Official 2008-2009 NBA Thread

[whitesoxbrian]

I'll take Los Angeles, San Antonio, Dallas, Houston, New Orleans, Utah, Phoenix, Denver, Portland, and Golden State over that group. Easily. Actually, I think Portland will be in the playoffs over Golden State and Denver, and I wonder how Phoenix will do without D'Antoni, but the West is the loaded and superior conference, as always. But the East is getting closer and better.

IMO, Phoenix will struggle in the new system, Dallas always has tons of hype never lives up to it, GS still has no defense, Houston always chokes (although, I think they'll be the 3 in the West this year with Artest), and Denver isn't very good.

[danman31]

I'll be pleasantly surprised if this Bulls team makes the playoffs. I want to vomit at the site of that roster. Derrick Rose isn't a legit starter this season. Larry Hughes and Ben Gordon will be counted on to be the starting 2 guards. Tyrus Thomas or Joakim Noah will have to start. Ugh. They have a bunch of mediocre players. Someone is going to have to get a lot better. I know the East isn't that great, but I don't see the Bulls being that good.

[whitesoxbrian]

I'll be pleasantly surprised if this Bulls team makes the playoffs. I want to vomit at the site of that roster. Derrick Rose isn't a legit starter this season. Larry Hughes and Ben Gordon will be counted on to be the starting 2 guards. Tyrus Thomas or Joakim Noah will have to start. Ugh. They have a bunch of mediocre players. Someone is going to have to get a lot better. I know the East isn't that great, but I don't see the Bulls being that good.

Right now, I think the Bulls 3 best players are Thomas, Deng, and Noah (despite what he looks like and acts like).

 

Noah is a 10-10 guy every night, it looks like Tyrus really did improve his jumper and he looks like a 14-8 guy, and Deng is Deng- he'll get his 17-7 every night.

[ZoomSlowik]

Right now, I think the Bulls 3 best players are Thomas, Deng, and Noah (despite what he looks like and acts like).

 

Noah is a 10-10 guy every night, it looks like Tyrus really did improve his jumper and he looks like a 14-8 guy, and Deng is Deng- he'll get his 17-7 every night.

 

Tyrus is going to have a VERY hard time getting 14 a game, even if he plays better he's probably not going to get enough touches for much more than 10. There are just too many other options on the team and he doesn't really create his own shot.

[danman31]

Right now, I think the Bulls 3 best players are Thomas, Deng, and Noah (despite what he looks like and acts like).

 

Noah is a 10-10 guy every night, it looks like Tyrus really did improve his jumper and he looks like a 14-8 guy, and Deng is Deng- he'll get his 17-7 every night.

That's fine, but that's not a playoff team if that's true.

[nitetrain8601]

Tyrus is going to have a VERY hard time getting 14 a game, even if he plays better he's probably not going to get enough touches for much more than 10. There are just too many other options on the team and he doesn't really create his own shot.

 

What other options do we have? Gooden is a somewhat decent option. Noah is not all that really of an option. Deng seems like he only wants 17ppg (which why I think he's severely overpaid) and there's Gordon who is the only legit scoring option that we have. Rose would be lucky to average around 12 because historically, rookie PG's have the worst adjustment period of all the positions. Also keep in mind, Rose is more of a pass first PG.

[RockRaines]

Tyrus is going to have a VERY hard time getting 14 a game, even if he plays better he's probably not going to get enough touches for much more than 10. There are just too many other options on the team and he doesn't really create his own shot.

I will say this about him: His shot is 100 percent better than it was when we drafted him.

[nitetrain8601]

IMO, Phoenix will struggle in the new system, Dallas always has tons of hype never lives up to it, GS still has no defense, Houston always chokes (although, I think they'll be the 3 in the West this year with Artest), and Denver isn't very good.

 

But yet, none of those teams would finish below the 4th spot if you put them in the East, including Denver. The west is superior. They had a team with 50 wins miss the playoffs.

[ZoomSlowik]

What other options do we have? Gooden is a somewhat decent option. Noah is not all that really of an option. Deng seems like he only wants 17ppg (which why I think he's severely overpaid) and there's Gordon who is the only legit scoring option that we have. Rose would be lucky to average around 12 because historically, rookie PG's have the worst adjustment period of all the positions. Also keep in mind, Rose is more of a pass first PG.

 

We have 6 guys on the roster that averaged more than 10 points a game last season, and we added Rose who will get a fair number of attempts as well. It's quantity more than quality, unless there are some goofy lineups out there Tyrus will very rarely be a top-3 scoring option. Deng, whichever 3 guards get the most playing time (I would think Rose, Hinrich and Gordon), and probably Gooden will all likely get more attempts than Tyrus, maybe Nocioni as well depending on how the PT is split (god, I hope not). I'm not saying he's going to be useless, but I have a lot more faith in him consistently producing rebounds, steals and blocks.

 

Also, I wouldn't exactly call Rose a pass-first PG, at least not yet. While he can pass well thus far he's been just as effective as a scorer if not moreso, in fact I'd say he's more dangerous as a scorer right now. At Memphis he averaged about 14 points to 5 assists, and last night even with 27 minutes he had 5 assists and 9 shots to go with 6 turnovers. We're likely looking at a more balanced offensive player that will average something like 10 points and 5 assists for the near future, not someone that's going to be rack up 7+ on a regular basis.

Edited October 10, 2008 by ZoomSlowik

[nitetrain8601]

We have 6 guys on the roster that averaged more than 10 points a game last season, and we added Rose who will get a fair number of attempts as well. It's quantity more than quality, unless there are some goofy lineups out there Tyrus will very rarely be a top-3 scoring option. Deng, whichever 3 guards get the most playing time (I would think Rose, Hinrich and Gordon), and probably Gooden will all likely get more attempts than Tyrus, maybe Nocioni as well depending on how the PT is split (god, I hope not). I'm not saying he's going to be useless, but I have a lot more faith in him consistently producing rebounds, steals and blocks.

 

It's like having Ron Mercer on this team. I mean, the team is not going to score 50ppg so someone has to score. Look all at their efficiency ratings as scorers and none of them are any good minus Gordon and Deng. Deng will get 17ppg, Gordon could average up to 25, but he's your only consistent scorer. The Bulls will not throw up a ton of shots, they rely more on defense to get them a win. So while they had 6 guys average 10ppg last year, none of those are considered scorers. Someone has to score once in awhile and that's the case with the Bulls. Gooden will get more opportunities than Tyrus, I agree, Noc will probably have the same, and Hinrich will probably dig into Gordon's scoring. Either way the Bulls don't have any established scorers beside Gordon and Deng. Tyrus could easily become a 3rd guy. Now my opinion is, Gordon should be a #2 option, Deng is no more than a #3 for his lack of passion, and Tyrus would make a good #4.

 

Also, I wouldn't exactly call Rose a pass-first PG, at least not yet. While he can pass well thus far he's been just as effective as a scorer if not moreso, in fact I'd say he's more dangerous as a scorer right now. At Memphis he averaged about 14 points to 5 assists, and last night even with 27 minutes he had 5 assists and 9 shots to go with 6 turnovers. We're likely looking at a more balanced offensive player that will average something like 10 points and 5 assists for the near future, not someone that's going to be rack up 7+ on a regular basis.

 

And Rose is a pass first PG. He didn't show it much at Memphis simply because the offense calls for Iso's and scoring. Read up on the Dribble Drive Motion Offense. Basically you pass the ball to one guy on the wing, and you try to break your man one on one to score unless the guy downlow comes to double team, then you pass it to the low post guy. It relies on nothing but one on one action. Watching him at Simeon, he is by far a passing PG. Don't get me wrong, he'll score about 16ppg at his peak, but his impact will come from creating for others. I always said, because of his attitude, he should've switched schools because he loves to get the ball to other players and distribute. OJ loves to break his guy down, one on one so he would've excelled at Memphis.

[ZoomSlowik]

Again, I never said that they were all QUALITY options, but that's the way this team is built right now. There are an awful lot of people that have some scoring ability on the Bulls and all of them are better at creating their own shots than Thomas (which doesn't exactly say much). Whether they're GOOD shooters or not is irrelevant to the discussion, the bottom line is they're shooting. Unless there are injuries or trades he'll have to force the issue quite a bit with his shot and that's just not his style. Even if he hits 50% of his shots (something he didn't come close to last year, especially after he got more jumper happy), he's going to need 10+ attempts and several FT's to get there. I have a very hard time seeing that, especially since scoring isn't his strongest skill. Now rebounding, steals and blocks, that's another story.

 

Also, I'm not debating the fact that Rose has the ability to be an elite passer, but he's just not there yet. The offense at Memphis isn't exactly traditional, but it still plays to his strength, which is driving and either scoring himself or finding the open big inside or the shooters on the wing. It also took him quite a bit of time to fully adjust to the college game, and the NBA is likely to be no different. It's not a knock on him, it's just that very few PG's come in ready to effectively run an NBA offense in their rookie year. Right now he's going to be more effective as a Tony Parker type PG that consistently drives and tries to get his own shot since he's likely the best finisher on the team right now, down the road as he picks things up (he especially needs some work with the pick and roll, something the Dribble Drive Motion doesn't use) he has the potential to be an elite all-around PG like Paul or Williams. However, that's kind of moot for right now.

Edited October 11, 2008 by ZoomSlowik

[Baines3]

Living in San Antonio, I'm a Spurs fan but I don't think they will be all that good this year. Spurs are getting old.

[LosMediasBlancas]

So the first ever outdoor NBA game will be played about 10 minutes away from where I live. We have desert winds gusting up to 40 MPH right now. It might be interesting to tune in tomorrow night.

[kjshoe04]

Going to the Bulls game in Champaign tonight. I'm excited.

[whitesoxbrian]

They look awful. End of story.

[Kyyle23]

They look awful. End of story.

 

 

TTID?

[whitesoxbrian]

TTID?

What?

[whitesoxfan101]

What?

 

I assume he means "this team is dead".

 

As for the Bulls, I have a rule that I don't declare anything on teams until they've at least played a few regular season games, so let's wait and see. Tyrus and Rose look pretty good though, and if my eyes didn't deceive me, Nocioni and Gordon shot the ball well this evening.

[SleepyWhiteSox]

I assume he means "this team is dead".

 

As for the Bulls, I have a rule that I don't declare anything on teams until they've at least played a few regular season games, so let's wait and see. Tyrus and Rose look pretty good though, and if my eyes didn't deceive me, Nocioni and Gordon shot the ball well this evening.

 

Even after all of pax's terrible moves and non-moves, I'm still surprised they're going into the season with that glut of guards and practically no frontcourt. How is it possible that they did absolutely nothing throughout the whole offseason to address that??

[HeGone33]

I hate Kirk Hinrich. He sucks.

[kjshoe04]

I hate Kirk Hinrich. He sucks.

100% agree

[Felix]

Go Timberwolves

 

or something

[rangercal]

TTID?

 

it should be T.T.I.D

[ZoomSlowik]

This team has been awful offensively tonight outside of Rose. The D hasn't exactly been great either. I don't have high hopes for this season if Hinrich and Hughes is our starting backcourt like it was tonight.

[Balta1701]

This team has been awful offensively tonight outside of Rose. The D hasn't exactly been great either. I don't have high hopes for this season if Hinrich and Hughes is our starting backcourt like it was tonight.

Hinrich and Hughes should probably be starters # 4 and #5...once everyone else is gone.

 

The problem is they're paid like #1 and #2.