southsider2k5 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:24 PM) The answer is to give in to or even accelerate inequalities? So your answer is to keep hitting Adam Dunn? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:25 PM) So your answer is to keep hitting Adam Dunn? You can drop the really bad analogy that doesn't make sense any time now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:24 PM) Yes on housing, no on children because I chose (ZOMG!) to bag that s*** so that I WOULDN'T be poor. And I love that I can't use the excuse that poor people are poor because of some "poor" decisions in life, but you can throw out that every poor person is incredibly stupid and in total dependence on someone else to get them through the day? If you can play xbox, you can figure out how to go to college and better your life. It's not rocket science. Hey nice job dodging all my questions regarding potential advantages you held and then claiming I said poor people are incredibly stupid. edit: have you ever taken a class on or studied or read about sociology? Edited July 19, 2011 by StrangeSox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:23 PM) We have spent trillions trying to end class privileged. I think Adam Dunn has a better batting average and less strike outs than our social programs. Also we undid a whole lot of that in the last 3 decades thanks to supply-side economics which led to wage stagnation for most and an exploding wealth and income gap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:25 PM) You can drop the really bad analogy that doesn't make sense any time now. It doesn't? Tell me how many people leave poverty based on social programs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 06:07 PM) I've been in Cabrini Green a few times and have seen this stuff. I know people that are landlords in poor areas of the city and in Gary, Indiana. Is that something to compare too nationally? Probably not, but it's enough that I don't buy into the bulls*** you guys do that unless you make 50k, have access to cable, internet, a smartphone and can afford college paying cash that you're "poor" and need government to help you through life. Btw, I've done enough sales on my own to know...the guy living in the run-down area with the huge TV, new cell phone, Cadillac...very often bought all those items with cash. Literally cash. Paid in $20's and $100's. I'm hoping you're catching my meaning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:31 PM) It doesn't? Tell me how many people leave poverty based on social programs? A more accurate question would be how many people avoid destitution, homelessness and starvation thanks to social programs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 06:31 PM) It doesn't? Tell me how many people leave poverty based on social programs? Well, considering social mobility in this country has declined significantly over the past 30 years as those programs have been cut back and now stands well below most other countries in Europe that have much more expansive social safety nets, it seems like a lot do. Cutting back on them and then being angry that they don't work would be like putting Adam Dunn out there and being mad that he struck out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:31 PM) Btw, I've done enough sales on my own to know...the guy living in the run-down area with the huge TV, new cell phone, Cadillac...very often bought all those items with cash. Literally cash. Paid in $20's and $100's. I'm hoping you're catching my meaning. If that is the case, I had classrooms in a school with a 70% poverty rate filled with kids doing whatever it is you mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:33 PM) A more accurate question would be how many people avoid destitution, homelessness and starvation thanks to social programs? Nice movement of the goalposts. Still I would love to see those numbers too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 Economic Mobility in the US Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 06:34 PM) If that is the case, I had classrooms in a school with a 70% poverty rate filled with kids doing whatever it is you mean. (Dealing) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:34 PM) Well, considering social mobility in this country has declined significantly over the past 30 years as those programs have been cut back and now stands well below most other countries in Europe that have much more expansive social safety nets, it seems like a lot do. Cutting back on them and then being angry that they don't work would be like putting Adam Dunn out there and being mad that he struck out. Judging by our local, state, and federal budgets, I am guessing what you are saying about cuts isn't true at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:34 PM) Nice movement of the goalposts. Still I would love to see those numbers too. I didn't move goalposts because I never claimed social safety nets are meant to lift people out of poverty if poverty is defined by income levels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 06:36 PM) Judging by our local, state, and federal budgets, I am guessing what you are saying about cuts isn't true at all. The Defense Department is a Social Program? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:36 PM) The Defense Department is a Social Program? So were the Bush tax cuts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:36 PM) I didn't move goalposts because I never claimed social safety nets are meant to lift people out of poverty if poverty is defined by income levels. That was very clearly what you were trying to imply earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:36 PM) The Defense Department is a Social Program? Show me the cuts in the biggest entitlement programs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:37 PM) That was very clearly what you were trying to imply earlier. I suppose indirectly that this is true: rent and food assistance means you may be able to work less and spend more time getting an education, which could lead to getting out of poverty. Poverty rates in the US, for reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 06:38 PM) Show me the cuts in the biggest entitlement programs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 I still want a consensus that "ownership of consumer electronics" is a s***ty measurement of poverty, damn it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:35 PM) Economic Mobility in the US I don't want this to get buried since it directly addresses the idea that the poor deserve to be poor because they're dumb and lazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 (edited) QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:34 PM) Nice movement of the goalposts. Still I would love to see those numbers too. http://siteresources.worldbank.org/SOCIALP...ets-DP/0302.pdf http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/downl...p1&type=pdf The international comparisons in this paper contain important lessons for understanding the high poverty rate in the United States. Clearly, both the wage distribution and the generosity of social benefits strongly affect poverty. The relationship between low wages and poverty is direct and obvious. Continued tight labor markets in the United States can help reduce poverty as the wages received by less skilled workers are bid up. There are two important limits to this effect, however. Not all of the poor can be expected to “earn” their way out of poverty. Single parents with young children, disabled workers, and the unskilled will all face significant challenges earning a comfortable income, no matter how low the unemployment rate falls. Edited July 19, 2011 by StrangeSox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cknolls Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 04:35 PM) I think that if someone has luxury goods like cell phones and xboxs and multiple tv's they're not making the right decisions to get themselves out of being poor. Do not forget the Nike gym shoes man. Gotta have the shoes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cknolls Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 19, 2011 -> 05:31 PM) Btw, I've done enough sales on my own to know...the guy living in the run-down area with the huge TV, new cell phone, Cadillac...very often bought all those items with cash. Literally cash. Paid in $20's and $100's. I'm hoping you're catching my meaning. So would legalizing drugs be a job killer then? And racist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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