The Republican Thread

[The Sir]

The dismissal of the lives of non-Americans as "collateral" is pretty insulting, too.

 

Call it what you want. But al-Qaeda didn't set out that day saying, "hey, we're gonna go murder a Bermudan today!" They set out to murder Americans. And that's what they did. So screw Robert Pastoor and screw these Obama officials who are putting out crap about 9/11 not being just about us. It was about us.

[CrimsonWeltall]

I don't know why on Earth they'd put my name next to that flag, but hey, it's their country.

 

You don't know why because *it's the wrong flag*, just as Ms. Snowe had 237 wrong flags.

 

He's a coward for trying so pathetically hard to appease foreign visitors at the expense of patriotic Americans.

 

He wasn't appeasing anyone and there's absolutely zero "expense" to Americans. Snowe is being a drama queen.

 

 

Admin: Hey, since a bunch of those victims were from different countries, it would be a good idea to have them represented by their own flag, rather than American flags, which is inaccurate. Consider how they might feel. We can supply the flags.

Snowe: OMG LIBERAL POLITICALLY CORRECT FASCISTS OPPRESSING ME

[VictoryMC98]

That is a complete change of subject. We pay that bill every time we go to the gas pump or go through a toll booth.

 

No its not a change of subject, you said we pay for road etc to be build.. Obviously we don't pay enough too them..

 

Can you please answer that question, are you happy with the "billions". we spend on the roads, the condition they are in?

 

BTW, Are you a GOP/Dem/INDEP?

[StrangeSox]

your original question was when was the last time money was spent rebuilding roads, to which ss2k5 correctly responded "all the time always"

 

whether that's an adequate amount is anotehr question.

Edited September 9, 2011 by StrangeSox

[southsider2k5]

No its not a change of subject, you said we pay for road etc to be build.. Obviously we don't pay enough too them..

 

Can you please answer that question, are you happy with the "billions". we spend on the roads, the condition they are in?

 

BTW, Are you a GOP/Dem/INDEP?

 

It is a change of subject. You said we weren't paying for roads. We are. We pay billions annually, both through taxes, tolls, and then back through things like the highway bill.

[StrangeSox]

Call it what you want. But al-Qaeda didn't set out that day saying, "hey, we're gonna go murder a Bermudan today!" They set out to murder Americans. And that's what they did.

And they murdered 247 non-Americans whose lives are worth no less than the Americans killed. No one was saying don't commemorate Americans or put out the American flag, just that if you're going to put out flags for every individual, at least get their nationality right.

[VictoryMC98]

It is a change of subject. You said we weren't paying for roads. We are. We pay billions annually, both through taxes, tolls, and then back through things like the highway bill.

 

Then you didn't understand what I meant by "paying the bill" comment.

 

How many billions do we spend?

 

Why are you avoiding the question, if the "billions" we spend, are you happy with the roads..etc?

[The Sir]

He wasn't appeasing anyone and there's absolutely zero "expense" to Americans. Snowe is being a drama queen.

 

 

Admin: Hey, since a bunch of those victims were from different countries, it would be a good idea to have them represented by their own flag, rather than American flags, which is inaccurate. Consider how they might feel. We can supply the flags.

Snowe: OMG LIBERAL POLITICALLY CORRECT FASCISTS OPPRESSING ME

 

He continued, she noted, by saying, “Other nationalities were killed in the twin towers as well” and that Marietta must “consider how the Muslim and Chinese students will feel about the [American flag] display.”

 

That is appeasement.

 

Why exactly are we obligated to care how those people feel about American flags? They're visitors here. They can suck it up or leave.

 

Pastoor is just trying to kiss ass. As if being nice to them and bowing to all of their perceived sensitivities will make them like us more or something. You call it what you want. I'll call it appeasement.

[StrangeSox]

He did answer your original question, you kinda shifted it later. Please note that there is not a single topic that ss2k5 and I agree on.

[BigSqwert]

Why exactly are we obligated to care how those people feel about American flags?

 

I didn't catch the part where American flags were not going to be used.

[StrangeSox]

That is appeasement.

 

Why exactly are we obligated to care how those people feel about American flags? They're visitors here. They can suck it up or leave.

 

Pastoor is just trying to kiss ass. As if being nice to them and bowing to all of their perceived sensitivities will make them like us more or something. You call it what you want. I'll call it appeasement.

 

Appeasement of what?

 

I think you're misunderstanding his view here. It's not that people would be offended by the presence of the American flag. It's going to be all over the place this weekend and probably a few weeks afterwards. There were numerous other events planned on campus without issue that will presumably feature a lot of pro-America patriotism. His point is that if you're going to commemorate the individual victims of 9/11, don't ignore who these people actually were. Representing them with an American flag just doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

[southsider2k5]

Then you didn't understand what I meant by "paying the bill" comment.

 

How many billions do we spend?

 

Why are you avoiding the question, if the "billions" we spend, are you happy with the roads..etc?

 

With a quick google search, it looks to be significant. I found one all ecompassing figure of $133 billion from 2001. With 10 years to add on to that, I am sure that means we are somewhere between $200 and $250 billion.

 

http://www.transalt.org/files/newsroom/mag...rovocateur.html

[The Sir]

And they murdered 247 non-Americans whose lives are worth no less than the Americans killed. No one was saying don't commemorate Americans or put out the American flag, just that if you're going to put out flags for every individual, at least get their nationality right.

 

Then we should put out 2,730 flags. Let the Israelis and the Brits fly their flags for their victims on their turf. Regardless, this wasn't an attack on either of those countries or any country other than America. So I don't know why we need to go about acting like this was an attack on the world because some other nationalities perished. We were attacked and all we need is American flags.

[The Sir]

Appeasement of what?

 

I think you're misunderstanding his view here. It's not that people would be offended by the presence of the American flag. It's going to be all over the place this weekend and probably a few weeks afterwards. There were numerous other events planned on campus without issue that will presumably feature a lot of pro-America patriotism. His point is that if you're going to commemorate the individual victims of 9/11, don't ignore who these people actually were. Representing them with an American flag just doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

 

He's not even talking about individual victims in that point. He's talking about what Chinese and Muslim students would think of a display of American flags. And frankly, I just don't see why we're supposed to give a s*** about that.

[StrangeSox]

Then we should put out 2,730 flags. Let the Israelis and the Brits fly their flags for their victims on their turf. Regardless, this wasn't an attack on either of those countries or any country other than America. So I don't know why we need to go about acting like this was an attack on the world because some other nationalities perished. We were attacked and all we need is American flags.

 

See, I find this abhorrent but at least it makes more sense than commemorating a dead Brit with an American flag.

 

Why would commemorating all of the victims of 9/11 be a bad thing?

[StrangeSox]

He's not even talking about individual victims in that point. He's talking about what Chinese and Muslim students would think of a display of American flags. And frankly, I just don't see why we're supposed to give a s*** about that.

 

The university wants to attract foreign students? I dunno. That snippet of the email sounds pretty dumb (don't see the whole thing linked in that article), but his specific reasoning for suggesting additional flags is kinda tangential to whether or not inclusion of the other flags is appropriate.

Edited September 9, 2011 by StrangeSox

[StrangeSox]

With a quick google search, it looks to be significant. I found one all ecompassing figure of $133 billion from 2001. With 10 years to add on to that, I am sure that means we are somewhere between $200 and $250 billion.

 

http://www.transalt.org/files/newsroom/mag...rovocateur.html

 

Yearly reports by the ASCE decry just how far behind we are in maintenance and upgrades.

 

http://blogs.asce.org/govrel/

Edited September 9, 2011 by StrangeSox

[CrimsonWeltall]

That is appeasement.

 

Why exactly are we obligated to care how those people feel about American flags? They're visitors here. They can suck it up or leave.

 

Pastoor is just trying to kiss ass. As if being nice to them and bowing to all of their perceived sensitivities will make them like us more or something. You call it what you want. I'll call it appeasement.

 

It's not appeasement...there's no threat. People who died would be better represented by their own flag rather than pretending they're American. It's called being thoughtful. Difficult concept.

[The Sir]

The university wants to attract foreign students? I dunno.

 

And that seems pretty pathetic. Shunning patriots to appeal to foreigners. Cowardly.

 

It's mostly that quote that gets to me. It would have been totally different if he had simply suggested putting up Israeli flags for dead Israelis and so forth. I probably never would have mentioned this. But then he tries to go on this PC kick, getting all worried about what the foreigners might think. That's really stupid.

 

I'm not really sure how close the event came to being canceled. I think it's ridiculous that they would even threaten that at all, but different articles say different things so I'm not sure what really happened. But that doesn't excuse the attempt at political correctness found in that quote which is something I despise.

[The Sir]

It's not appeasement...there's no threat. People who died would be better represented by their own flag rather than pretending they're American. It's called being thoughtful. Difficult concept.

 

Once again, in that particular quote, he comes off like a scared administrator trying to suck up to foreign students by making sure no offensive display of patriotism could take place. He's not talking about the individual flags, he's worrying what the Muslims might think of a crapload of American flags being displayed on campus. That's appeasement, not thoughtfulness.

[StrangeSox]

That quote is what the College Republican leader reported him as saying.

 

The main contention was that there were no flags to represent the other nationalities that were killed. I was merely guessing at his motives, implying that we don't know what they were and melting down over it seems pretty ridiculous. If you read the partial email quotes provided in that article, that's exactly what they're saying: include Israeli flags for dead Israelis, Irish flags for dead Irish, etc. Various other memorials are planned around campus without issue, so this is hardly about "shunning patriots."

 

We have no reliable source for what Dr. Pastoor actually gave as his reasoning.

[StrangeSox]

Once again, in that particular quote, he comes off like a scared administrator trying to suck up to foreign students by making sure no offensive display of patriotism could take place. He's not talking about the individual flags, he's worrying what the Muslims might think of a crapload of American flags being displayed on campus. That's appeasement, not thoughtfulness.

 

That quote is what the CR leader said he said, not a direct quote.

 

2700+ flags around campus is pretty f***ing patriotic. No one had any issue with putting out thousands of flags, just with the oversight of assuming all victims were Americans.

[The Sir]

Like all things between you and me, we're never going to agree. I've said my piece and continue to hold those views, so I'm done.

[StrangeSox]

ok? Do you at least recognize that those were not direct quotes from Dr. Pastoor?

[The Sir]

ok? Do you at least recognize that those were not direct quotes from Dr. Pastoor?

 

Uh, yeah, sure.

 

At the same time, Pastoor did not respond to requests for comment (at least not that I've seen). So we can't really have his side of the story. Might be interesting to hear, actually.