The Democrat Thread

[NorthSideSox72]

Another lobbyist to the admin.

 

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=6735898&page=1

 

Why do symbolic gestures like that order not work? When they get in the way of allowing someone you want on your team.

This is pissing me off. And its incredibly stupid politically. I mean, Obama has all this political capital, and he is doing some good things with it. Why blow it with a couple cabinet nominations that could easily be filled without breaking his own rules? Just not a smart move at all.

 

[Texsox]

You know, I am no fan of Dick Cheney (in case that wasn't obvious), but I personally think that this was not a good idea. His and Bush's properties should really be permanently obscured. Just my opinion.

 

I think this is an example of the laws not keeping up with technology. I agree, Chaney's house should be off limits.

[HuskyCaucasian]

Obama to DC Schools: Grow Some Nuts... Dont Cancel School!!

 

"My children's school was canceled today, because of what? Some ice," Obama said, and all at the table started laughing.

 

"As my children pointed out, in Chicago school is never canceled," he continued. He said that in this weather, they wouldn't even stay indoors -- they would go outside for recess.

 

The President said he would have to bring "some flinty Chicago toughness" to Washington.

 

"When it comes to the weather, folks in Washington don't seem to be able to handle things," he said.

 

:headbang

[lostfan]

Obama to DC Schools: Grow Some Nuts... Dont Cancel School!!

 

 

 

:headbang

As a native Chicagoan who lives in this area, yeah he is 100% correct. They are such pussies here about the weather and nobody knows how to drive in it. Last year they canceled school because of a FORECAST. A f***ing forecast. And it was inaccurate, to boot.

Edited January 28, 2009 by lostfan

[lostfan]

LOL at one of the responses.

Another thing to remember: The DC Metro region has a larger population than half the states in the nation packed into a region barely 50 miles in diameter... Public safety is an entirely different beast here.

Ever been to Chicago there buddy? You can probably fit 3 DCs in one Chicago, except the street layout in Chicago is MUCH more organized than in DC.

[kapkomet]

Obama to DC Schools: Grow Some Nuts... Dont Cancel School!!

 

 

 

:headbang

He's going to tell everyone how to do everything, isn't he?

 

[NorthSideSox72]

He's going to tell everyone how to do everything, isn't he?

 

Oh come on, it was a funny off-hand comment. I don't think he is going to go tell the chief of DC schools to not close the schools.

 

[lostfan]

It trips me out... it's not like it never snows, or gets cold here. It's not like they don't have the equipment. They're just pussies, seriously.

[Balta1701]

Let's see...you want a media related rant? There are something like $25 billion in corporate tax cuts stuck in the stimulus bill to try to gain Republican/Business support. It goes to things like Casinos, oil companies, telecom companies, etc. Corporate tax cuts are some of the worst stimulus out there, because their multiplier effect on the economy is so low. Programs like health care, providing funds to states, rebuilding some of the decaying infrastructure in the national parks...those actually directly create jobs because you need to hire people to do them. They also have a vastly higher multiplier effect, because the people you hire are going to spend that money.

 

So which things do we hear the most about? The effective ones, or the ineffective corporate tax cuts?

[kapkomet]

Let's see...you want a media related rant? There are something like $25 billion in corporate tax cuts stuck in the stimulus bill to try to gain Republican/Business support. It goes to things like Casinos, oil companies, telecom companies, etc. Corporate tax cuts are some of the worst stimulus out there, because their multiplier effect on the economy is so low. Programs like health care, providing funds to states, rebuilding some of the decaying infrastructure in the national parks...those actually directly create jobs because you need to hire people to do them. They also have a vastly higher multiplier effect, because the people you hire are going to spend that money.

 

So which things do we hear the most about? The effective ones, or the ineffective corporate tax cuts?

What?

 

[Balta1701]

What?

Fiscal Bang for the Buck

One-year $ change in real GDP per $ reduction in federal tax revenue or increase in spending

Tax Cuts

Nonrefundable Lump-Sum Tax Rebate 1.02

Refundable Lump-Sum Tax Rebate 1.26

 

Temporary Tax Cuts

Payroll Tax Holiday 1.29

Across the Board Tax Cut 1.03

Accelerated Depreciation 0.27

 

Permanent Tax Cuts

Extend Alternative Minimum Tax Patch 0.48

Make Bush Income Tax Cuts Permanent 0.29

Make Dividend and Capital Gains Tax Cuts Permanent 0.37

Cut Corporate Tax Rate 0.30

 

Spending Increases

Extend Unemployment Insurance Benefits 1.64

Temporarily Increase Food Stamps 1.73

Issue General Aid to State Governments 1.36

Increase Infrastructure Spending 1.59

 

Source: Moody's Economy.com

From testimony given before the Small Business Committee last summer. For every dollar you cut in corporate taxes, you get $.30 back as GDP gain. For every dollar you cut in the payroll tax, you get $1.29 back, because of how regressive that tax is. For programs that actually create jobs, it keeps going up. Corporate tax cuts have among the lowest multipliers out there. The money just winds up either horded or in the hands of the shareholders who receive the largest amount of dividends, aka the people who don't spend the extra money if its given to them.

[NorthSideSox72]

From testimony given before the Small Business Committee last summer. For every dollar you cut in corporate taxes, you get $.30 back as GDP gain. For every dollar you cut in the payroll tax, you get $1.29 back, because of how regressive that tax is. For programs that actually create jobs, it keeps going up. Corporate tax cuts have among the lowest multipliers out there. The money just winds up either horded or in the hands of the shareholders who receive the largest amount of dividends, aka the people who don't spend the extra money if its given to them.

Very interesting.

 

[southsider2k5]

Let's see...you want a media related rant? There are something like $25 billion in corporate tax cuts stuck in the stimulus bill to try to gain Republican/Business support. It goes to things like Casinos, oil companies, telecom companies, etc. Corporate tax cuts are some of the worst stimulus out there, because their multiplier effect on the economy is so low. Programs like health care, providing funds to states, rebuilding some of the decaying infrastructure in the national parks...those actually directly create jobs because you need to hire people to do them. They also have a vastly higher multiplier effect, because the people you hire are going to spend that money.

 

So which things do we hear the most about? The effective ones, or the ineffective corporate tax cuts?

 

Sure. And what they don't tell you is that all of those jobs those corporate tax cuts save have an additional full multiplier effect, most likely of a maximum nature because of the higher spending rates of lower level employees at these type of places. You already used the stoping the spiral story, this is the most effective way to do that... keeping people employed.

 

 

[Balta1701]

The official suggested that Mr Obama's White House had made clear it would not prioritise executing the Bush administration's plan to install a missile defence shield in Poland and the Czech Republic.

 

An unnamed official in the Russian military's general staff said: "The implementation of these plans has been halted in connection with the fact that the new US administration is not rushing through plans to deploy" elements of its missile defence shield in eastern Europe, according to the Interfax news agency.

 

Vladimir Putin, the Russian Prime Minister, had warned that the US shield - which the Bush White House said was necessary to defend against potential attacks from the Middle East - would be interpreted by Moscow as a direct provocation.

 

Dmitry Medvedev, the Russian President, announced in November that in response, Moscow would place short-range Iskander missiles in the western enclave of Kaliningrad.

 

Washington had previously obtained agreements with Poland and the Czech Republic for the installation of the shield, which it said would plug a gap in its global missile defence system.

Overall, the U.S. saves money by not spending it on installing these installations. The Russians save money by not spending it on counter-installations. The Czechs and Poles have fewer missiles sitting on their borders. Iran finds Prague an easier target for their non-existent weapons. The U.S. immediately improves its relations with Russia.

 

Yay.

[Balta1701]

Stolen from the other thread:

Provided further, That of the amount appropriated under this heading ["Prevention and Wellness Fund"] not less than $2,350,000,000 shall be transferred to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention as follows:

 

(1) not less than $954,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount to carry out the immunization program authorized by section 317(a), (j), and (k)(1) of the Public Health Service Act (‘‘section 317 immunization program’’), of which $649,900,000 shall be available on October 1, 2009;

 

(2) not less than $296,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount to carry out Part A of title XIX of the Public Health Service Act, of which $148,000,000 shall be available on October 1, 2009;

 

(3) not less than $545,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount to carry out chronic disease, health promotion, and genomics programs, as jointly determined by the Secretary of Health and Human Services ("Secretary") and the Director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention ("Director");

 

(4) not less than $335,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount to carry out domestic HIV/AIDS, viral hepatitis, sexually-transmitted diseases, and tuberculosis prevention programs, as jointly determined by the Secretary and the Director;

 

(5) not less than $60,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount to carry out environmental health programs, as jointly determined by the Secretary and the Director;

 

(6) not less than $50,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount to carry out injury prevention and control programs, as jointly determined by the Secretary and the Director;

 

(7) not less than $30,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount for public health workforce development activities, as jointly determined by the Secretary and the Director;

 

(8) not less than $40,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount for the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health to carry out research activities within the National Occupational Research Agenda; and

 

(9) not less than $40,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount for the National Center for Health Statistics:

 

Provided further, That of the amount appropriated under this heading not less than $150,000,000 shall be available for an additional amount to carry out activities to implement a national action plan to prevent healthcare-associated infections, as determined by the Secretary, of which not less $50,000,000 shall be provided to States to implement healthcare-associated infection reduction strategies:

 

Provided further, That of the amount appropriated under this heading $500,000,000 shall be used to carry out evidence-based clinical and community-based prevention and wellness strategies and public health workforce development activities authorized by the Public Health Service Act, as determined by the Secretary, that deliver specific, measurable health outcomes that address chronic and infectious disease rates and health disparities, which shall include evidence-based interventions in obesity, diabetes, heart disease, cancer, tobacco cessation and smoking prevention, and oral health, and which may be used for the Healthy Communities program administered by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and other existing community-based programs administered by the Department of Health and Human Services.

 

A Reply:

I took York's advice and read the section of the bill he posted -- turns out it's actually pretty impressive. First of all, the money that goes to these programs will mean new jobs. There are the additional people who'll be needed for administration, of course, as well as additional doctors and researchers. There will also be, to borrow a phrase, a trickle-down effect: Money for vaccinating uninsured children, for instance, means more vaccinations will be produced, which means there'll be more jobs producing and distributing the vaccines.

 

Some of the numbers York laid out do look big and scary. ("Not less than $954,000,000 shall be used as an additional amount to carry out the immunization program authorized by section 317(a), (j), and (k)(1) of the Public Health Service Act," for instance.) But if he'd done some quick background research, he would have found that these expenditures will actually greatly decrease other burdens on the economy down the road.

 

Take the $954 million directed to the CDC's Section 317 Immunization Program referenced above. That program is the primary source of funding for state immunization efforts, and at least one study, from 2006, found that it's extremely successful. "ncreases in Section 317 funding were significantly and meaningfully associated with higher rates of vaccination coverage; a $10 increase in per capita funding corresponded with a 1.6-percentage-point increase in vaccination coverage," the study's authors wrote. "Policymakers charged with funding public health programs should consider this study’s findings, which indicate that money allocated to vaccine activities translates directly into higher vaccine coverage rates." And, of course, higher vaccine coverage rates mean lower healthcare costs down the line.

 

Then there's the $150 million in the bill "to carry out activities to implement a national action plan to prevent healthcare-associated infections ... of which not less $50,000,000 shall be provided to States to implement healthcare-associated infection reduction strategies." Again, $150 million sounds like a huge expense. But in a single year, the cost of hospital-acquired infections in a single state, Massachusetts, is estimated at more than $470 million. The human and fiscal cost for the whole country is much higher; in 2000, the CDC reported that these infections added almost $5 billion to healthcare costs in the U.S. That's more than 30 times the expenditure included in the stimulus package. The same year, the CDC blamed hospital-acquired infections for 88,000 deaths; that number is now estimated at about 100,000.

 

As for that $335 million for STD prevention, that number sort of pales when you consider the direct medical cost of STDs every year, which one 2000 study found was $6.5 billion. That same study notes that, for HIV patients at least, the government already assumes a large share of the burden; one group of researchers found that 47 percent of people receiving treatment for HIV were covered by Medicare, and 20 percent were uninsured.

[ChiSox_Sonix]

http://www.flixxy.com/presidents-morphing.htm

 

Pretty cool

[HuskyCaucasian]

http://www.flixxy.com/presidents-morphing.htm

 

Pretty cool

That's awesome... here's the video sans link:

[kapkomet]

From testimony given before the Small Business Committee last summer. For every dollar you cut in corporate taxes, you get $.30 back as GDP gain. For every dollar you cut in the payroll tax, you get $1.29 back, because of how regressive that tax is. For programs that actually create jobs, it keeps going up. Corporate tax cuts have among the lowest multipliers out there. The money just winds up either horded or in the hands of the shareholders who receive the largest amount of dividends, aka the people who don't spend the extra money if its given to them.

The cuts in corporate tax rates shouldn't be measured as a multiplier effect. That's the wrong way to look at it.

 

 

 

[Balta1701]

Running tally of media appearances by members of Congress over the last few days to discuss the stimulus package. Go ahead...guess which party dominated the discussion. Now, guess which network was the closest to balanced.

 

I'll bet you got 1 of those 2 right.

 

[Balta1701]

The cuts in corporate tax rates shouldn't be measured as a multiplier effect. That's the wrong way to look at it.

In that case, I await your elaboration.

[lostfan]

Running tally of media appearances by members of Congress over the last few days to discuss the stimulus package. Go ahead...guess which party dominated the discussion. Now, guess which network was the closest to balanced.

The GOP SHOULD be pushing back against the stimulus, or at least getting alternate ideas out there. The Dems don't really have to try because if they wanted to, they could pass it easily.

[southsider2k5]

In that case, I await your elaboration.

 

I pretty much gave it. The cost savings keeps companies from laying off. That isn't reflected in the multiplier numbers as it isn't considered a new outlay, dispite the fact that it does keep money flowing through the system.

[Balta1701]

I pretty much gave it. The cost savings keeps companies from laying off. That isn't reflected in the multiplier numbers as it isn't considered a new outlay, dispite the fact that it does keep money flowing through the system.

That makes very little sense to me. The multiplier effect as defined in the linked document is "One-year $ change in real GDP per $ reduction in federal tax revenue or increase in spending". In other words, it is defined as what happens relative to no federal action being taken; aka in this case, no tax cuts. It does not matter if it is considered a new outlay by the business or not, all that matters is the impact on GDP. In other words, keeping people employed who's jobs otherwise would have been lost without a tax cut must be included, because their economic activity counts as part of the GDP. If in some fashion it didn't count that, as you claim, then the multiplier for a corporate tax cut would be even lower.

 

The baseline is relative to no government action taken, not relative to where things currently stand.

[Balta1701]

Hamilton County Prosecutor Joe Deters said he had allegations last fall of widespread voter fraud – allegations a special prosecutor reported Tuesday were wrong, noting the only voter fraud found was from a Connecticut man who told on himself.

Advertisement

 

“Ultimately,” Special Prosecutor Michael O’Neill wrote in a report, “the investigators discovered ‘get-out-the-vote’ practices, sponsored by community organizations, which took full advantage of this unique absentee-voting period, but no evidence these practices violated Ohio law.”

 

“Told ya so,” Tim Burke, chairman of the Hamilton County Democratic Party as well as chairman of the Hamilton County Board of Elections, said with glee of O’Neill’s report.

Hmmmm...

[Balta1701]

The GOP SHOULD be pushing back against the stimulus, or at least getting alternate ideas out there. The Dems don't really have to try because if they wanted to, they could pass it easily.

Then why couldn't the Democrats get that kind of air time for the last 8 years?