Al Lopez's Ghost Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 After this season, he will have 2 years, 65 days of major league service time, so free agency is 3 years away. So do you offer a 5 year, 40+ million deal? More? And if he turns down a multi-year deal, what do you renew him at? The minimum isn't fair and would probably piss him off. Your thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedoctor Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (Al Lopez's Ghost @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 03:28 PM) After this season, he will have 2 years, 65 days of major league service time, so free agency is 3 years away. So do you offer a 5 year, 40+ million deal? More? And if he turns down a multi-year deal, what do you renew him at? The minimum isn't fair and would probably piss him off. Your thoughts? i would open discussions with he and alexei sooner rather than later. probably danks and floyd as well. these are four potential cornerstone type players and i'd rather not dick around and play contract roulette with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 With flowers. I sense us trying to stay fiscally responsible, but I'm damn sure we'll reward him somehow, in addition to the World Series MVP bonus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonxctf Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 this is what i don't understand about professional sports. the guy is locked up in a contract for 3 more years. This year could be a fluke, or it couldn't. Regardless your risk is far greater than your reward here. Should the Sox go back to Contreras and ask him for money back since he underperformed?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilMonkey Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (jasonxctf @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 09:33 AM) Should the Sox go back to Contreras and ask him for money back since he underperformed?? YES!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I wouldn't. With all of the health issues, I wait until at least after next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipps Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 09:10 AM) I wouldn't. With all of the health issues, I wait until at least after next year. When he ran into the wall with that left shoulder yesterday I had to cringe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanOfCorn Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I think it's a little too early to be thinking about buying out the first years of arbitration. Maybe wait until after next year. I think he's a great talent and will continue to be, but the Sox should see about injury (since he does have a history) and to see what next year looks like. Now, if he wins the MVP, and the Sox win the WS or get close, I might change my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Lopez's Ghost Posted August 25, 2008 Author Share Posted August 25, 2008 I understand not wanting to gamble on a long term contract - but what about the other question - what do you pay him next year, when you have the right to determine the amount. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I thought you need to have 6+ years of service time to hit free agency, in which case Quentin would be four seasons away, right? Regardless, you're looking for savings when you sign a player to an extension who's several seasons away from free agency. I don't think you'd want to go tons higher than an average of $7 or 8 million during his arbitration years or you're just not saving a ton of money, even if he continues to be one of the best hitters in the league. Also, with CQ, you have to consider his injury history and the fact that this is his best season by a long shot. I think I'd feel more comfortable talking about a big extension after he has another season with the team under his belt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (Al Lopez's Ghost @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 09:39 AM) I understand not wanting to gamble on a long term contract - but what about the other question - what do you pay him next year, when you have the right to determine the amount. With the exception of one player (was it Buehrle?) the Sox seem to handle that thing fine. If you give the player a couple hundred thousand more than you must, that generally makes the player happy and doesn't break the bank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I agree that CQ is one that we would like to see stay with the Sox, but I am not so sure we start handing out major dollars on a new contract just yet. It is a real hard one to call for sure. Alexei was signed for four years I believe and I think Danks and Floyd are probably getting major league minimums or a bit higher. Remember baseball is a big business now and businesses aren't going to be handing out extra money until they absolutely have to do so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedoctor Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 there is definitely a risk to approaching someone this early. and to clarify my earlier point, i wouldn't probably go to the route of making contract offers at this point. for all you know, these guys may not want that either. if cq were to continue his production he could make a helluva lot more in two years than he could today. who is his agent, any way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 The reason why all these people started getting these rapid contracts is Ryan Howard. The dude won $10 mil in arbitration his first year. Right after that we saw that surge of Ramirez, Longoria, etc., all being locked up for years, because those teams were smart enough to realize that Howard's deal set a new bar. G*d will probably be in that same ballpark for his first arbitration year if you don't lock him up soon. Shoot for an $8-$9 million a year average and try to get an option year on the end to buy out a FA year, and hope he is willing to sign because you're taking the risk on his injury history Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan101 Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 10:10 AM) I wouldn't. With all of the health issues, I wait until at least after next year. You are going to lose an awful lot of extra money by doing that if he stays healthy from now through 2009. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipps Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 Isnt the point of managing a roster is too have players on that roster that are successful at a great price?It seems people want the sox to dish out a ton of money right now to the guy just because we love him so much.I realize we want to make him happy but on some levels I want to say tough s*** we will give you what we want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (shipps @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 09:16 AM) Isnt the point of managing a roster is too have players on that roster that are successful at a great price?It seems people want the sox to dish out a ton of money right now to the guy just because we love him so much.I realize we want to make him happy but on some levels I want to say tough s*** we will give you what we want. The problem is those arbitration and FA years. There's no reason to think that if he stays healthy he won't go $11 million, $14 million, $16 million (or more) through those years and then have someone push him a $20 million a year offer when he hits FA. Howard and a couple other guys are still blazing the arbitration trail and blowing out the numbers before him. Saying we'll pay him what we want is fine for next year...but not when we lose control of it. If you can give us some cost certainty against future arbitration price explosions and at the same time buy out a year or two of FA, then this team has to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 10:16 AM) You are going to lose an awful lot of extra money by doing that if he stays healthy from now through 2009. You lose an awful lot of money if years of his career are wasted by shoulder surgery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Hates Prospects Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 11:11 AM) The reason why all these people started getting these rapid contracts is Ryan Howard. The dude won $10 mil in arbitration his first year. Right after that we saw that surge of Ramirez, Longoria, etc., all being locked up for years, because those teams were smart enough to realize that Howard's deal set a new bar. G*d will probably be in that same ballpark for his first arbitration year if you don't lock him up soon. Shoot for an $8-$9 million a year average and try to get an option year on the end to buy out a FA year, and hope he is willing to sign because you're taking the risk on his injury history Great post. There are always risks involved with longterm contracts, and that goes for every single player regardless of his injury history or lack thereof, but with players like Carlos it can be a very smart move. With Carlos, it's more about betting on his health than his production. If he's healthy he'll keep tearing the league up, and if not, he won't. I hope the Sox go longterm with him soon because it could save them a lot of money, and that money should translate to better players on the Major League team and/or better prospects in the draft or as international free agents. Danks OTOH I would definitely wait on, same goes for Floyd. Danks needs to show in '09 that the workload of this season hasn't affected him all that much, and he also has to show he's capable of pitching deeper into ballgames before we lock him up on a large deal. With Floyd, he needs to put up another good year in '09 as well. Alexei is already locked up through 2011 at the cost of a decent backup catcher, but with another great year out of him in '09 I'd think it would be very wise to re-work his contract, possibly even mid-season '09, so that he gets paid more through 2011 but we get him for another year or two on top of it at a nice rate. Por ejemplo, if you change the contract to give him $4M in 2010 and 2011 with $5M coming in 2012 and, if the world doesn't end, 2013, you could look at it as his current contract plus two additional years at $8M per, which would be a hell of a bargain given inflation and the rise in baseball salaries year to year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RME JICO Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I think you wait one more year. If there is no regression in 2009, you lock him up for the long term. However, you definitely need to take advantage of his arb years to maximize the payroll flexibility of the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (RME JICO @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 09:30 AM) I think you wait one more year. If there is no regression in 2009, you lock him up for the long term. However, you definitely need to take advantage of his arb years to maximize the payroll flexibility of the team. According to our beautiful contract sheet, 2009 is Q's last Pre-arb year. Which means that if you plan on trying to lock him up long term after 2009, you may as well expect to give him 5/75 or something in that range, because that's what he'll be getting anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 He's 4 years away from free agency, not 3. He won't be arbitration eligible until 2010. Next year is when Carlos earns his money, if he has another huge year or half year you lock his ass up long term and buyout a few years of free agency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RME JICO Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 10:42 AM) According to our beautiful contract sheet, 2009 is Q's last Pre-arb year. Which means that if you plan on trying to lock him up long term after 2009, you may as well expect to give him 5/75 or something in that range, because that's what he'll be getting anyway. So doesn't that make the cutoff after 2010? So you lock him up after 2009 and still won't have to worry about outrageous contracts yet and can actually buy out some of his first few years of free agency with a 5 year deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I'd wait a few seasons, they negotiate before his "walk" year. Believe it or not, Q has been injured before and I would like to see how well his surgically repaired shoulder holds up over a few seasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Aug 25, 2008 -> 10:49 AM) Danks OTOH I would definitely wait on, same goes for Floyd. Danks needs to show in '09 that the workload of this season hasn't affected him all that much, and he also has to show he's capable of pitching deeper into ballgames before we lock him up on a large deal. With Floyd, he needs to put up another good year in '09 as well. . Show that he can pitch deeper into games? Huh? He's 18IP behind buehrle with one less start. Thats a pretty damn good pace. Danks has alot of IP, and has shown he's a top of the rotation pitcher who works hard on his game. There really isnt much he needs to show at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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