Ancient Soxfan Ponders Schoolyard Days

[goldenponderbob]

Calling soxfan geezers to respond, if you see this. . .

 

When I was a kid I lived a half-block from a schoolyard ballfield. It was a pretty crappy place to play. The infield was lumpy, and an old lady screamed and tried to keep balls that landed in her yard across the street beyond left field.

 

But, to the kids in my neighborhood circa 1950 though 1960, roughly the years between my discovery of baseball and my eventual discovery of the opposite sex, it was the place where we learned to play the game. Say what you want about organized leagues, on that schoolyard field, along with bats held together with nails and all kinds of tape, and a three-bar catcher's mask of very mysterious origin; we had two things that organized leagues didn't have. We had no adults, and we had no sitting. I played in organized leagues, where nine and ten year olds watched eleven and twelve year olds until they became the eleven and twelve year olds, like some rite of passage. We may have had "pitcher's hands out", "no hitting to right", and "ups provide the catcher" but nobody went home having not played the game they prepared themselves to play when they left home that morning. That's a smidgeon of what I remember from those days. I eventually played for many

years in various leagues, some of which failed for lack of players, until a job assignment in the loop kept me from getting to mid-week evening games. That was nine years ago, and I miss it everyday!

 

How many of you greybeards, iI wonder, would still put on the glove if you had the chance?

 

I've been thinking about that quite a bit as this really nice summer passes mid-season, and wondered if anyone at this forum had similar thoughts. I ride my bike around Schaumburg everyday for exercise. I pass totally deserted, beautifully manicured fields continually. I have yet to see anyone having so much as a catch on one! I wouldn't be surprised to find it's against the law; or perhaps there's a permit you have to buy.

 

I'd like to put together a group of geezers in my neighborhood for a little baseball workout, if anyone here is interested and not afraid of gettng arrested. I've tried the park district, but they didn't want to have anything to do with a senior activity that didn't have a cashflow incentive attached. It seems all their senior progarms are, in one way or another, moneymakers for somebody!

 

Could anyone reading this imagine a kid or two seeing the "old-timer's comedy of errors", coming over, just out of curiosity and getting hooked the way we once did.

 

Might that, in fact, be the objective I had in mind for starting this thread!.

 

Thoughts please . . .

 

Bob McDonnell,

Schaumburg, IL

AKA [email protected]

 

 

[Chisoxfn]

I moved this over to PHT. I think its a cool thread and something with the idea of promoting the play of baseball (whether its older guys getting together or kids) is something I'm always for. I figure over here it will get a little more exposure.

 

I know I think back (I'm not even old, just 25) to when I was a kid and we were always playing all sorts of minor variation of baseball games (and other games for that matter). It was always a total blast and now kids today I swear its like all they have is video games. Hell, I played plenty of video games as I came from a golden era and got to experience Mario Bro's when it was brand new, but video games never got in the way of kids going out and having fun.

 

On our street cars would always have to go about a mile an hour through the whole neighborhood in the summer as there was always a plethora of us out there, most of us with blood running down or legs from all the times we'd do something stupid and end up laying out on the asphalt.

[greg775]

They have all age group leagues in KC, too bad you don't live around here. 50 and 60 year olds have leagues. I wouldn't want to play again at this point in time.

As a kid, however, in answer to your question.

On 103rd and Homan we had many options all w/out parents getting in the way. We'd play on the corner where there were four sewer lids as the bases. Had to use a whiffle ball however. No homeowners got mad at us for running on their lawns if we had to to get the ball.

At McGreenwood School we could play with a rubber ball using the wall of the school as a catcher/backstop. Kids could paint (with chalk) in the batters box for strike zone. If you hit too deep a homer it'd go on somebody's lawn but their windows weren't in danger, nobody got mad if you had to go through their bushes to get the ball.

 

Mt. Greenwood LL, our manager would let us take two bats and some balls after practice to play pickup games you described. Often not enough players, so no hitting to the opposite field.

No parents getting in the way. Nobody got kidnapped; nobody got approached by any kooks, the fears of parents nowadays. And yes a lot of kids got bloodied and had to run home. Parents tended to the scrapes and sometimes took 'em to hospital for stitches. Nobody died and kids learned baseball.

 

Little League Baseball game: Yes the 10 year olds sat. Most played as 11 year olds. Everybody played every inning as a 12 year old. Nobody b****ed about playing time. Few parents even attended the games on the Southside. Just as the kids wanted it. No parents on hand. In Babe Ruth League had to earn your spot no matter your age, 13, 14 or 15.

 

Times have changed. Too bad for today's kids who can't play pickup baseball, basketball and hockey as we did w/out parents getting in the way out of fear their little Johnnys will get kidnaped or hurt. Kids back in the day left their homes in the early morning, drove bikes to the park or corners or school to play ball, returned for lunch, went out again, came home for dinner, went out again til nightfall and returned home. Not one murder or scandal as a result; just healthy kids. Not one of 'em fat.

Edited August 5, 2008 by greg775

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

I played tons of rubber ball games on schoolyard asphalt same as you .Slow pitch, pitchers hand out, right field closed, not even calling people up but just going to their house and yelling for them to come out and play ball. We played fast pitch with the strike zone chalked onto a wall. I'm 50 and had been playing 12 inch softball until I was diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis. Softball is probably the way to go if you're a weezing geezer. Hardball is just to risky to play. Even in softball some of the older guys got hurt way too often and its a much slower game.

 

Welcome to Soxtalk. Also I don't think there's too many 40+ posters here. White Sox Interactive (WSI) might be a better place to look .

Edited August 6, 2008 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[YASNY]

Good thread. It brought back some wonderful memories. As soon as the last snow melted till we went back to school, it was pretty much baseball at every opportunity.

[Texsox]

When my son first started playing t-ball his coach played in an over 30 "real baseball" league. When I mentioned I was a catcher, he asked if I'd like to come practice with his team. They have drafts at the start of the seaosn, and I would not be able to play that season, but if I liked it, and was "half way decent" (this will come back), I would probably be drafted the following year. Catchers are in high demand and low supply.

 

So I quickly agreed and made plans for their upcoming practice. As I was at the sporting goods store, buying a cup, I started getting nervous. Later, I added to Jim's Life Rules

 

No male over the age of 30 should be involved in any activity that involves *themselves* wearing a cup.

 

As I got behind the plate, it felt good. The ball was popping into my old glove (yes I saved it). Then the batter stepped up and the pitcher started adding some velocity. Ouch, Damn, s***, where did all the padding go?? s***, someone is going to get hurt and it will be me. Then he announced he was going to work on his curve. Now his curve?! Those were fast balls with 20" of movement??! At this point I'm stopping about one out of three. Then they want to see my arm to second. When in the last 15 years did they move second base to the outfield? Two hops and a roll and I got it there. Finally, a curve ball in the dirt had me shooting out to the side and blocking. As the ball bounced off my chest protector all the air in my body said f*** it! we're out of here. As I layed there struggling to breath it occured to me that 12" may be better. But they graciously agreed to let me hit.

 

After connecting on a couple of weak line drives to first, the pitcher cranked it up to game speed. Holy s***! I was out of the box and thinking how happy I was that I didn't buy spikes as well.

 

Turns out most of these guys played college and more than a couple were drafted and/or minor league experience. Waaaaay out of my league.

[LosMediasBlancas]

"Fast pitch" was our game.

Complete with the strike zone square spray painted onto a wall. All you needed was two players, one bat, one glove and a rubber ball. Inevitably, the ball would roll into a sewer and we'd have to go ask our parents for money to buy a new one.

 

Anyone know what I'm talking about?

[greg775]

Of course Los Medias. It always was a thrill buying the white rubber ball at the store near Mt. Greenwood School. I don't recall ever buying more than one. Usually our game went 9 innings unless the ball got broken in half in about the 7th inning. That ended the game.

 

You are right you only needed 2 players. The fence stopped the grounders and liners. If somebody homered over the fence the batter got on his bike and went to get the ball. We never spray painted the wall, just chalk for the strike zone. The school might have balked at the spray paint.

 

You had to bat lefty once an inning if you were a righty; vice versa if you were a true lefty to make it a little easier on the arm.

I remember our LL manager demanded nobody play the game on the days we had a LL game. We actually obeyed him. You also could play 2 on 2 and put an outfielder out there.

 

I drove through the old neighborhood last year on a trip to Chicago and Mt. Greenwood School had a big ol flower display in the middle of the lot. I'm wondering if they did that years ago so kids couldn't play that game anymore. I noticed it was pretty big and would likely pretty much hinder kids who wanted to play fast pitch in modern times.

 

I had a friend who dominated LL and Babe Ruth. He threw his arm out pitching for Brother Rice and was finished. I had to wonder if all those games of fastpitch, pretty much on a daily basis, with curveballs galore helped contribute to his demise. He was really a good pitcher. A shame. Most agreed he was major college bound at least. Never was the same after throwing out his arm.

Edited August 7, 2008 by greg775

[Texsox]

I heard Nolan Ryan say that no one will come close to his longevity for the exact opposite reason as you mention, kids do not throw enough. They never develop the arm for the long haul. We baby them too much.

 

I had a coach who would not let us swim the day of games. Felt it tired out our arms and legs too much. We obeyed him too.

[goldenponderbob]

Wow! What great responses! Thanks for triggering some long dormat memories.

 

While I didn't get any takers to start a workout group (not that I intend to give up), I enjoyed rekindling thoughts about days long gone. I especially appreciated reading Texsox's recollections about playing with guys who let if be known they had been on their college teams. I remember a fellow who claimed to have been a starter for "Michigan" and had the practice jersey to prove it. He was a centerfielder, and although he flubbed more than half his chances. you could count on him to say on his eventual return to the bench, "Can you believe that? Me? Dropping one?

 

For the record, I'm content, as greg775 indicated, to not "play" in actual games anymore. At my age I don't want to promise to show up anywhere; as I have no idea what part of me is going to ache on that day.

 

My intention is more on the order of . . .

 

What if there were a place you could go, only if and when you felt like it, where regardless of age (or gender for that matter), you could just get some exercise by way of playing catch, or chasing a few flies. You knew people would be there, there would be no cost and there would be no pressure.

 

If you're on my wavelength here, you might understand that just playing catch can connect you to the game in a way no boxseat ticket can. Your old mit need not be just a family relic. Feel the seams against your fingers as you throw, and perhaps you will sense a kind of magic that connects you to the likes of Fox, Minoso and Baines.

 

The responses I've read indicate that there are others here at soxtalk who know what I'm talking about.

 

Lastly, I'd like respondees to please answer the age-old chicken/egg question as it applies to baseball. Namely, "Which came first for you, playing or watching"? In other words, did playing lead you to becoming a fan, or did some diamond hero challenge you to see what you could do)?

 

Take care, and thanks again for responding.

 

Bob McDonnell,

Schaumburg, IL

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

I watched first though I can't really be sure at what age my old man had me swing a bat or catch a ball. My dad was a Sox fan as was his dad. But I know we were watching games on WGN as well as channels 44 and 32. Listening intently on my transistor radio to Bob Elston and Red Rush.

 

He would always tell us ( my brothers and I ) that Johnny Mostil (Sox CF in the 1920's ) was a distant relative. My first hero's were Ken Berry and Joel Horlen. Never played little league or any organized hardball but always was playing catch, 500, fast pitch , whiffle ball on the corner , rubber , 16 inch softball and running bases . My Dad and 2 of my brothers also were featured in a picture with an ad for Family Day. It was quite a kick going to a game one day and seeing family in the game program. 1974 Mom or Dad buys a box seat for $4.00 and other family members pay $2.75. General admission $1.75 and .50 .

Edited August 8, 2008 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[Texsox]

Easily playing caused me to catch the fire. Having an outstanding manager when I played on a travellling team who taught us respect for the game and to play like pros also contributed.

[YASNY]

By the way, Bob, welcome to Soxtalk. That was a very impressive entry onto the board.

 

As to the question at hand, I can't remember how I got started loving baseball because I cannot remember a time when it wasn't a huge part of my life. I started playing organized ball at age 7 in what was called the Khoury League, which is still in existance today. I wanted to be a thirdbaseman because Pete Ward was my favorite. Of course, I don't think I ever played 3rd in all the years I played organized ball as I just didn't have the arm for it. Standing in the on deck circle before my first ever at bat, I was very confidant. I just knew I was going to smack that ball. That was until I stepped into the box and saw that this guy wasn't lobbing them in like my dad did. That very first fastball was an eye opener, that's for sure.

[greg775]

1974 Mom or Dad buys a box seat for $4.00 and other family members pay $2.75. General admission $1.75 and .50 .

 

Wow. That is simply amazing how much the cost of tickets have gone up. Some funny stories in here. Bob it sounds like what you are aching for wouldn't cost that much. You buy 50 baseballs online, used baseballs, and a mitt and a couple bats or one aluminum bat (perish the thought). You advertise on here or wherever for some guys to go to a h.s. field or some field and take batting practice. After the 50 balls are hit, you get exercise running to get them. The only catch. The batter must make sure he pulls the ball. No screamers up the middle or you'll end up in the hospital believe me.

 

BTW our LL manager also wouldn't let us swim. If he saw your eyes were red you were benched. Interesting what Ryan said about guys not throwing enough. I just can't help but think my friend with the powerful arm didn't do it any good busting curves from the age of 10 through 12 on almost a daily basis during the summer months, also in LL games, in Babe Ruth games, then at Bro Rice til he needed surgery.

Edited August 8, 2008 by greg775

[Texsox]

BTW our LL manager also wouldn't let us swim. If he saw your eyes were red you were benched. Interesting what Ryan said about guys not throwing enough. I just can't help but think my friend with the powerful arm didn't do it any good busting curves from the age of 10 through 12 on almost a daily basis during the summer months, also in LL games, in Babe Ruth games, then at Bro Rice til he needed surgery.

 

I think that throwing curves is the difference. Without the hand and wrist strength poor mechanics take over.

[lostfan]

I think that throwing curves is the difference. Without the hand and wrist strength poor mechanics take over.

I'm of the opinion that young kids shouldn't be throwing curveballs (or sliders). High school and Babe Ruth maybe, but at Little League age, no. It's not that it's babying the kid, it's that the strain of a curveball on a still-developing shoulder is one of the worst things you can do to it and it's easy to wreck it early. If my son wants to play baseball and learn how to throw a curveball, I'll show him, but I won't let him throw any in games. Mechanics are the hardest and most important part to get down, the rest isn't that hard.

[Texsox]

I'm of the opinion that young kids shouldn't be throwing curveballs (or sliders). High school and Babe Ruth maybe, but at Little League age, no. It's not that it's babying the kid, it's that the strain of a curveball on a still-developing shoulder is one of the worst things you can do to it and it's easy to wreck it early. If my son wants to play baseball and learn how to throw a curveball, I'll show him, but I won't let him throw any in games. Mechanics are the hardest and most important part to get down, the rest isn't that hard.

I agree. When they can hold a baseball in their fingers and "flick" it a foot or so into the air, without moving their arm or elbow, they are probably ready. And that isn't so much to help them be durable mlb pitchers, but to protect them for other sports and life down the road. Joint pain sucks no matter what you do for a living.

[lostfan]

I agree. When they can hold a baseball in their fingers and "flick" it a foot or so into the air, without moving their arm or elbow, they are probably ready. And that isn't so much to help them be durable mlb pitchers, but to protect them for other sports and life down the road. Joint pain sucks no matter what you do for a living.

Right. Even if you never play baseball again in your life, you're always going to need your elbow and shoulder. If you blow it out as a multimillion-dollar professional athete that's one thing, if you blow it because you were trying to throw filthy stuff in Little League that's another. I think it's the flipping of the wrist out that makes it so risky, a kid's arm isn't ready for that yet.

 

I can barely throw curveballs anymore though, I'm only 26. I hurt my shoulder a few years ago lifting weights in the Army, I don't remember exactly when or how though. I can throw about 5 or so to my stepdaughter before my shoulder starts flaring up again.

Edited August 8, 2008 by lostfan

[TCQ]

If you're on my wavelength here, you might understand that just playing catch can connect you to the game in a way no boxseat ticket can. Your old mit need not be just a family relic. Feel the seams against your fingers as you throw, and perhaps you will sense a kind of magic that connects you to the likes of Fox, Minoso and Baines.

 

 

I think this is why i love baseball so much. Some people say o its just a game, but its not. Its more its that feeling you get when your playing it, watching it, or as im sure many of you can attest to, just thinking about memories from back in the day. thank you for posting this as its so refreshing to see someone with this kind of passion for just about anything these days.

[RME JICO]

As a Lefty hitter (thanks to both of my brothers being Lefthanded) and all the other kids batting righty, the other kids never wanted to switch fields for just one batter, so I agreed to hit the opposite way. That really helped me improve my game in later years. Opposite field hitting is almost a lost art.

 

Other times we had to all impersonate a certain players pitching style or batting stance. That was always fun. I remember doing Fernando Valenzuela alot.

 

Now as I drive by the same fields I played on, rarely do I see them being used. I guess there are more entertaining things to do from their perspective (XBox, etc), but the kids today don't know what they are missing.

[thedoctor]

baseball is something i really wish i got to play on a more regular bases than i do now.

 

i played throughout little league, mostly second base, shortstop, and centerfield. but by the time i got to high school i was more focused on wrestling and trying to earn a scholarship, so i never played at that level. i'd say not playing in high school is one of my life's regrets.

 

through college i was really involved in training so i still didn't play. plus, getting the guys together to play a game were always difficult. but after graduation i moved home and a big group of our friends started playing. we'd never have enough for a full nine on nine game, but we'd manage. guys would get together at this field in merrionette park and we'd play with right field being out, pitcher's hand, or whatever adjustment we needed to accommodate the amount of guys we had available.

 

i ended up moving out of the chicago area but the guys i played with kept up. the summer after i left they got a group of about 12 of our most regular players together and formed a team for a fall league. the team was terrible, but guys had a good time. this kept up for a summer and the team joined again the following summer. that year a buddy of mine who was a pretty good high school pitcher broke his humerus trying to throw a curveball. it was an ugly scene and pretty much spelled the end for the team.

 

for my part, i haven't played the game in awhile. i played some 12-inch softball for a few years, but once my daughter was born and my career got accelerated it got harder to find the time.

 

but i no doubt miss it a lot. i would love to play. there's just something about running down a deep fly ball or that feeling when you really connect on a pitch.

[goldenponderbob]

Thanks again for the comments.

 

If anyone lives in the Schaumburg area and wants to meet at some otherwise deserted field, contact me via e-mail. I still have a half dozen usable balls from my playing days.

 

A few leftover thoughts based on stuff brought up by other posters, I would like to share.

 

My dad played his way out of the dust/bible belt during the 20's in and around Misouri and Kansas. He wound up getting a forrestry degree from a small religious college in Pennsylvania (very long story) even though, as he would have attested, he did't have a religious bone in his body. He was a small, skinny, and of course right handed, 3rd baseman. From the first time we played catch he said I naturally threw as though I were pitching. Being left handed and small myself, pitching seemed like the only decent fit. My high school yearbook lists me as a pitcher/firstbaseman, but that's only because a neighbor who worked for Wilson Sporting Goods made me a gift of a trapper. I didn't really mind playing first, but I detested the glove; probably as it reminded me of the power a big guy at fisrt ought to give a team that I couldn't.

 

My dad, early on, discouraged me from throwing a curve, but worked almost daily with me to develop a slider. All through high school when catchers called for a curve, I just threw the slider instead. Not until I saw Mariano Rivera, did I have an inkling that anyone else on the planet did that. I've suspected these many years that some mentor once gave him similar advice. I may not have all the facts correct, but from what I've seen, that's mostly what he does, and he's had a relatively long injury free career compared with those who relied on their curve balls.

 

About getting hurt. I never went to play thinking I might get hurt. I recall a few tmes when injury kept me out of a game. And another when it should have. Hoping sombody will get a chuckle, here are a few cautionary tales of my physical woes.

 

Warming up before a high school game playing threeway catch, a forth person came up with a ball and motioned me to break off and throw with him. Thinking the guy next to him knew this was happening, I switched my concentration, which resulted in my getting plunked just above the eye, which partially closed it for the rest of that day and a few more besides.

 

Exactly one week later, on a very chilly day, while running the perimeter with other pitchers, as we crossed the outfield the coach yelled for soneone close enough to catch up with a long fly headed out toward deep center. As I looked up to get a bead on it, still on a dead run, an icy blast of air hit my eyes making them unexpectedly tear up just as the ball smacked me in the face, just below the eye on the same side of my face as the lump from the previous week.

 

Those are the only injuries I can recall up through high school and neither happened during a game.

 

Later, two more odd little injuries occurred whle playing in amateur leagues.

 

A week after gettng married, pitching batting practice before a game in an adult league in Skoke (1975), I reached out with my bare hand, pure unconcious reflex, to snag what appeared to be a little squibber off the end of a bat as it passed the left side of my head. My dad had taught me to properly cover up and protect myself after delivery, so I should have stabbed at the ball with my gloved hand, but some lessons in this game, I've found, are really learrned only through deep impression. I just now glanced down at the enlarged knuckle which still bares the reminder of that moment. I was fortunate to get my new wedding band off before the swelling set in. I switched the ring to my right hand where it remains.

 

Moving forward to a perfect summer day, circa 1980, Des Plaines, and a little four-team league that folded in mid-season. I was going to be pitching and had been thinking about that all morning. But first I had a lawn to mow. As I pulled the cord to start the mower I felt a littlle pop at the base of my spine. Just a twinge, hardly noticeable, a little knot, nothing to worry about, I thought. The pain, what little there was, was nearly gone by the time I got to field (Maine West High School the little field near the mobile home park on Oakton for anyone interested in details). The more I threw the less I felt the ache. My focus on what I was doing must have had a morphine-like affect, because by an hour or so after the game I was really beginning tho hurt. The three incidents described above aren't in the same universe with what was happening to my back by later that evening, and that was just the teaser. The next morning it took me nearly an hour to get from my bed to the toilet and it was a week before I could walk normally. I often wondered how much of that stemmed from the initial pop and how much was exacerbated by my intention to pitch that day, no matter what.

 

I had many little momentary agonies, among which the one I disliked most would be any pitch that hit the ground and skipped up into my ankle. That was always the most painful and, even though I could see it coming, I found it nearly impossible to avoid.

 

Bsides disliking trapper gloves, here a few more miscellaneous thoughts from my daya as a player as well as a fan.

 

As a fan, I most dislliked the "designated hitter" (I may be enormously wrong but I think White Sox fans probably can recall more great hitting pitchers than any other MLB team). I also dislike any kind of bat that differs noticeably from a Louisville Slugger.

 

My mit since little league, bears the "Spaulding Trapocket" trademark and the name "Whitey Ford". On the cuff is a tag my mother sowed on that dates from when I went a baseball camp in 1958. I always used a thin piece of dried sponge to keep the pocket a little "soft" (making balls less likely to popout).

 

That was a carryover from the rubber-coated hardball, a great invention for kids with fingers too small to appreciate seams. I was around when it first became popular and meant we could dispense with the nearly black balls with split-open seams that never played right after gettng wet. Eventually the rubber coated balls would also split, but in the meantime you could scrub them like golfballs. We typically played until you could no longer see the ball so this meant a few more precous minutes each day.

 

My favorite player was Nellie Fox. I always tried to imagine myself copying his style of meeting the ball squarely and driving it as a natural extention of where it was pitched (like a billiard shot). Power is a great thing and a necessary balance, but contact hitters like Fox who are certain to put the ball in play keep constant pressure on the defense and force the mistakes that make it possible to beat the better pitchers. When the Yankees came to town in the 50's the Sox would have been swept everytime without that element. Does anyone here remember how Stengel always tried to make sure that Pierce faced Ford But for that, Pierce would have been our best chance to start the game as the better pitcher. (Stengel was famous for saying "you cannot win them all", but there's a lot of proof that he never believed it)! In case you are too young, back then beating the Yankees was that mattered, that was our season and our World Series.

 

Next time I post, I'll relate what I recall about my first trip to Comiskey to see the awsone wonderful terrible Yankees!

 

All for now, and thanks again for responding to my ruminations.

 

Bob McDonnell (AKA [email protected])

Schaumburg, IL