Official 2008-2009 College Basketball Thread

[IamPabloOzuna]

Also, although this comment is random and out of place, I shall make it now since I just saw some of the comments earlier in the thread (I was traveling the last few days and haven't been online). Illinois would beat Illinois State by 15 points, not sure how somebody would conclude Illinois State wins that game. The Redbirds currently have a slightly better record because they haven't played anybody, whereas Illinois has a few decent wins, a really good one tonight, and a tough home loss to an undefeated and ranked Clemson game in a ballgame where Illinois played horrific defense and still had a chance to tie/win the game. Davis and Tisdale would both have double doubles in such a theoretical matchup (Davis only shows up for "important" games, and playing an undefeated team would be good enough for him), and do as they wished.

 

this is an ignorant comment...yes illinois state has a weak sched...but they have absolutely pummeled most teams, including an 80-50 drubbing of evansville today (rpi 20). 13-0 and no signs of stopping.

[IamPabloOzuna]

I'm an MVC guy and an Illini hater as much as anyone here, but don't be ridiculous.

 

hey id be sour too if i were a saluki fan

 

[whitesoxfan99]

hey id be sour too if i were a saluki fan

 

Wow, one good season where so far they have done nothing but beat cupcakes and suddenly the ISU fans are talking trash. Hilarious. Oh, and you guys really haven't been pummeling people. Actually they have struggled against a lot of their schedule. 3 pt win against Central Michigan. OT to beat Missouri St. 6 pt win against Morehead State. Struggled against Nichols State, only won by 6 against Alabama State, and they only beat Wright State by 8. They pummeled Evansville which is impressive but their other blowouts were Houston Baptist, Winston Salem and Cal Santa Barbara. And since Houston Baptist and Winston Salem are both unbelievably bad those games don't mean anything.

[RockRaines]

Oh snap, WSOX99 pwns.

 

 

Iowa scored about 99 percent of their points on 3's today, kept me on the edge of my seat.

[whitesoxfan99]

Oh snap, WSOX99 pwns.

 

 

Iowa scored about 99 percent of their points on 3's today, kept me on the edge of my seat.

 

Bawinkel from Iowa has now taken 55 shots on the season and they are all 3s. He also hasn't attempted a FT. That has to be some kind of record for consecutive FG attempts that are 3s.

[caulfield12]

Even more ironic is that he used to play for WVU, and Iowa and OSU both were destroyed by Huggins in the last month or so.

 

Iowa's coming around and becoming more competitive on the road. I just don't know if Lickliter can get enough athleticism to win with his system in the Big 10, in terms of recruiting. I think he will fall a little short of Alford's hype as a recruiter, although the program will be better off from an overall standpoint, I just don't see him taking Iowa to the Elite 8 or Sweet 16 on a consistent basis. However, the fact that Iowa's really learning how to play much better D is a good sign, something that didn't really happen under the Golden Boy.

[whitesoxfan99]

Louisville is still overrated. That team simply cannot shoot the basketball.

[Chisoxfn]

Oh snap, WSOX99 pwns.

 

 

Iowa scored about 99 percent of their points on 3's today, kept me on the edge of my seat.

Just wait till Lickliter can get a few more of his guys in, there style of play will be very unique in the big ten and they should become a consistent top 4 big ten team. Nice win for the Buckeyes though as at times Iowa looks like a borderline tourney team (at other times, not so much). They are extremely young though.

[Chisoxfn]

Even more ironic is that he used to play for WVU, and Iowa and OSU both were destroyed by Huggins in the last month or so.

 

Iowa's coming around and becoming more competitive on the road. I just don't know if Lickliter can get enough athleticism to win with his system in the Big 10, in terms of recruiting. I think he will fall a little short of Alford's hype as a recruiter, although the program will be better off from an overall standpoint, I just don't see him taking Iowa to the Elite 8 or Sweet 16 on a consistent basis. However, the fact that Iowa's really learning how to play much better D is a good sign, something that didn't really happen under the Golden Boy.

They had one year where they played top notch defense under Alford and it was Alford's second to last season (the one where they lost on the 3 pointer by Northwestern State in the 1st round after playing tremendous all season). It was a completely veteran team though. Lick is doing this with a team where all of his best players are freshman/sophs.

[whitesoxfan99]

Just wait till Lickliter can get a few more of his guys in, there style of play will be very unique in the big ten and they should become a consistent top 4 big ten team. Nice win for the Buckeyes though as at times Iowa looks like a borderline tourney team (at other times, not so much). They are extremely young though.

 

Consistent top 4 Big 10 team? Illinois and OSU are recruiting pretty much as well as anyone in the country. They aren't going to jump MSU. IU has a strong 09 class and Crean will probably do a good job there. They are going to have a hard time leaping Wisconsin and Purdue as well. Their ceiling with Lickliter will be a middle of the pack Big 10 team and then in their off years they will be bad. Then of course there is Michigan who will be running an offensive system where they do nothing but shoot 3s as well. Tubby at Minnesota will have more talent then Iowa as well. A system will not make you a top 4 team in a conference when the teams you are facing have significantly more talent night in and night out. And before anyone brings up Wisconsin, Ryan actually recruits very well and also does recruit for his system. It almost seems like the reason that they always get stuck with the lack of talent label is due to the fact they have a ton of white players and they aren't great athletically most of the time.

[RockRaines]

Just wait till Lickliter can get a few more of his guys in, there style of play will be very unique in the big ten and they should become a consistent top 4 big ten team. Nice win for the Buckeyes though as at times Iowa looks like a borderline tourney team (at other times, not so much). They are extremely young though.

And they played an extremely young OSU team. The B10 has top flight coaches and top flight players, Iowa will have to do alot of work to get into and stay in the top tier of the B10. Just ask Bruce Weber how easy it is to compete year in and year out.

[Jenksismyhero]

I'm not sure about Iowa's future, but I do think the Big Ten is going to have a run as being the best conference here in the next few years. I think we'll have at least 6-7 tourney teams year in and year out (ILL, MSU, WI, PU, OSU, and MN, then eventually IU, MI, and maybe IA. Heck even Penn State looks good this year). Gone are the last couple of years where we've had one, maybe two great teams.

 

I was impressed with Iowa's comeback, but I haven't been too impressed with OSU all year, especially now that they're injured. Good teams don't allow mediocre teams to come back on you from 15-16 down, at home. I've watched a fair amount of Big Ten Hoops (especially the big ten openers) and I've been impressed with MSU, WI, ILL, and PU. I think the Big Ten winner will be one of those four.

Edited January 2, 2009 by Jenksismybitch

[caulfield12]

Until someone proves otherwise (like Purdue, when/if healthy), you go into almost every season now with MSU and Wisconsin (especially if they have some superior athletes to mix with the role players) as the favorites because Ryan is such a good coach.

 

I think Lickliter will need at least one more season to see what he can do with his own system and set of players. As usual, many B10 teams will pull off some huge upsets at home. I guess the first surprises of the season are Illinois winning at PU (injuries?) and then MSU clobbering Minnesota on the road. With both the football and basketball programs at Minnesota, I'm not convinced either ever live up to the early season hype and thrive during the heat of the B10 season. I'm just not convinced that Smith can truly turn that program around and consistently make the NCAA's every year. We'll see.

 

We'll see how good Crean can recruit, and whether he can win consistently without another Dwayne Wade. All these things said, the B10 looks very interesting, if lacking in dominant teams....and is a year or two away from returning to a position of being one of the better BB leagues in the country.

Edited January 2, 2009 by caulfield12

[Felix]

I'm just not convinced that Smith can truly turn that program around and consistently make the NCAA's every year. We'll see.

Yeah, there's nothing in Tubby's coaching history that shows he knows how to make the tournament consistently. Oh wait...

 

In his time at Minnesota, Tubby has already completely changed the face of the team. The team last year won 20 games despite not having much more talent from the year before, when they won 9. The team this year is young, but very talented. I don't think we are that great a team this year and I suspect we'll still be on the bubble come tournament time, but I do think we'll be much better next year as the freshman continue to learn the system. Add in the fact that Tubby has already shown he can recruit the top Minnesota talent (something previous coaches never did which meant a number of the top Minnesota players went to Wisconsin, Iowa, etc.), and there is a lot of reasons to be happy about this program and the direction it's headed in.

 

I won't try defending the football program as I have stopped following college football for the most part, but I do know that Brewster has done a fantastic job recruiting which makes a big difference. I don't think we'll be a top Big Ten team any time soon, but it's much more encouraging than the past with Glen Mason who seemed content with having the team always be in the middle of the pack.

Edited January 2, 2009 by Felix

[caulfield12]

That Tubby Smith...of the Tulsa/UGA years, is not the same Smith of today. I don't think he's as motivated to win as he once was, especially after he was spit out of the Kentucky grinder. And 20 wins doesn't mean as much as it used to as far as "magic numbers" because the number of games played has changed and many teams are scheduling weak non-conference schedules in fear of getting upset by mid major teams, even at home.

 

If Minnesota can go to the NCAA's just two consecutive years in basketball, I'll be very impressed. Three would be amazing.

[Felix]

The point wasn't that 20 wins was some illustrious number of wins that is amazing for a program to get. The point was that the team gained 11 wins with a similar (read: weak) schedule and hardly any change in personnel, which is definitely impressive.

 

As for Tubby's 'hunger', are you actually basing this on anything or is this just a 'gut feeling'? I haven't noticed any change in him and I think he's still eager to prove to Kentucky that he's still a top class coach.

[Chisoxfn]

And they played an extremely young OSU team. The B10 has top flight coaches and top flight players, Iowa will have to do alot of work to get into and stay in the top tier of the B10. Just ask Bruce Weber how easy it is to compete year in and year out.

Lick's a better coach than Weber, imo. I'll get shredded for saying that but he is. Whether he'll be able to recruit good enough at Iowa remains to be seen though.

[kjshoe04]

I have been gone a couple days, so I haven't been able to get in here, but I still say ISU would beat Illinois. I don't care that Illinois beat Purdue. I think ISU would be able to beat Purdue as well. Not every time but they would beat them at least 30% of the time. Which is what I feel like Illinois is capable of as well. Every thing I said holds true. They play Creighton tomorrow. That should be a good indicator. ISU is still the more athletic and more experienced/smarter team. Probably better coached as well.

Edited January 3, 2009 by kjshoe04

[Brian]

I have been gone a couple days, so I haven't been able to get in here, but I still say ISU would beat Illinois. I don't care that Illinois beat Purdue. I think ISU would be able to beat Purdue as well. Not every time but they would beat them at least 30% of the time. Which is what I feel like Illinois is capable of as well. Every thing I said holds true. They play Creighton tomorrow. That should be a good indicator. ISU is still the more athletic and more experienced/smarter team. Probably better coached as well.

 

Now you are bordering on idiotic.

 

Dana Altman is maybe the best coach in the MVC and has been for a long time. Don't think your 2nd year coach is better than him for one second.

 

It's amazing how one good year can go to someone's heads.

[kjshoe04]

Now you are bordering on idiotic.

 

Dana Altman is maybe the best coach in the MVC and has been for a long time. Don't think your 2nd year coach is better than him for one second.

 

It's amazing how one good year can go to someone's heads.

I meant better than Weber. You will never hear me say a bad thing about Altman. Yes, we could beat Purdue. It's not like they are that much more talented.

[dasox24]

I meant better than Weber. You will never hear me say a bad thing about Altman. Yes, we could beat Purdue. It's not like they are that much more talented.

I can't tell if you're kidding or not...

[Brian]

I can't tell if you're kidding or not...

 

kjSHoe should wait til his coach takes a team to the tournament before even saying his coach is better than Weber.

[Felix]

I have been gone a couple days, so I haven't been able to get in here, but I still say ISU would beat Illinois. I don't care that Illinois beat Purdue. I think ISU would be able to beat Purdue as well. Not every time but they would beat them at least 30% of the time. Which is what I feel like Illinois is capable of as well. Every thing I said holds true. They play Creighton tomorrow. That should be a good indicator. ISU is still the more athletic and more experienced/smarter team. Probably better coached as well.

The amount of homer in this post is amazing. Possibly the most I've seen in a really long time on Soxtalk.

 

Thanks for that.

[IlliniKrush]

I have two questions.

 

Who has ISU played?

 

Who has ISU beat?

[Rowand44]

I'm going to jump in here and just say: ISU has played absolutely NOBODY and that can't be argued. But it also can't be argued that they have one of the best back courts in the nation. I honestly don't know how good they are yet but Champ and Osiris are that good. They'd be able to play with a lot of teams.