The Republican Thread

[Marty34]

Here's how to fix education. Pay teachers what they're worth and the best people will become teachers. Anyone with any kind of talent is going into other professions because they wont make as much if they're a teacher. Make teaching a respectable profession and pay them like it and you will have good teachers.

 

The teacher isn't as important in a student's educational development as their parents are. Teachers are paid what they are worth.

[Jenksismyhero]

He gave the keynote speech. If you want to give that girl from Utah the keynote speech, go for it, shell get on tv. In my opinion the Democrats gave him that spot to help make sure he won that seat.

 

You guys spend way to much time worrying about the media, who cares what they think? The real problem for the platform is their stance on most social issues.

 

I think that in the future Republican's are going to be viewed as being on the wrong side of the fence. My thoughts are, no matter how right the South was on other issues, you just couldnt get on that bandwagon because of slavery.

 

Social freedom trumps economy.

 

(edit)

 

I know this is the republican thread so delete this if you want, or I can put it in the democrat thread.

 

It's a big deal because probably 80% of the electorate (being generous there) are morons who only follow the headlines (being generous again) and pick their candidate based on what tie they're wearing or whether they're wearing an American flag pendent. So yeah, how the media portrays a candidate is very important and making the RNC look like a get together of white folks in Florida just perpetuates a stereotype that minorities only vote democrat.

 

 

[StrangeSox]

The teacher isn't as important in a student's educational development as their parents are. Teachers are paid what they are worth.

[StrangeSox]

It's a big deal because probably 80% of the electorate (being generous there) are morons who only follow the headlines (being generous again) and pick their candidate based on what tie they're wearing or whether they're wearing an American flag pendent. So yeah, how the media portrays a candidate is very important and making the RNC look like a get together of white folks in Florida just perpetuates a stereotype that minorities only vote democrat.

 

two points:

 

90%+ of the electorate are partisans and media coverage doesn't matter.

 

The Republican campaign and their platform are what is alienating minorities, not media coverage of the convention.

[kev211]

Wow. Way to throw all the teachers in catholic schools under the bus. Yeah you can only be a good teacher if you are in the union. LMAO.

No, I'm saying without teacher's unions to look out for them the first thing that every state is going to do is cut education and teacher salaries. Which in turn will lower salaries causing anyone worth anything to move onto a field where they can earn what they are worth. Catholic schools don't need a union right now because public schools force them to be somewhat competitive in what they pay their teachers.

 

It's the same reason that people who are not in unions or in fields without them still reap the benefits of them.

 

More money isn't the problem here. Teachers make a good living, especially with benefits. And money isn't stopping good teachers from coming through the system because it's (1) still an insanely competitive industry and (2) there a ton of amazing teachers.

 

The problem is our society and parenting specifically. We now EXPECT teachers to provide for our kids, when in reality teachers are meant to teach kids some things that parents don't have the time or expertise to teach them. If a kid f***s up in school, it's not the parents fault, it's the teachers and that's f***ed.

 

Also, I agree with getting rid of standardized testing, so long as you meet me halfway and get rid of the tenure system. An out of touch, grumpy old teacher working the last 5 years to get that nice pension bump screws up the system. Same with the bureaucracy behind school boards. There's no reason for those boards to have as much power and authority as they do. Running a school district isn't rocket science, and it's ridiculous how much school administrators make and how much authority they have. What's wrong with having the principal be the main authority figure at every school? Our system is stupid.

Teacher's in the huge districts and around here make a good living. In other parts of the country the salaries teachers make is an absolute crime. Its only competitive because education got cut and thousands of teachers got RIFed not because a million people want to be a teachers. If you pay teachers what they're worth you'll eventually weed out the ones who game the system and don't give a f*** about their students.

 

Your second two paragraphs are good though besides the tenure system. Tenure is in place to make sure a school district doesn't cut someone with 25 years of experience to bring in a college graduate at half their salary. Yeah it sucks about the grumpy old people gaming the system, but it's not fair to the 45 year olds with 20 years of experience if tenure didn't exist. This wouldn't be a problem if states were actually giving the districts the money they owe them, but they're not and any district worth anything would eliminate the older expensive teachers today if they could.

 

Why should we eliminate any ability to determine whether you are teaching your kids anything?

I think it's been answered already, but all standardized test cause is other teachers and myself being forced to teach my students how to pass the test and not teaching them the material and content they should be learning. Also standardized test are used more as a judgement on the school and district than an individual teacher anyway.

 

This is such a common mis-perception. Teachers get paid plenty and work 75% of the year. Maybe teachers should stop gaming the system, getting 15 master's degrees, and pricing themselves out of positions.

And in that 75% of the year they're working way more than 8 hours a day. 10 or 12 hours a day usually, if they coach or run a club its even longer. Any good teacher is spending a decent amount of time during the summer preparing for the next year anyway. If you pay them more and make it harder to get a teaching degree you're going to eliminate anyone who games the system.

 

Your statement is the real common misconception

Edited August 29, 2012 by kev211

[kev211]

Maybe instead of wasting your time posting a f***ing smiley you actually make an intelligent post and tell me why you think I am wrong.

[mr_genius]

The teacher isn't as important in a student's educational development as their parents are. Teachers are paid what they are worth.

 

^^^

[EvilMonkey]

Everyone! It's all there in coded words! Every Dem is a raving anti-Mormanite!

 

 

 

(I am making fun, of course, at just about every liberal commentator hearing racist code words in just about anything anyone says about Obama)

I guess golf jokes are now racist as well.

 

http://freebeacon.com/msnbc-anchor-gop-sen...to-tiger-woods/

 

MSNBC host Lawrence O’Donnell said Wednesday that a reference to President Obama’s golfing in Sen. Mitch McConnell’s upcoming RNC speech is an attempt to link the president to Tiger Woods and his “lifestyle”:

What next? Any guesses?

 

I just found it. Apparently saying he is from Chicago is now racist because, you know, there are a lot of black people there.

Edited August 30, 2012 by Alpha Dog

[StrangeSox]

That's pretty dumb on O'Donnel's part. Pawlenty made some lame golf jokes last night, too. His speech was the only one I heard, but it sounded pretty flat.

[mr_genius]

That's pretty dumb on O'Donnel's part. Pawlenty made some lame golf jokes last night, too. His speech was the only one I heard, but it sounded pretty flat.

 

Paul Ryan was top notch

[StrangeSox]

FACT CHECK: Convention speakers stray from reality

 

Paul Ryan Bets on the Ignorance of America

 

Dispatches From the Republican National Convention

Entry 13: Here’s a list of some of the whoppers that Paul Ryan served up Wednesday night.

 

The Most Dishonest Convention Speech ... Ever?

Edited August 30, 2012 by StrangeSox

[mr_genius]

FACT CHECK: Convention speakers stray from reality

 

Paul Ryan Bets on the Ignorance of America

 

Dispatches From the Republican National Convention

Entry 13: Here’s a list of some of the whoppers that Paul Ryan served up Wednesday night.

 

The Most Dishonest Convention Speech ... Ever?

 

It's hard for me take any article seriously written by the DNC then published by a biased news source. The speech was great and factually accurate, unlike the shill articles you linked to.

[StrangeSox]

It's true, I have been owned.

[MexSoxFan#1]

FACT CHECK: Convention speakers stray from reality

 

Paul Ryan Bets on the Ignorance of America

 

Dispatches From the Republican National Convention

Entry 13: Here’s a list of some of the whoppers that Paul Ryan served up Wednesday night.

 

The Most Dishonest Convention Speech ... Ever?

Republicans lying??? Is this real life?

 

 

 

 

 

^^ sarcasm ^^

[Jenksismyhero]

Teacher's in the huge districts and around here make a good living. In other parts of the country the salaries teachers make is an absolute crime. Its only competitive because education got cut and thousands of teachers got RIFed not because a million people want to be a teachers. If you pay teachers what they're worth you'll eventually weed out the ones who game the system and don't give a f*** about their students.

 

Your second two paragraphs are good though besides the tenure system. Tenure is in place to make sure a school district doesn't cut someone with 25 years of experience to bring in a college graduate at half their salary. Yeah it sucks about the grumpy old people gaming the system, but it's not fair to the 45 year olds with 20 years of experience if tenure didn't exist. This wouldn't be a problem if states were actually giving the districts the money they owe them, but they're not and any district worth anything would eliminate the older expensive teachers today if they could.

 

So in other words, teachers are no different than an employee in every other industry. Some get paid well, some get paid s***. Welcome to life.

 

Re: the tenure thing, why should teachers be given more protection than any other employee? I'm an attorney, I can get replaced any second. Where's my protection? Why do teachers deserve more than me? We all have the ADA to protect us, why isn't that enough?

[Y2HH]

Republicans lying??? Is this real life?

 

 

 

 

 

^^ sarcasm ^^

 

You say this as if Democrats don't lie, too. And yes, they lie just as much.

[StrangeSox]

Re: the tenure thing, why should teachers be given more protection than any other employee? I'm an attorney, I can get replaced any second. Where's my protection? Why do teachers deserve more than me? We all have the ADA to protect us, why isn't that enough?

[Jenksismyhero]

 

Sorry, I don't understand the reference.

[StrangeSox]

Crabs in a bucket can't escape because they pull each other back down into the bucket.

 

You lament that teachers have more protection from firings than you do, but your preferred solution is to eliminate those protections for teachers instead of working for them for yourself. Crab mentality.

[Jenksismyhero]

Crabs in a bucket can't escape because they pull each other back down into the bucket.

 

You lament that teachers have more protection from firings than you do, but your preferred solution is to eliminate those protections for teachers instead of working for them for yourself. Crab mentality.

 

I'm not really lamenting that fact, i'm just pointing it out. Nor do I think we're all stuck in a bucket because the government doesn't guarantee everyone X amount in salary a year, regardless of their performance or skillset.

 

I want my kids' school to be full of qualified teachers, not teachers that just happened to be average enough to make it through until they were tenured. I had that in my high school with numerous teachers and it sucked. I would have preferred a younger, more energetic teacher who was thrilled to teach kids over an old crotchety teacher just going through the motions.

 

 

[mr_genius]

Crabs in a bucket can't escape because they pull each other back down into the bucket.

 

Obamanomics

[StrangeSox]

I'm not really lamenting that fact, i'm just pointing it out. Nor do I think we're all stuck in a bucket because the government doesn't guarantee everyone X amount in salary a year, regardless of their performance or skillset.

 

I want my kids' school to be full of qualified teachers, not teachers that just happened to be average enough to make it through until they were tenured. I had that in my high school with numerous teachers and it sucked. I would have preferred a younger, more energetic teacher who was thrilled to teach kids over an old crotchety teacher just going through the motions.

You ask: why should teachers have more protections than I do, where I can be fired today without notice and without compensation? I ask: why shouldn't you have the same protections that teachers have so that you can't be fired today without notice and without compensation?

[southsider2k5]

You ask: why should teachers have more protections than I do, where I can be fired today without notice and without compensation? I ask: why shouldn't you have the same protections that teachers have so that you can't be fired today without notice and without compensation?

 

A better question would be why protect bad teachers in the first place.

[Y2HH]

You ask: why should teachers have more protections than I do, where I can be fired today without notice and without compensation? I ask: why shouldn't you have the same protections that teachers have so that you can't be fired today without notice and without compensation?

 

Because nobody that sucks at their job should have such protections is the answer you seek.

[StrangeSox]

Plenty of people who don't suck at their jobs are fired every day.

 

The tenure system isn't perfect, but I've had pretty much this exact conversation with jenks before regarding teachers or unions or some other source of workplace rights. It's a pretty common theme to worker organization opposition; people see their own situation as less-than-ideal, and when they see some other group with more rights or protections, they want to drag them down instead. Instead of asking "why don't I have the same benefits?" the impulse to to make everyone equally inferior and powerless in the labor market. This is great for the wealthy owners and upper management, but terrible for the rest of the working class.