seattle game that I was at a few years ago, when Boone and Cameron hit back to back home runs TWICE in the same inning?

 

What other freaky stuff or oddball records that may never be broken can anyone else come up with? Pretty cool thread.