Sox should trade Josh Fields

[jackie hayes]

I don't think Crede will get Type A compensation but I could be wrong.

I can't imagine he would. I know the rankings are based on the previous 2 years, and Joe was a B player after last year. He was actually closer to the bottom than he was to the top of the B group, and 2006 was a great year for him, so there's even a risk he falls out of the B group if he doesn't step up his production. (Unless they weight the more recent year more heavily. But I think they weight them evenly. Not completely sure about that, though.)

 

Link to last year's complete AL rankings, for the curious:

 

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/al...-complete_N.htm

[DBAHO]

There really is something wrong with the rule if Crede ended up with say 25HR's and a .260 average, and didn't get type B compensation if he left as a FA.

 

Anyways, let's hope he does get type A, but we'll wait and see.

[jackie hayes]

As far as that goes...I don't think anyone knows what level compensation Crede will get until the list is actually out, but with an all star berth this season, he's at least got a shot (one more hot streak this season would certainly help). Technically the system is supposed to look at their last 2 seasons...but in the past they've certainly ignored that rule, otherwise Eric Gagne would never have been type A when he left the Dodgers after pitching 7 innings in the 2 seasons before he hit FA. Joe's had solid seasons 2 out of the last 3 years and is going to be the top 3b on the market and probably one of the top infielders...hopefully that's enough.

That depends what categories they use for each type of player. If relievers are judged more by rate stats than by counting stats, the lack of innings may not be enough to drop someone out. BP has a short explanation of the rankings (not that they're privy to the exact formula, but apparently they've reverse engineered it reasonably well):

 

A simple regression study of player rankings shows that the "Statistical System" is simple and relatively conventional. A handful of straightforward statistical categories are picked for each positional group (different groups will use slightly different categories) and players are ranked against each other using two-year averages. The NL catcher with the highest two-year batting average gets ranked first in that category. The AL reliever with the fifth-lowest ERA in the last two years gets a fifth-place ranking in that category. The rankings across the categories for each player are averaged (a five, a 10, and a one average out to a 5.33 rank) and are then converted into a 100-point scale. That's the Elias Player ranking.

 

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=4628

 

Gagne's 2-year era was about 2.35. That'll help.

 

Crede was a mid/low B last offseason. He'll lose his 2006 stats, and his 2008 stats are (roughly) -30 points of avg, probably more strikeouts, more walks, his home run and rbi rates are about the same, run rate is a little lower (per ab). It'll depend on how other 2b, 3b, and ss play, but a jump to the A group looks very unlikely, unless he has a massively productive stretch run. Which would be great for so many other reasons, too.

[Soxfest]

When is the last time KW really made a big move at the actual deadline..........Never, he got Garcia in June. KW does alot of talking and gives the old well I tried speech!

[witesoxfan]

When is the last time KW really made a big move at the actual deadline..........Never, he got Garcia in June. KW does alot of talking and gives the old well I tried speech!

 

What big move do the Sox really need? That's what I can't figure out right now. I see slight upgrades you could make all over the roster, but they involve about adding 2-4 players to the roster, and none of them would see a significant amount of playing time down the stretch. Add a 6th starter, add a good bat or two to the bench, and shore up the bullpen a bit. What else can be done?

[Balta1701]

What big move do the Sox really need? That's what I can't figure out right now. I see slight upgrades you could make all over the roster, but they involve about adding 2-4 players to the roster, and none of them would see a significant amount of playing time down the stretch. Add a 6th starter, add a good bat or two to the bench, and shore up the bullpen a bit. What else can be done?

That really is the truth. The Sox really don't need that much in terms of big name guys, and if they went out and tried to find one, they'd have to find someone else to take one of the guys they already have. Give up the farm for Roberts? Ok, Alexei is tearing it up and hitting over .300, move him where, short or CF? Who you gonna bench, OC or Swish? Grab a 6th starter? Well, right now the guys available are a whole bunch of guys with ERA's around 5, including AJ "4.84" Burnett. Going to give up Fields or Poreda for a guy with an opt-out clause at the end of this year who even if he doesn't opt out has a nasty contract as it is and can't get his ERA below 4.75 who also might get stuck in the bullpen? Or a guy like Street? His value is high because he's a successful closer...it'd be darn nice to steal him, but he has more value to a team without a closer (i.e. Milwaukee) than he does to a team that already has Jenks and Linebrink. Sick of Konerko or Thome? Going to give up the ton needed to find a power bat better than them? Then what are you doing with the $12 or $15 million guy you're already holding?

[Buehrle>Wood]

What big move do the Sox really need? That's what I can't figure out right now. I see slight upgrades you could make all over the roster, but they involve about adding 2-4 players to the roster, and none of them would see a significant amount of playing time down the stretch. Add a 6th starter, add a good bat or two to the bench, and shore up the bullpen a bit. What else can be done?

 

How about at the coaching level? Like finally finding a replacement for Greg Walker. That would be a good start. Other than that, we're pretty good at just about every position, except for first base. If PK doesn't pick it up in the next week, we can pray to the gods to defy the odds and trade the untradeable.

[DBAHO]

Don't the Sox have above average offensive numbers in the AL this season compared to other teams (well not in BA, but in OBP, RISP and HR's)?

[Dick Allen]

Don't the Sox have above average offensive numbers in the AL this season compared to other teams (well not in BA, but in OBP, RISP and HR's)?

They are 4th in the AL in runs. The firing Walker crap is so old.

[Balta1701]

How about at the coaching level? Like finally finding a replacement for Greg Walker. That would be a good start. Other than that, we're pretty good at just about every position, except for first base. If PK doesn't pick it up in the next week, we can pray to the gods to defy the odds and trade the untradeable.

Honestly, if I were the Dodgers...I'd seriously be talking to the Sox about Konerko right now, because with the Sox holding Swisher as an out of position 1b in CF and Konerko struggling, I might be able to get him at a bargain price and actually pack some punch into my lineup.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Don't the Sox have above average offensive numbers in the AL this season compared to other teams (well not in BA, but in OBP, RISP and HR's)?

 

Yeah, I think we're decently near the top. I believe 5th in the AL in runs. Far from the problem though. We still have no approach against certain types of pitchers(See: soft tossing lefties, pitchers we've never seen before), and that is totally on the coaching staff. We've shown the ability to score in bunches, but it's just a wonder to me why we can't do it all the time. We're going to need some consistency down the stretch. Also, I'm not sure, but I thought we were near dead last in RISP average. Like I said, I'm not sure, but if someone has the numbers on them, I'd like to see them.

[Balta1701]

Yeah, I think we're decently near the top. I believe 5th in the AL in runs. Far from the problem though. We still have no approach against certain types of pitchers(See: soft tossing lefties, pitchers we've never seen before), and that is totally on the coaching staff. We've shown the ability to score in bunches, but it's just a wonder to me why we can't do it all the time. We're going to need some consistency down the stretch. Also, I'm not sure, but I thought we were near dead last in RISP average. Like I said, I'm not sure, but if someone has the numbers on them, I'd like to see them.

We are #8 in MLB in batting average with RISP and tied for #3 in OPS with RISP.

 

Our problem is we're 2nd to last in BA and OPS with RISP and 2 outs.

 

When you add those together, we're basically at the top of the league in batting with RISP and 0 or 1 out. When there's 2 outs though, the batters just seem to freeze up completely.

[Buehrle>Wood]

We are #8 in MLB in batting average with RISP and tied for #3 in OPS with RISP.

 

Our problem is we're 2nd to last in BA and OPS with RISP and 2 outs.

 

When you add those together, we're basically at the top of the league in batting with RISP and 0 or 1 out. When there's 2 outs though, the batters just seem to freeze up completely.

 

Odd indeed. We must be hitting at an absolutely ridiculous rate with less than 2 outs to have those kind of splits. .591 OPS with RISP and 2 outs...Oh man.

[witesoxfan]

Yeah, I think we're decently near the top. I believe 5th in the AL in runs. Far from the problem though. We still have no approach against certain types of pitchers(See: soft tossing lefties, pitchers we've never seen before), and that is totally on the coaching staff. We've shown the ability to score in bunches, but it's just a wonder to me why we can't do it all the time. We're going to need some consistency down the stretch. Also, I'm not sure, but I thought we were near dead last in RISP average. Like I said, I'm not sure, but if someone has the numbers on them, I'd like to see them.

 

The inability to hit soft-tossers is one reason I wouldn't mind Josh Fields sitting on the bench. He strikes out a lot, doesn't play great defense, doesn't hit for average, but he does hit breaking balls better than most people within the organization, and that could prove to be an asset. Just stick him in the middle of the lineup and hope the starting pitcher makes a mistake and actually throws him a breaking ball he can hit.

 

I also think that's more on the scouting staff than anything. Coaches talk about mechanics and mentality of hitters; they don't know the tendencies of a pitcher without a scouting report. When they get that, then they can help clue their hitters in to what the pitcher might be doing.

[GreatScott82]

Honestly, if I were the Dodgers...I'd seriously be talking to the Sox about Konerko right now, because with the Sox holding Swisher as an out of position 1b in CF and Konerko struggling, I might be able to get him at a bargain price and actually pack some punch into my lineup.

Well we were MUCH better defensively with BA out in CF and Swish at 1b. And LA and Arizona are the only 2 destinations Pauly would go to, with that being said, LA can buy Paulie cheap and we could finally add some depth to our farm system. I think its time to move on with out PK, unfortanately the Sox are in love with him even if he has become more of a liability than a strength.

[beck72]

I think Crede is the only position player who could be moved this year, that doesn't hurt the sox chances of winning. Though the sox would have to get a better deal than what the "B" picks from free agency would bring. I still don't see Crede moving, because I don't see a nice return via trade for him from another team.

 

Fields isn't much of a drop off from Joe. Moving PK would be a drop off from whomever the sox could put in the OF to replace Swisher. But this aging lineup of over 30 year olds scares me. PK, Dye, AJ, Crede, Thome, OC--Ozzie needs some help from the bench which is pretty sad.

[witesoxfan]

I think Crede is the only position player who could be moved this year, that doesn't hurt the sox chances of winning. Though the sox would have to get a better deal than what the "B" picks from free agency would bring. I still don't see Crede moving, because I don't see a nice return via trade for him from another team.

 

Fields isn't much of a drop off from Joe. Moving PK would be a drop off from whomever the sox could put in the OF to replace Swisher. But this aging lineup of over 30 year olds scares me. PK, Dye, AJ, Crede, Thome, OC--Ozzie needs some help from the bench which is pretty sad.

 

Crede and Cabrera are gone next year and will be replaced with Fields/3Bbroughtinfromoutside and, likely, Ramirez. Quentin and Swisher look like studs, and Brian Anderson is still waiting to claim a spot. Age is one thing I am not worried about with this team.

[shipps]

The way Joe Cowley was talking this morning on Mully and Hanley Josh Fields is as good as gone.He said they want a SP and Duscherer is third on their wish list.If he is third on the wish list who the hell would be 1 and 2?It would have to be a big name.

Edited July 25, 2008 by shipps

[southsider2k5]

The way Joe Cowley was talking this morning on Mully and Hanley Josh Fields is as good as gone.He said they want a SP and Duscherer is third on their wish list.If he is third on the wish list who the hell would be 1 and 2?It would have to be a big name.

 

Kenny always aims high, that is no surprise at all to me.

[tonyho7476]

Kenny always aims high, that is no surprise at all to me.

 

How do we handle contreras then? Just put his ass in the bullpen? We are stuck with the slug through next year, I believe.

[southsider2k5]

How do we handle contreras then? Just put his ass in the bullpen? We are stuck with the slug through next year, I believe.

 

We have our long reliever and the guy to replace Danks if he breaks down because of innings. Not to mention there was talk of making him a closer originally when we traded for him... He would be a tough reliever with that forkball.

[Dick Allen]

People forget Contreras had an ERA of 3.24 on 6/15. Perhaps the time off will calm his elbow down and he can find that form.

[Bubba Philips]

We have our long reliever and the guy to replace Danks if he breaks down because of innings. Not to mention there was talk of making him a closer originally when we traded for him... He would be a tough reliever with that forkball.

Article from white sox .com says that he was hit by a cedeno line drive on june 27th. Contreras tried to pitch through pain wasn't 100%. Although he has pitched well enough and completed many games. I believe would be more effective if he knew that he wouldn only have to pitch an inning or a few innings might increase his effectiveness.. He may have a little trouble concentrating and getting fatigued.. Once relegated to the bullpen he will clamoring at the bit to start again and may return to a starting roll with increased vigor and effectiveness.

[shipps]

We have our long reliever and the guy to replace Danks if he breaks down because of innings. Not to mention there was talk of making him a closer originally when we traded for him... He would be a tough reliever with that forkball.

But hasnt Jose said he DOES NOT WANT TO BE IN THE PEN?And we all know how sensitive he is when he doesnt have everything going his way.

[Dick Allen]

But hasnt Jose said he DOES NOT WANT TO BE IN THE PEN?And we all know how sensitive he is when he doesnt have everything going his way.

BS. This is a guy who defected from his country possibly never to see his family again. This "he's a pussy" crap needs to stop. He's a proud tough man. His marriage broke up. That could affect a lot of people. He plays with injuries and gets in trouble if he doesn't disclose pain. Mark Prior was called a pussy because he disclosed pain. He was upset Pablo left, but so was most of the team. He was fine when El Duque was traded.