Balta1701 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 02:40 PM) Salmons is also a legit 6'6 and plays better defense than Gordon. No one is proclaiming that we're gonna make the Finals because of this deal, but we certainly improve our team NOW and help our cap situation in the future. And we have a shooting guard next season other than Thabo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 02:41 PM) This is a phenomenal deal for the Bulls. Now that I've looked through the 2010 cap numbers, I think you're probably right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daa84 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 06:40 PM) Gordon: 20.4 ppg Salmons 18.3 ppg Gordon: .450 FG% Salmons: .472 FG% Gordon: .417 3PT% Salmons: .418 3PT% Salmons is also a legit 6'6 and plays better defense than Gordon. No one is proclaiming that we're gonna make the Finals because of this deal, but we certainly improve our team NOW and help our cap situation in the future. Salmons averages 8.4 ppg for his career. He is the clear #2 option on the Kings. I'll be willing to bet if Gordon were on the Kings hed score 25 ppg. I'd also be willing to bet that Salmons scores in the area of 12-13 per game for the bulls from here on out. The bulls already have John Salmons sitting on the bench and his name is Larry Hughes. He's another guy, thats it, and I'm sick of the bulls always trading for just another guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daa84 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 06:42 PM) Now that I've looked through the 2010 cap numbers, I think you're probably right. yes, this deal is all about 2011 and beyond. For the future its a good trade because it means we are gonna make a run at someone. I doubt it makes this team all that much better this year. Will we make the playoffs? maybe, but we have been playing much better lately and who is to say we wouldn't have without this trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (daa84 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 06:46 PM) Salmons averages 8.4 ppg for his career. He is the clear #2 option on the Kings. I'll be willing to bet if Gordon were on the Kings hed score 25 ppg. I'd also be willing to bet that Salmons scores in the area of 12-13 per game for the bulls from here on out. The bulls already have John Salmons sitting on the bench and his name is Larry Hughes. He's another guy, thats it, and I'm sick of the bulls always trading for just another guy Gordon would be the clear #2 option on the Kings too. So what's your point? How you just compared Salmons to Larry Hughes is beyond me. Salmons actually makes his shots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daa84 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (rangercal @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 06:50 PM) Gordon would be the clear #2 option on the Kings too. So what's your point? How you just compared Salmons to Larry Hughes is beyond me. Salmons actually makes his shots. My point is that Salmons ppg are so inflated because he is the #2 on a horrible team. There isn't another team in the league that he would be a #2 on.....Youre right, Salmons has an impressive FG %, much better than Hughes..I should have been more clear, my point in comparing him to hughes was defensively where the previous poster was saying that hes a legit 6-6 and a better defender than gordon (saying anyone is a better defender than gordon is also like saying someone is better looking than rosie odonell) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan1 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (daa84 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 05:55 PM) My point is that Salmons ppg are so inflated because he is the #2 on a horrible team. There isn't another team in the league that he would be a #2 on.....Youre right, Salmons has an impressive FG %, much better than Hughes..I should have been more clear, my point in comparing him to hughes was defensively where the previous poster was saying that hes a legit 6-6 and a better defender than gordon (saying anyone is a better defender than gordon is also like saying someone is better looking than rosie odonell) Derrick Rose is the #2 on a horrible team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daa84 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 06:56 PM) Derrick Rose is the #2 on a horrible team... are we really sitting here comparing john f***ing salmons to derrick rose and ben Gordon? Salmons is a 30 year old journey man whos increased PPG is largely due to an enormous spike in 3p% over his career averages (largely suggesting luck), and has never been a solid starter for an entire year in the NBA til he got an just a dreadfully bad Kings team this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan1 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (daa84 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 06:00 PM) are we really sitting here comparing john f***ing salmons to derrick rose and ben Gordon? Salmons is a 30 year old journey man whos increased PPG is largely due to an enormous spike in 3p% over his career averages (largely suggesting luck), and has never been a solid starter for an entire year in the NBA til he got an just a dreadfully bad Kings team this year Clearly it's luck that Salmons is hitting a better % of his shots than Gordon. Look at the numbers. The Bulls are a horrible team too and I don't see Gordon putting up All-Star numbers. I agree that Gordon is better than Salmons, but what you miss in scoring you make up for in size and defense. The knock on Salmons is that he gets selfish sometimes and will force up some shots. You'd be a damn liar to say you couldn't say the same thing about Gordon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (daa84 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 04:36 PM) this franchise clearly is playing for 2011....why is everyone excited about this trade? Gooden is younger and better than brad miller, and was an expiring contract (though I realize its possible Drew won't play the rest of the year). Maybe Miller is a better defender with a bigger body, but not by much. John salmons is an average player on a horrible team which has caused his PPG to skyrocket...players like salmons are a dime a dozen, IMO he's barely an upgrade over nocioni...Part of me is angry because the NBA is clearly a superstar league and instead of landing the superstars over the years we end up with guys Brad Miller. On the other hand I think this sends a message that we will be real players in the 2010 FA class as we cleared up Noc's deal for that year Personally I think Miller is a much better solution in the paint for the Bulls than the black hole that is Drew Gooden. As you said Miller is a better defender and a bigger body but he is also a much better passer and I feel more comfortable giving him significant minutes than I did Gooden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daa84 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (WHarris1 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 07:13 PM) Personally I think Miller is a much better solution in the paint for the Bulls than the black hole that is Drew Gooden. As you said Miller is a better defender and a bigger body but he is also a much better passer and I feel more comfortable giving him significant minutes than I did Gooden. i'll agree to that....especially given that miller is healthy while gooden may not play the rest of the year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (daa84 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 05:14 PM) i'll agree to that....especially given that miller is healthy while gooden may not play the rest of the year... Exactly, and even though Gooden is expiring while Miller is not both deals are up by 2010 which is what is essential. Don't rule out Amare yet, three way with Minnesota involving Hinrich and Amare would be incredible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan1 Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 QUOTE (daa84 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 06:14 PM) i'll agree to that....especially given that miller is healthy while gooden may not play the rest of the year... Miller has been out since the beginning of February with an ab strain/hip flexor, though he was expected to play tonight for Sac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurcieOne Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 I like the Brad Miller fit, because you can run offense with Brad Miller -- he can pass the ball and isn't a liability in the post like Noah. we shall see how this all works out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 QUOTE (daa84 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 03:14 PM) i'll agree to that....especially given that miller is healthy while gooden may not play the rest of the year... Gooden practiced yesterday and was expected to play tonight. Not that I really wanted him to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 Rumor that Hinrich might be on his way to Minnesota for expiring contracts (Jason Collins and an unknown). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 04:02 PM) Rumor that Hinrich might be on his way to Minnesota for expiring contracts (Jason Collins and an unknown). That would put the Bulls at $35 million committed to 6 players in the 2010 offseason. They could potentially offer a max deal and still offer someone else $8-$10 million, depending on what the cap does by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 Another rumor per David Aldridge Sources indicate Hughes could still potentially be sent to Washington in exchange for guard Mike James and center Etan Thomas if the Bulls don't make any other big deals. Hughes contract is an asset in terms of 2010 but in this deal they would still be okay for 2010. Basically put if they pull this and the Hinrich deals off (combined with the trade already made) and the team will be essentially set to add in the missing piece in 2010 (ie the star to go along Rose which would move Deng to the ideal 3rd scorer spot and hopefully Tyrus and Noah have developed into a nice 4/5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 04:05 PM) Another rumor per David Aldridge Hughes contract is an asset in terms of 2010 but in this deal they would still be okay for 2010. Basically put if they pull this and the Hinrich deals off (combined with the trade already made) and the team will be essentially set to add in the missing piece in 2010 (ie the star to go along Rose which would move Deng to the ideal 3rd scorer spot and hopefully Tyrus and Noah have developed into a nice 4/5. I still like that Etan Thomas deal. That'd be the last we'd ever see of the patented "absolutely awful Bulls Small Lineup" unless matchups actually said it was a good idea, because we'd have a set of 4 big guys, all of whom need minutes. Both Thomas and James expire in 2010, so that wouldn't hurt our cap space at all, and that could set up some intriguing sign and trade deals or just resigning those guys deals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 Plus if that Hughes trade went down you'd be getting two different expiring deals which makes it easier to pull of a blockbuster trade if the Bulls eventually decide they'd rather make a big move at next years trade deadline to get that final piece. If Pax can pull this s*** off, he'll be looking really f***ing good in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 Sam Smith just nixed the Kirk Hinrich for expiring rumor. However, if the Bulls are able to get a draft pick (maybe top 5 or 7 protected from Minny) than I think that would be enough (on top of the expiring contracts) to make something happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daa84 Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 18, 2009 -> 07:05 PM) That would put the Bulls at $35 million committed to 6 players in the 2010 offseason. They could potentially offer a max deal and still offer someone else $8-$10 million, depending on what the cap does by then. these rumors have me absolutely convinced we will go big in that offseason...we are posturing along with the knicks...Hell we could go after lebron...if we have Rose, money to go after lebron, + 8-10 mil, lebron just might think that this is the best place for him...man that would be sweet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 If the Bulls pulled off those trades, they just became the front-runners, along with the Knicks to land at least one of the big name players. Wade or Lebron would look fantastic in Chicago but you also always have the option of Bosh/Amare. Plus if the Bulls wanted to, they could do sign and trades or even flat out pull off a trade next deadline to land one of those guys early and than negotiate another max contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 QUOTE (daa84 @ Feb 19, 2009 -> 01:13 AM) these rumors have me absolutely convinced we will go big in that offseason...we are posturing along with the knicks...Hell we could go after lebron...if we have Rose, money to go after lebron, + 8-10 mil, lebron just might think that this is the best place for him...man that would be sweet They want to go after Bosh or Stoudemire. From a very good source, they don't want Lebron or Wade because they want Rose to have the ball as much as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 They might instead opt to hold onto Kirk Hinrich until the off-season and than move him for expiring deals (plus Phoenix covets Hinrich so that could still give them leverage to pull off a deal for Amare if he becomes available again). Hinrich could than help the bulls make the playoffs this year and potentially even up his trade value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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