J. Vazquez for C. Young

[hi8is]

Think about it... if we didn't give Arizona their surplus of outfielders problem... we would have never had the chance to trade for Quentin.

 

So we have:

Chris Carter, Chris Young, Orlando Hernandez, Luis Vizcaino

 

for

 

Carlos Quentin and Javier Vazquez

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

It looks to me that we have the better of this deal. With Quentin edging out Young in terms of offensive production. Vazquez obviously is leaps and bounds better than Hernandez and Vizcaino.

 

Whatda you guys think?

[daa84]

chris who?

[ShoeLessRob]

I've grown to hate the name Chris Young.

[DBAHO]

Except that Young 11HR's and .826 OPS would look pretty good also.

 

If we still had Young, we wouldn't have Quentin or Swisher possibly.

 

But we got a dependable workhorse in our rotation, and both teams are doing well this season, so it's really and always has been a win - win.

[PoopsThompson]

Dynamite starter for a position player who hits like .230. always been a good trade.

[BaseballNick]

I thought this thread was trying to promote Javy for Cy Young.

 

Anyway, you have to give something to get something. We gave up a pretty good OF who is still getting better, and got a staff ace kind of pitcher in return. Both sides have to be pretty happy with the trade. At the time of the trade, we were dealing from a point of strength so I have no problem with it. Brian has the tools to be every bit as good as Chris Young.

[DBAHO]

And yet that average is getting higher, and he's on pace for a career high in OPS and HR's this season.

 

Chris Young is a quality player, no if's or buts.

 

But so is Javier Vazquez of course.

[elrockinMT]

And yet that average is getting higher, and he's on pace for a career high in OPS and HR's this season.

 

Chris Young is a quality player, no if's or buts.

 

But so is Javier Vazquez of course.

 

 

Do we agree that you have to trade quality to get quality?

[OilCan]

It was a good trade back then.

 

It's a good trade now.

 

 

No offense to the original post, but can we please move along?

[MHizzle85]

No offense to the original post, but can we please move along?

 

[MurcieOne]

Why do we need to move along? Its interesting to look back on this topic, especially after you add CQ to the equation.

 

If you don't like the discussion, move along and don't bother posting.

[KipWellsFan]

Seems like a great trade to me. Javier Vazquez is now one of the best starters in the American league, and it's probably safe to assume Young's stats would be slightly worse in the American league.

Edited May 27, 2008 by KipWellsFan

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

It was a good trade for both sides. Let's also not forget that we signed Javy to a below-market contract, so it's not just that we ended up getting a great starting pitcher, we ended up getting a great starting pitcher on a sweet deal.

[chitownsportsfan]

It's a bad idea to start doing this whole, "well if we never...then we never get CQ" kinda logic to trades. This is the sort of logic Knicks fans use when they talk about the Curry trade.

 

You look in trades, the great majority of the time, in a vacuum. Javy for Young looks like a win for both sides right now. Javy has given the Sox almost 500 innings of above average starting pitching. Young sucked up until this year but there is no doubt he'll be a 850 OPS guy with gold glove defense in CF for the next 5-10 years. Long term I think the DBacks win, but it's pretty close.

 

I was for the trade at the time despite loving Young. I thought Javy was the inning eater high K guy that would push the Sox over the top in 2006. They came up short be he continues to pitch quick well and reliably.

 

Really this is one of those trades that both teams walk away from feeling like winners, and rightfully so. Although damn would Young look awesome as our everday CF for the next decade.

[iamshack]

It's a bad idea to start doing this whole, "well if we never...then we never get CQ" kinda logic to trades. This is the sort of logic Knicks fans use when they talk about the Curry trade.

 

You look in trades, the great majority of the time, in a vacuum. Javy for Young looks like a win for both sides right now. Javy has given the Sox almost 500 innings of above average starting pitching. Young sucked up until this year but there is no doubt he'll be a 850 OPS guy with gold glove defense in CF for the next 5-10 years. Long term I think the DBacks win, but it's pretty close.

 

I was for the trade at the time despite loving Young. I thought Javy was the inning eater high K guy that would push the Sox over the top in 2006. They came up short be he continues to pitch quick well and reliably.

 

Really this is one of those trades that both teams walk away from feeling like winners, and rightfully so. Although damn would Young look awesome as our everday CF for the next decade.

 

Well, I disagree. I think you're right most of the time regarding trades in a vacuum, but we've heard anecdotal evidence now that developing good relationships with GM's can help with making deals in the future. Kenny has this sort of solid relationship with Gillick and Josh Byrnes. Byrnes is certainly not a bad guy to have a good relationship with.

[chitownsportsfan]

Well, I disagree. I think you're right most of the time regarding trades in a vacuum, but we've heard anecdotal evidence now that developing good relationships with GM's can help with making deals in the future. Kenny has this sort of solid relationship with Gillick and Josh Byrnes. Byrnes is certainly not a bad guy to have a good relationship with.

 

 

 

I agree. KW clearly has a good relationship with the Diamondbacks it it helped facilitate the Q trade. We as fans never really get to see the interpersonal side trades, but having a good relationship with your fellow GMs is certainly something that helps faciliate these sort of "everyone wins" trades.

 

That said, I think if you asked KW and Byrnes if (at the time) how highly they valued the "relationship" part of the Vasquez/Young trade they would have put it pretty far down on the list -- but it's a factor to consider when dealing for sure.

[iamshack]

I agree. KW clearly has a good relationship with the Diamondbacks it it helped facilitate the Q trade. We as fans never really get to see the interpersonal side trades, but having a good relationship with your fellow GMs is certainly something that helps faciliate these sort of "everyone wins" trades.

 

That said, I think if you asked KW and Byrnes if (at the time) how highly they valued the "relationship" part of the Vasquez/Young trade they would have put it pretty far down on the list -- but it's a factor to consider when dealing for sure.

 

Yeah, it's hard to tell.

 

I found it interesting though that Byrnes commented last week that Kenny had been on Quentin for a while now. I wonder if the fact that the Vazquez/Young deal worked out so well finally led Josh to crack...

 

I have also heard that Kenny basically gave Tadahito to Pat Gillick last year because he felt badly about what happened with Freddy Garcia. Probably not always a good practice, but if you develop a relationship with another GM where the goal is for everyone to win, rather than to rip the other guy off, some good things can happen. I've heard Mark Shapiro mention this before as well.

[Whitewashed in '05]

Putting that trade with Quentin in the mix really makes it a good deal for both teams and eases the wound when seeing Young making good plays and developing that power.

 

 

[witesoxfan]

Think about it... if we didn't give Arizona their surplus of outfielders problem... we would have never had the chance to trade for Quentin.

 

The Sox didn't give Arizona their surplus of outfielders. Arizona gave Arizona their surplus of outfielders.

[iamshack]

The Sox didn't give Arizona their surplus of outfielders. Arizona gave Arizona their surplus of outfielders.

 

Arizona re-signed Eric Byrnes to a 3-year, $30 million dollar deal.

 

That's who we have to thank for Carlos Quentin.

[lostfan]

Seriously this thread title does look like it's advocating Javy for a Cy Young.

[Balta1701]

Seriously this thread title does look like it's advocating Javy for a Cy Young.

And that's a bad thing because...?

[harfman77]

We gave up a lot to get Javy, but he has shown to be worth it. You cant really add Quentin into the mix as that happened almost two years later and has more to do with the emergence of Justin Upton and the re-signing of Eric Byrnes much more than anything that the Sox did. If you are going to include any deal you would have to include the Richar for Cunningham deal as that was the next in the series of trades.

 

 

[shipps]

Seriously this thread title does look like it's advocating Javy for a Cy Young.

Until you pointed it out thats what I thought it was.lol.Thats what I get for skimming over threads and not really reading them.

[Felix]

And that's a bad thing because...?

It'd be taking votes away from Danks/Floyd/Contreras, all of whom are having better season (although I can't believe Floyd will continue this pace, more walks than strikeouts is just disturbing).