WCSox Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 21, 2008 -> 10:32 AM) Why do people keep asserting that the team will not be competitive in year x? First of all, we're still sitting on Trader Kenny as our GM, so our team will almost certainly look nothing like it currently does in 2 years.. Secondly, we'll have cleared a hell of a lot of salary space 2 years from now with Jose, Konerko, Thome, Dye, AJ, Dotel, Crede, Cabrera, and Javy all off the books. But we'll still be sitting on Danks, Floyd, Buehrle, Fields, Alexei, Richar, Quentin, Swisher, Anderson, and whoever else from the minors we can develop in to something useful. You're absolutely right that we could surprise in 2010. But with the players that you mention no longer wearing a Sox uniform at that time and our lack of quality prospects limiting both the number of true ML-ready players coming up through our system and Kenny's ability to trade for productive veterans, you'll have to excuse me for not feeling terribly optimistic about 2010. The heaping pile of dog crap that is our farm system is not going to turn around in just two years. Trader Kenny won't be very effective is he has nothing of value to trade, and since he tends to not aggressively pursue free agent veterans looking for $60+ million deals, he's going to miss out on the big-impact guys. Third...people insisted until they were blue in the face that we wouldn't have a shot this year and it was a rebuilding year. Then suddenly Danks and Floyd pitched up to their potential... I wasn't one of those people. I recognized the talent on this team and predicted 83 or 84 wins, assuming that Floyd and Contreras would struggle, and a possibility of 89-90 wins if several things go their way. However, even if Quentin stays on pace to become the next Maggs, Fields develops into another Adam Dunn, and Swisher is able to hit around his career average, the offense is still going to take a massive hit with the losses Paulie, Thome, Dye, and Crede. Edited July 21, 2008 by WCSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 Where did KW find guys like Q, Thornton, Jenks and Ramirez -- he pulled them out of his ass. As long as teh payroll stays top 10 or so, there is no reason to think that the guys coming off the books (Dye, Thome, Kong) won't be replaced by sluggers making about the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 (edited) QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Jul 21, 2008 -> 01:46 PM) Where did KW find guys like Q, Thornton, Jenks and Ramirez -- he pulled them out of his ass. So you're counting on Kenny to build his 2010 roster out of diamonds in the rough? He's supposed to rely on out-scouting and out-smarting other GMs? That doesn't sound like a very good plan to me. As long as teh payroll stays top 10 or so, there is no reason to think that the guys coming off the books (Dye, Thome, Kong) won't be replaced by sluggers making about the same. Possibly, but Kenny balked at going after Hunter, Rowand, and Cabrera this off-season. The high-impact, high-salary veteran players that he's acquired recently were overwhelmingly through trades (Garcia, Contreras, Thome, Vazquez, etc.). Dye's the only big exception that comes to mind. He does this because he (understandably) doesn't want to pay $70 million for guys like Hunter and Cabrera. But Kenny doesn't have the level of quality prospects that he used to, so he can't continue to operate that way. The Sox DESPERATELY need to re-vamp their farm system, even if it means holding a firesale if they're not competitive next year. Otherwise, they'll be stuck over-paying for big-money free agents. Edited July 21, 2008 by WCSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 QUOTE (WCSox @ Jul 21, 2008 -> 06:25 PM) Possibly, but Kenny balked at going after Hunter, Rowand, and Cabrera this off-season. He didn't balk. He whiffed. And I was pissed about it at the time but now I'm kind of glad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 QUOTE (lostfan @ Jul 21, 2008 -> 11:31 PM) He didn't balk. He whiffed. And I was pissed about it at the time but now I'm kind of glad. Isn't that the truth though. Sometimes things just work out right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 How did he whiff on Rowand? Did he ever even make an offer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 21, 2008 -> 05:32 PM) Why do people keep asserting that the team will not be competitive in year x? First of all, we're still sitting on Trader Kenny as our GM, so our team will almost certainly look nothing like it currently does in 2 years.. Secondly, we'll have cleared a hell of a lot of salary space 2 years from now with Jose, Konerko, Thome, Dye, AJ, Dotel, Crede, Cabrera, and Javy all off the books. But we'll still be sitting on Danks, Floyd, Buehrle, Fields, Alexei, Richar, Quentin, Swisher, Anderson, and whoever else from the minors we can develop in to something useful. That's probably as good of a position to be in as any team other than Arizona and Tampa bay has, where they're competitive now but are doing so with a decent number of young guys already in. Third...people insisted until they were blue in the face that we wouldn't have a shot this year and it was a rebuilding year. Then suddenly Danks and Floyd pitched up to their potential and now we're hoping we can beat the Twins this year and we've pushed the year people are writing off 2 years down the road. Well said. The sox have some young talent to build around--both arms and position players. And as long as KW doesn't get too sentimental about some vets and hold onto them too long, the sox can turn over their roster and remain competitive year in and year out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Jul 22, 2008 -> 04:52 PM) How did he whiff on Rowand? Did he ever even make an offer? Would it really have mattered though? KW wasn't about to give Rowand that much money and I can hardly blame him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Jul 22, 2008 -> 04:52 PM) How did he whiff on Rowand? Did he ever even make an offer? I thought offer was made but Rowand wanted 5 and Kenny would only do 4 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 QUOTE (whitesoxbrian @ Jul 21, 2008 -> 12:58 PM) Richard is capable, IMO. How much have you seen him? I mean, suggesting he's capable of handling the rigors of a 162 season, potentially throwing 200 or more innings and making 30+ starts isn't something you just take on like it's nothing and live life. The dude has NEVER thrown a pitch in the major leagues, and you are suggesting he's capable of handling the last spot in the rotation? Edinson Volquez has been the best pitchers in the majors this year, and I'm still not about to suggest he's capable of handling a starting pitching role on any team because he hasn't proven himself to be healthy over multiple 162 game seasons plus the playoffs. That statement is just completely ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 Richard is capable, IMO. I hope he's capable of beating the Rangers today. We need it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harfman77 Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 With the idea that Fields could be moved before the deadline for an SP, we will likely be looking for a 3B come this offseason. The free agent market looks like this: Casey Blake (35) Hank Blalock (28) - $6.2MM club option for '09 with a $0.25MM buyout Joe Crede (31) Nomar Garciaparra (35) Wes Helms (33) - $3.75MM club option for '09 Chipper Jones (37) - $8-11MM vesting option for '09 Dallas McPherson (27) Depending on what happens with Blalock I could see KW making a run at him in the offseason. He is in a similar situation that Dye was when he came in, having lost time to injury that will likely cause him to sign under market value for a short term deal. If not McPherson or Blake could serve as stopgaps that would provide adequate offense and be a stopgap until such a time that Morel would be ready or Getz could end up at third. I am not sure there is a deal that would bring us a good enough SP to make it worth dealing Fields to be had at this point, but it sounds like there is the possibility of something happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 The option on Blalock is only $6.2 million? I can't see the Rangers not picking that up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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