Why are you what you are?

[kapkomet]

Were just putting it off because there's bound to be a clash between a Libertarian (or at least thats what I think DrunkBomber is) and a Socialist if they're within such close proximity. But please, in the future dont bring communism into the discussion at all. You wouldn't call Norway or Sweden communist countries would you?

What did I say? Read it. I said "take it away", didn't I? You can't use those countries as a good discussion point because of their population - also they have a different structure then you think they do...

 

We can talk offline, or start another thread, and I won't be a jerk - just try to 'splain.

[DukeNukeEm]

What did I say? Read it. I said "take it away", didn't I? You can't use those countries as a good discussion point because of their population.

 

We can talk offline, or start another thread, and I won't be a jerk - just try to 'splain.

Some other time, I've been drinking and am about to leave. Believe me, I would love to spend some time trashing Capitalism!

[kapkomet]

Some other time, I've been drinking and am about to leave. Believe me, I would love to spend some time trashing Capitalism!

You're crazy.

 

I just sent you a PM. We'll talk later.

 

[DrunkBomber]

Were just putting it off because there's bound to be a clash between a Libertarian (or at least thats what I think DrunkBomber is) and a Socialist if they're within such close proximity. But please, in the future dont bring communism into the discussion at all. You wouldn't call Norway or Sweden communist countries would you?

I would probably classify myself as a libertarian. Im not going to criticize anyone elses views though, I was just explaining mine.

[DukeNukeEm]

I would probably classify myself as a libertarian. Im not going to criticize anyone elses views though, I was just explaining mine.

Democracy wont work unless we viciously attack each other until vultues pick at our rotting corpses. Be prepared, I dont know read a book in print or something... I know how you Libertarians get about those internets.

 

Edited August 31, 2008 by DukeNukeEm

[lostfan]

Democracy wont work unless we viciously attack each other until vultues pick at our rotting corpses. Be prepared, I dont know read a book in print or something... I know how you Libertarians get about those internets.

 

God you're messed up

 

Tomorrow morning you will see this and lawl.

Edited August 31, 2008 by lostfan

[DrunkBomber]

Democracy wont work unless we viciously attack each other until vultues pick at our rotting corpses. Be prepared, I dont know read a book in print or something... I know how you Libertarians get about those internets.

 

Damn Al Gore for bringing us these here intra nets

[DukeNukeEm]

Damn Al Gore for bringing us these here intra nets

I blame the Google.

[jackie hayes]

This is not a thread to ATTACK PEOPLE, or QUESTION WHAT THEY SAY. It is merely a spot to post your own thoughts as to why you are what you are. There really should be no quoting of anyone.

What? Huh? What?

[Jake]

This is not a thread to ATTACK PEOPLE, or QUESTION WHAT THEY SAY.

 

Threads in the filibuster with those rules don't go far.

[DABearSoX]

I'm a little too tired to think clearly but that looks like you're criticizing me, I do realize I went off track from your original post.

 

I wasn't tryin to criticize you...hahaha....if everyone stayed on the lines of the original post or title this place would be no fun....

[Texsox]

I believe a strong building begins at the foundation and that the working class is our nation's foundation. Building from the top and hoping a foundation will appear is too risky for me. I believe we have an obligation to feed each other. I always think we can do better. I also believe there are multiple paths to the same goal and that character counts over ideology. That man is inherently good and fair. I believe in second chances. I believe that life is sacred, both for the unborn and the born and I would sooner trust the government to heal the sick then to kill people. I believe we can achieve anything we can conceive. I'm not an originalist with the Constitution, the writers are fallible, but I also believe I should be able to own a gun. I believe we need to write laws that benefit American businesses as well as the workers. That neither side always has the other side's interest at heart, or really knows what is best. I believe we need to pay for government, not leave a debt for someone else. I'd rather have a spend and tax government then a spend and borrow. Cut taxes when there is a surplus, not deficits.

[Jake]

I wasn't tryin to criticize you...hahaha....if everyone stayed on the lines of the original post or title this place would be no fun....

 

Dang, now I can't get in a message board fight.

[whitesoxfan101]

I know what I believe, but I'm kind of confused what it means. I have always thought of myself as a moderate who leans to the right. I will try and describe some of my beliefs.

 

Religion- I am a practicing protestant (Lutheran) and have strong convictions with my religion. However, I am sad and almost ashamed at times to see how some people who call themselves "christians" treat people outside of the faith. If you are muslim, buddhist, jewish, even atheist, whatever, I don't care. As long as you are a decent person and can respect what I believe, I can respect what you believe, even if we don't agree. I am happy and willing to spread the word of my faith and how I got to where I am, but only to people who want to hear it. I don't want to force it on anybody, but if you ask me about my convictions, I'll tell you.

 

Abortion- I am personally against it, would never encourage anybody to do it unless the mother's life is at risk or rape was involved, but I think it should remain legal. First off, of course, is what happens where abortion is illegal. Of course, you see lots more risky abortions being done by people unqualified for it, and that leads to problems. I believe I read 75 thousand women a year die from ill fated abortions in areas where it is illegal, and abortion is only illegal for 1/4 of the earth's people. Plus, in Mexico, one million women a year seek illegal abortions. These are consequences that people don't think about, but are very legitimate reasons, IMO, to keep abortion legal. As much as you can argue that abortions take away lives before they start, it might save the lives of many women by having them legal since it eliminates the use of back-alley abortions. So I guess I'm personally pro-life, but would like to see the law remain pro-choice.

 

Gay Marriage- I understand that the church is strongly against it. In terms of being gay itself, I have a hard time decided what I think of people who are. I tend to think (and pardon my ignorance if it's obvious, I'm not a doctor) that being gay is something you are born with. I have no problem with people who are gay, and think they deserve rights. I am also not an expert on the difference between marriage and civil unions, so I'll avoid the terminology and just say what I think. I think the churches of America shouldn't be forced to recognize gay marriage. I think it's their right to believe as they wish, and that's fine. However, I think the states (and the country in general) should recognize gay couples as equal, and give them the same benefits a married couple are allowed. I think that makes me for civil unions? But I'm not sure. I think gay couples should be allowed to be parents too without problem. I don't think they are going to "make their kids gay", plus whose to dismiss gay couples as bad parents? Plenty of straight couples can't parent for s***, and gay couples can't be much worse.

 

As for other issues. I was against the war in Iraq from the start, because I was suspecious that the intelligence was bad and thought we needed to pay more attention to the war on terror. I am very strongly for states' rights, I am just as strongly against universal health care, and I think the government should at all costs try to stay out of people's business. I generally can't stand people who I consider to be extremists regardless of party, thus I can't stand George W. Bush and I also can't stand Barack Obama. I wish our government would put partisian politics aside and try to get things done, try to compromise, and try to help the people, but I know it'll never happen. I believe in promoting safe sex first, but am not against promoting abstinence either. People should know how to have safe sex, but abstinence promotion isn't a complete waste of time either.

 

I tend to vote republican the majority of the time, but I'd MUCH rather see a moderate democrat than a right wing republican win a race for office. An ideal government for me would have a mix of moderate lefties and righties willing to listen to each others ideas. I don't know a lot about taxes and the economy, but I'd like to see big business get less breaks, the common man get more, and taxes remain relatively low. I am skeptical of how bad global warming actually is and how much we the people are at fault, but I am pro-green technology, recycling, etc., and want us to treat the planet as well as we can while trying to come up with cleaner energy. So I don't know where that leaves me, but those are some of my beliefs. They look a bit "out there" as I read them over again.

Edited September 1, 2008 by whitesoxfan101

[WCSox]

I identify myself as a Reagan/Goldwater/Gingrich fiscal conservative. I'm a registered Republican, but don't always vote that way (e.g., Gore in 2000). The breakdown...

 

Economy/Taxes - Supported the Bush tax cuts, but was appalled at the massive spending. This is where Bush/Cheney went horribly wrong and I'm glad that we have the opportunity to rectify this with McCain/Palin. I support keeping taxes on business low to help support job creation/sustainability, but wouldn't be terribly opposed to a *modest* income tax increase for the upper-middle and upper classes. I'd also be in favor of a slight further shift of the tax burden from income to sales.

 

Entitlements - Strongly support welfare for those in need, but not as a lifestyle for the irresponsible. Despite the obvious triangulation, I give Clinton props for the Welfare Reform Act. Also support the expansion of Medicare and Medicaid, but do not support fully-socialized health care. The vast tax revenue needed to support it would result in mass layoffs, and free health care doesn't mean that much when one is living on a park bench. It would also result in health care rationing, increased illegal immigration, and would bring drug development to a halt. I don't have a comprehensive solution, but I'd support tighter oversight of the insurance industry and would imprison/deport illegal immigrants after they use our emergency rooms. Washington has pilfered Social Security for too long and the money needs to be moved to private accounts.

 

National Security - Would supplement the Border Patrol with the Army and would give them the authority to engage the corrupt Mexican police/military when they aid drug-traffickers. Would continue to keep our military strong. Cracking down on businesses that hire illegals (crippling demand) would also be helpful.

 

Gay Marriage - The government needs to stop sanctioning "marriages" and should instead allow for legally-equal civil unions for both heterosexual and homosexual couples. The word "marriage" needs to be given back to the religious institutions.

 

Abortion - Catholic and completely against it in my household. Strongly against partial-birth abortions, but am not interested in any sort of general ban. The gray area should be decided by the states.

 

Environment - I'm pro-business and also financially-support conservation efforts. That may sound like a strange combination, but it's a necessary one IMO.

Edited September 1, 2008 by WCSox

[GoSox05]

I'm far to the left, something like democratic socialist. I vote Nader for president.

 

Here's how I go on some issues.

 

For single payer healthcare

Cut the Military budget

Pro-choice

Pro-gay marriage

Against Nafta

Against both current wars.

For animal rights, i've been a vegetarian for most of my adult life and member of the evil terrorist PETA.

I think global warming is very real

 

 

I'm also very pro-beer and the only church I attend is the church of Black Flag.

Edited September 2, 2008 by GoSox05

[ChiSox_Sonix]

I don't really know what I am, but i have voted predominantly Republican since I turned 18 six years ago. I couldnt possibly feel any stronger against universal healthcare, and am very, very anti-illegal immigration(i want to build a wall). To me, universal healthcare would be a colossal mistake for this country and I pray we never have it. Canada has it, and people say how good that must be, but for many situations it is not. I had a Canadian teacher in college for several classes and he told me on the surfacr it looks good, but one of the reasons they remain in NY is b/c of the level of care they receieve through their provider here. I think thats probably why I have voted how I have. I do have many "leftist" tendencies however, such as being pro-choice, pro-legalization of prostituion and marijuana (so the govt can tax the s*** out of them and reap the benefits), and willing to give any current illegal immigrant a time period to gain legal status in our country. However, I also support the war. I agree we need to leave, but unlike the Dems, I dont believe we can just up and leave in the short time period they want to and actually cant believe they think that would actually work. I support the right to own guns and have that kind of republican attitude, but I am against whaling and the fur trade (liberal), but I think the PETA people are nuts and I enjoy a nice steak.

 

So i dont think i even fall in the middle. I have ideas that are on each spectrum. I know i'm voting McCain this election, b/c the issues that mean the most to me, he better fits my desires and shares similar ideas with me.

Edited September 2, 2008 by ChiSox_Sonix

[southsider2k5]

I would have to call myself a Jeffersonian. I believe the government should be extremely limited in size and in scope. The country was formed on the ideals of each person being an independant entity, and we have gotten a long way away from that. Lots of the points still ring really true to me 230+ years later.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffersonian_Democracy

 

* The core political value of America is representative democracy; citizens have a civic duty to aid the state and resist corruption, especially monarchism and aristocracy.[1]

* The yeoman farmer best exemplifies virtue and independence from corrupting city influences; government policy should be for his benefit. Financiers, bankers and industrialists make cities the cesspools of corruption, and should be avoided.[2]

* Americans had a duty to spread what Jefferson called the "Empire of Liberty" to the world, but should avoid "entangling alliances."[3]

* The national government is a dangerous necessity to be instituted for the common benefit, protection, and security of the people, nation or community; it should be watched closely and circumscribed in its powers. Most Anti-Federalists from 1787-88 joined the Jeffersonians.[4]

* Republicanism, also known as representative democracy, is the best form of government and representative democracy is needed to prevent the tyranny by the majority, as Madison explained in Federalist No. 10.

* The wall of separation between church and state is the best method to keep religion free from intervention by the federal government, government free of religious disputes, and religion free from corruption by government.[5]

* The federal government must not violate the rights of individuals. The Bill of Rights is a central theme.[6]

* The federal government must not violate the rights of the states. The Kentucky and Virginia Resolutions of 1798 (written secretly by Jefferson and Madison) proclaim these principles.[7]

* Freedom of speech and the press is the best method to prevent the tyranny of the people by their own government. The Federalists' violation of this idea through the Alien and Sedition Acts of 1798 became a major issue.[8]

* A standing army and navy are dangerous to liberty and should be avoided; much better was to use economic coercion such as the embargo.[9]

* The United States Constitution was written in order to ensure the freedom of the people. A strict view of how the constitution was written is kept.

[Middle Buffalo]

I WAS POSTING THIS IN THE "SARAH PALIN" THREAD, BUT IT WAS CLOSED AS I WAS TYPING. I'LL POST IT HERE BECAUSE I REALLY LIKED THE IDEA BEHIND THIS THREAD. I'M NOT CHANGING THE CONTENT OF MY POST BECAUSE IT'S LATE, AND I'M LAZY.

 

[As submitted to the "Sarah Palin" thread]

This thread perfectly represents the worst things about politics. People are so dug in as Dems or Reps that they won't admit when someone from their party is wrong, made a mistake, is underqualified, etc. It's really pretty disgusting. 39 pages of people bending the truth to fit their argument.

 

I was watching CNN (Anderson Cooper) tonight, and there were experts on assessing the performance of Palin in her interview with Gibson. The Republican said she did great. The Democrat wasn't impressed. Wow. Shocking. This thread has been exactly the same.

 

I like when I see McCain and Obama being cordial to one another. I think they're both pretty classy guys who've pretty much been above much of the mud-slinging. I wish the liberals and conservatives in the media (and here on Soxtalk) would follow their lead and talk about the issues.

 

This forum should be a place where people can go to see what the other side thinks and why. Maybe, people might even change their minds on some issues based on some of the discussions they participate in here. Unfortunately, it's mostly a place where staunch Dems/Reps go to post rhetoric.

 

 

[NorthSideSox72]

I WAS POSTING THIS IN THE "SARAH PALIN" THREAD, BUT IT WAS CLOSED AS I WAS TYPING. I'LL POST IT HERE BECAUSE I REALLY LIKED THE IDEA BEHIND THIS THREAD. I'M NOT CHANGING THE CONTENT OF MY POST BECAUSE IT'S LATE, AND I'M LAZY.

 

[As submitted to the "Sarah Palin" thread]

This thread perfectly represents the worst things about politics. People are so dug in as Dems or Reps that they won't admit when someone from their party is wrong, made a mistake, is underqualified, etc. It's really pretty disgusting. 39 pages of people bending the truth to fit their argument.

 

I was watching CNN (Anderson Cooper) tonight, and there were experts on assessing the performance of Palin in her interview with Gibson. The Republican said she did great. The Democrat wasn't impressed. Wow. Shocking. This thread has been exactly the same.

 

I like when I see McCain and Obama being cordial to one another. I think they're both pretty classy guys who've pretty much been above much of the mud-slinging. I wish the liberals and conservatives in the media (and here on Soxtalk) would follow their lead and talk about the issues.

 

This forum should be a place where people can go to see what the other side thinks and why. Maybe, people might even change their minds on some issues based on some of the discussions they participate in here. Unfortunately, it's mostly a place where staunch Dems/Reps go to post rhetoric.

Bolded part is an excellent point. A lot of the snark happening is NOT coming from either campaign - its coming from supporters, followers, and party reps.

 

[YASNY]

Bolded part is an excellent point. A lot of the snark happening is NOT coming from either campaign - its coming from supporters, followers, and party reps.

 

Agreed. Great idea. I'm going to take a shot at it.