Sarah Palin

[Balta1701]

Obama didn't actually get as big of a bounce as I expected for such a well executed speech, but your point is well taken. As for your point, it is 110 percent accurate. That is why I think they should have announced Palin a few weeks to a month ago if this is their strategy, see if it works or not. If they really knew all this was going to come out, i'd have been better to announce her, see how it goes, and if it doesn't work, you always have the "she has changed her mind and wants to drop out to support everything going on with her family back in Alaska" excuse.

There is one other issue to consider when thinking about how they did this rollout...it kind of lumps in with the experience one but not exactly...

 

Governor Palin has spent the last 2 years in Alaskan politics. While that has various issues I'm sure, in a lot of cases they're going to be no where near where the other national issues are. She has a vice presidential debate coming up in a month. Basically now, she has a month to learn every single bit of the McCain campaign's policy points on issues she's never had to deal with...along with spending time doing actual campaign events. John McCain's been campaigning for years now and he still can't get all his policy statements right.

 

Unless Governor Palin is ridiculously bright, I have no idea how she could possibly be prepared to get all of that info down. I couldn't do it in a month. She suddenly has to go from knowing about how oil issues relate to alaska to being able to talk intelligently about energy issues nationwide. Think she has much experience dealing with solar power plants? Think she knows much about McCain's climate change policy? His tax policy? His healthcare policy? And perhaps most notably, his foreign policy?

 

Just compared to either Biden or to any of the other major Republican candidates, she's in a position where she simply wouldn't be expected to be working on these topics. Now she has to pivot completely and within one month be prepared to go toe-to-toe with Joe Biden, a man who's been on the campaign trail nationally himself as recently as January and who is a Senate Foreign relations guy.

 

Here's a little thing I'm going to be watching for...I want to see Governor Palin actually take questions from the press. Never mind how hostile they may be to her right now, if she's not taking unscripted questions from the press about various issues and where she stands on them, then that's telling you how prepped she is. She's already been cutting back on scheduled events since stuff has started breaking. She's probably got a long, long way to go to be ready for even that debate.

[HuskyCaucasian]

Obama didn't actually get as big of a bounce as I expected for such a well executed speech, but your point is well taken. As for your point, it is 110 percent accurate. That is why I think they should have announced Palin a few weeks to a month ago if this is their strategy, see if it works or not. If they really knew all this was going to come out, i'd have been better to announce her, see how it goes, and if it doesn't work, you always have the "she has changed her mind and wants to drop out to support everything going on with her family back in Alaska" excuse.

That would have been an EXCELLENT move in my opinion. It would have come across as authentic and caring. It wouldn't have been the typical "oops he made a mistake with the VP and now needs to choose another" thing.

 

The problem is that as was pointed out by BigSqwert in the Dem thread, McCain had a 3 months head start. He largely squandered it in every possible way. Whether it be fund raising, gaining political / media "favor", ripping Obama / Clinton down or vetting his VP. He did very little. he was "the other guy" while Clinton and Obama went toe to toe. McCain had 3 months to do a VERY thorough search of tons of people. He clearly wanted Lieberman but buckled at the last moment, so he had to scramble to find someone else. The moment the "7 houses" issue came up, Romney was out. If the innuendo is to believed, Pawlenty had a skeleton. Any pro-abortion" VP was out. Who now? Well, let's go for the little known and hope we can frame her image before the other side does.

[HuskyCaucasian]

Unless Governor Palin is ridiculously bright, I have no idea how she could possibly be prepared to get all of that info down. I couldn't do it in a month.

I consider myself a fairly well educated person with a slightly above average IQ. There is NO way I could ever think to be ready to be a VP in less than month. not even a chance. Especially since i have no actual foreign policy experience of any kind other than what I read online. I'd be ignorant to even think I could be ready to debate nuanced fine points of foreign relations on a national stage. (PS: not calling Palin ignorant here. Just saying I know myself and I know I personally wouldn't be able to)

 

If I were Biden, I;d find a way to sneak in one simple question during the VP debate... "tell me the difference between the Sunni and Shiite" and pray it doesn't blow up in his face.

Edited September 3, 2008 by Athomeboy_2000

[whitesoxfan101]

That would have been an EXCELLENT move in my opinion. It would have come across as authentic and caring. It wouldn't have been the typical "oops he made a mistake with the VP and now needs to choose another" thing.

 

The problem is that as was pointed out by BigSqwert in the Dem thread, McCain had a 3 months head start. He largely squandered it in every possible way. Whether it be fund raising, gaining political / media "favor", ripping Obama / Clinton down or vetting his VP. He did very little. he was "the other guy" while Clinton and Obama went toe to toe. McCain had 3 months to do a VERY thorough search of tons of people. He clearly wanted Lieberman but buckled at the last moment, so he had to scramble to find someone else. The moment the "7 houses" issue came up, Romney was out. If the innuendo is to believed, Pawlenty had a skeleton. Any pro-abortion" VP was out. Who now? Well, let's go for the little known and hope we can frame her image before the other side does.

 

That's the problem IMO, the bolded text. I think he wanted Lieberman all along, was convinced that was who he would pick, but buckled at the last second for whatever the reason might have been (too "liberal" of a ticket, no good/young speaker to balance out McCain, couldn't beat Obama with that ticket, etc). I don't think McCain was moving slowly or didn't take advantage of his head start, I just think he buckled and didn't take his guy (Joe Lieberman) at the last second and was left scrambling to find somebody else.

Edited September 3, 2008 by whitesoxfan101

[jackie hayes]

I consider myself a fairly well educated person with a slightly above average IQ. There is NO way I could ever think to be ready to be a VP in less than month. not even a chance. I'd be ignorant to even think I could.

 

If I were Biden, I;d find a way to sneak in one simple question during the VP debate... "tell me the difference between the Sunni and Shiite" and pray it doesn't blow up in his face.

Like hell you would. You don't bet the presidency on Trivial Pursuit.

[Balta1701]

That's the problem IMO, the bolded text. I think he wanted Lieberman all along, was convinced that was who he would pick, but buckled at the last second for whatever the reason might have been (too "liberal" of a ticket, no good/young speaker to balance out McCain, couldn't beat Obama with that ticket, etc). I don't think McCain was moving slowly or didn't take advantage of his head start, I just think he buckled and didn't take his guy (Joe Lieberman) at the last second and was left scrambling to find somebody else.

I think that he was told by a number of people last week, including the God of Darkness (Karl) that if he actually announced a pro-choice running mate, there would be a floor fight over that nomination and his VP nominee would probably be rejected.

[whitesoxfan101]

I think that he was told by a number of people last week, including the God of Darkness (Karl) that if he actually announced a pro-choice running mate, there would be a floor fight over that nomination and his VP nominee would probably be rejected.

 

McCain/Lieberman would have actually been a ticket I'd have LOVED, right down to the fact that I think Joe would have brought McCain back towards his circa 2000 views on things. Of course, thoughts like that are why I'm not a true republican, and that ticket would have never united the looney right wingers of the GOP, something they can't win without IMO.

Edited September 3, 2008 by whitesoxfan101

[HuskyCaucasian]

This is the best they got. "She's a reformer"

 

 

Per MSNBC:

The campaign says the ad will air in "key states" (which usually means there probably isn't much money behind the ad).

Edited September 3, 2008 by Athomeboy_2000

[lostfan]

McCain/Lieberman would have actually been a ticket I'd have LOVED, right down to the fact that I think Joe would have brought McCain back towards his circa 2000 views on things. Of course, thoughts like that are why I'm not a true republican, and that ticket would have never united the looney right wingers of the GOP, something they can't win without IMO.

That's not really your opinion - it's a hard-and-fast fact. That type of ticket would never, ever work unless there was a full-blown 3rd party.

[HuskyCaucasian]

That's not really your opinion - it's a hard-and-fast fact. That type of ticket would never, ever work unless there was a full-blown 3rd party.

One of these day's I'm gonna figure out how to start my centrist "a little from both side" party.

[whitesoxfan101]

That's not really your opinion - it's a hard-and-fast fact. That type of ticket would never, ever work unless there was a full-blown 3rd party.

 

I'd LOVE to see a full blown 3rd party, and I think it will happen one day. But sadly, that day won't be for a very long time IMO.

[StrangeSox]

One of these day's I'm gonna figure out how to start my centrist "a little from both side" party.

 

Step 1 - get hundreds of millions of dollars

Step 2 - ???

Step 3 - Presidency!

[HuskyCaucasian]

Step 1 - get hundreds of millions of dollars

Step 2 - ???

Step 3 - Presidency!

yea, umm..... I work for a church. I dont make a lot of money. Step 1 might be a problem.

[whitesoxfan101]

yea, umm..... I work for a church. I dont make a lot of money. Step 1 might be a problem.

 

Yeah, and if you work for a church, I'm guessing there is a chance you have a distinct set of morals and values. That's an even bigger detriment to your change of becoming president.

[WCSox]

Good game plan, poor execution. Condi would have been game.set.match.

 

No way. Obama's campaign is predicated on the illusion that a McCain regime would be a third term of Bush/Cheney, and bringing in one of Bush's top people would've completely validated that criticism. McCain needed to reach as far away from Bush as he could. It's sad because, under different circumstances, I agree that Condi would've been an excellent choice. McCain also needed somebody who isn't a multi-millionaire, which is most likely why Romney didn't get the nod.

 

As for Palin undercutting McCain's "experience" argument, I think that much of that argument died when Obama chose Biden. And it didn't work very well for Hillary, either. McCain will go after Obama on accomplishments, judgement, and his liberal voting record.

Edited September 3, 2008 by WCSox

[bmags]

No way. Obama's race is predicated on the illusion that a McCain regime would be a third term of Bush/Cheney, and bringing in one of Bush's top people would've completely validated that criticism. McCain needed to reach as far away from Bush as he could. It's sad because, under different circumstances, I agree that Condi would've been an excellent choice. McCain also needed somebody who isn't a multi-millionaire, which is most likely why Romney didn't get the nod.

 

As for Palin undercutting McCain's "experience" argument, I think that much of that argument died when Obama chose Biden. And it didn't work very well for Hillary, either. McCain will go after Obama on accomplishments, judgement, and his liberal voting record.

 

Even at the convention they are still hitting his experience though.

 

BUt I agree, I'm still shocked he didn't pick Pawlenty though. He's not connected to Bush and is very popular in a democratic state, a state that McCain is pushing towards tossup (no way in hell though)

[southsider2k5]

I think the Palin debate about motherhood and whether you can have it all (in terms of a family and a prestigious career) is pretty interesting. You have a woman that returned to work 3 days after giving birth and has 4 (I think) minor children. It's been interesting to follow reaction to that on both sides of the aisle.

 

Of course the most interesting question is if those types of questions would be asked if she was a man.

 

NO ONE has questioned Barack Obama about leaving two young children at home for extended periods of time. Why is it assumed that the wife has to raise the kids?

[bmags]

NO ONE has questioned Barack Obama about leaving two young children at home for extended periods of time. Why is it assumed that the wife has to raise the kids?

 

For real this is an odd assertion, but on the otherhand it's coming from women that's she's trying to court.

[WCSox]

Even at the convention they are still hitting his experience though.

 

I think that's a mistake, but it also underscores the fact that the Dem ticket is upside-down in terms of experience, so maybe that's their strategy.

 

BUt I agree, I'm still shocked he didn't pick Pawlenty though. He's not connected to Bush and is very popular in a democratic state, a state that McCain is pushing towards tossup (no way in hell though)

 

Pawlenty would've been a great choice in terms of ability, but let's be honest: McCain needed to inject some excitement into his campaign. With Obama's charisma and the MSM propping him up, I don't think that McCain would've done well with another mundane white guy on his ticket. Obama has been polling poorly with women over 40 all summer, and I'm sure that McCain's people saw that as an opportunity. It also helped that she's young (offsetting McCain's age), likeable, and shares a lot of McCain's core beliefs, particularly working with the other side.

 

 

 

[WCSox]

NO ONE has questioned Barack Obama about leaving two young children at home for extended periods of time. Why is it assumed that the wife has to raise the kids?

 

And nobody in the MSM questioned the Clintons' ability to raise Chelsea back in the '90s, when Hillary had a VERY active role in Bill's Presidency.

 

[southsider2k5]

I'm not sure what line I'm crossing. Mrs. 18-Million Cracks in the Glass Ceiling has only one unique qualification distinguishing her from other potentials - her gender. She was picked to try to tap any would-be Hillary Clinton voters who were planning to vote for her solely because she is a woman.

 

The only reason you said that is because she is a female. Dan Quayle came right out of the same cut. It has happened before. There are plenty of other reasons possible for her pick. I believe it is sexist to assume she was ONLY picked because she is a female.

[southsider2k5]

And nobody in the MSM questioned the Clintons' ability to raise Chelsea back in the '90s, when Hillary had a VERY active role in Bill's Presidency.

 

And that was with BOTH parents working hard in the administration.

[Controlled Chaos]

Can Palin be a mother and a vice president?

 

The left would normally scoff at such a question. This was part of the feminist fight...the liberal fight for women. (Those on the right just wanted them home, pregnant, and in the kitchen.) The opportunity for both a career and a family and not having to chose between the two. That was the goal. So liberals are all for the advancement of women, but only one that fits their mold.

[Chisoxfn]

No way. Obama's campaign is predicated on the illusion that a McCain regime would be a third term of Bush/Cheney, and bringing in one of Bush's top people would've completely validated that criticism. McCain needed to reach as far away from Bush as he could. It's sad because, under different circumstances, I agree that Condi would've been an excellent choice. McCain also needed somebody who isn't a multi-millionaire, which is most likely why Romney didn't get the nod.

 

As for Palin undercutting McCain's "experience" argument, I think that much of that argument died when Obama chose Biden. And it didn't work very well for Hillary, either. McCain will go after Obama on accomplishments, judgement, and his liberal voting record.

At the end of the day I just hope 60 days is enough time to hammer on the fact that Obama clearly isn't fit to run this country. The problem is he's such a tremendous speaker that many Americans will ignore his record. Plus McCain isn't exactly someone that wows you so some people that are intelligent enough to recognize Obama's complete joke of accomplishments, policies, and voting record, will still vote for him because they at least like the guy (sadly that plays a huge part at the end of the day).

[kapkomet]

Not to totally derail the thread, but exactly what ARE RSO's accomplishments?