StrangeSox Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (knightni @ Jan 20, 2009 -> 07:17 PM) LINK Good for that. You don't think that the U.S. wasn't just covering their ass with that statement when they made that treaty? . . . It was ratified by every member of Congress. Not a single Congressman had an objection to that phrase. The U.S. Constitution may be written secularily, but it was and is governed by people of the Christian belief who chose institute Christian-based traditions into ceremony to show the 70%+ of the U.S.'s population (who were and are primarily familiar with Christian tradition) that their government believes in many of the things that they do. The places and traditions that involve swearing on Bibles, prayer etc., were put into effect in another time when people's Christian beliefs more strongly affected everyday American life. Many of the founders were enlightenment-age deists, not Christians. The 1st amendment explicitly forbids the bolded part. This country was founded largely on philosophy, not religion. Muslims, Hindus, Jews etc., didn't start being vocal and prominent until the early-mid 20th century, after many of these Christian traditions were considered mainstream. So what? They get excluded based on tradition? Edited January 21, 2009 by StrangeSox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (Texsox @ Jan 20, 2009 -> 02:54 PM) Faith is difficult for some people. They feel threatened and prefer to mock. Nice try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 07:28 AM) Nice try. Bringing in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny is Mocking if you have the intelligence to know the difference between something that several billion humans believe in, and a child's fantasy. (Taking in all the world's religions that believe in a higher power(s).) Amazingly ignorant if you don't know the difference. I prefer to think you are intelligent enough to know the difference. But like many liberal democrats, you would be very comfy in a Communist country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (Texsox @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 09:11 AM) Bringing in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny is Mocking if you have the intelligence to know the difference between something that several billion humans believe in, and a child's fantasy. (Taking in all the world's religions that believe in a higher power(s).) Amazingly ignorant if you don't know the difference. I prefer to think you are intelligent enough to know the difference. But like many liberal democrats, you would be very comfy in a Communist country. Well to be honest, I bet about a billion humans believe in the easter bunny and Santa as well. Just like those stories that were built from oration throughout history, the Bible was written from stories told over several generations. Just because its a belief doesnt make it more real or less fake than imaginary tales involving Santa. Both have been proven to be inaccurate either way. Creationism is just as big of a tall tale as a fat man dropping through Chimney's bringing presents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 if this religious debate is going to continue it should be in a separate thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 I really should split it and if I get time to do that at work I will. It's several pages though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 09:23 AM) Well to be honest, I bet about a billion humans believe in the easter bunny and Santa as well. Wow. I have no idea how to respond. I guess see my above post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Regardless of your religious beliefs or lack thereof, I can't believe people would actually equate santa claus with major religions in terms of personal values or faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 09:30 AM) Regardless of your religious beliefs or lack thereof, I can't believe people would actually equate santa claus with major religions in terms of personal values or faith. I would equate it to the dogma and mythological storytelling of religion. Not to personal values and/or faith in a higher being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 09:30 AM) Regardless of your religious beliefs or lack thereof, I can't believe people would actually equate santa claus with major religions in terms of personal values or faith. I dont think anyone is comparing the idea of belief between the two. But they do have a parallel in that they are both derived from oral tales told over generations and both are ficticious events that have lead people to believe something. The idea of religion for most is great because of the direction it gives people's lives (mostly positive), the morality and the comfort. But it still doesnt change the fact that most of the stories in the Bible are completely fabricated because it makes it a better story to believe in. I would suggest visiting the museum of creationism near Cincy to really get an idea of how the story has been moved and changed to try and bring it out from under the cloud of truth and science to try and continue to make people believe in the story. IMO most intelligent humans nowadays who are open to all aspects of life and science are aware that the stories in the Bible are fabricated, but the belief in a higher power is very real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Satellite image of yesterday's crowd. The people really do look like ants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 10:51 AM) Satellite image of yesterday's crowd. The people really do look like ants. I wonder when that picture was taken? It was really even more packed than that, at least seemed like it from the places I looked. The closer to the Mall you got the harder it became to move. I was off to the right (which is north I believe, and north of Pennsylvania Avenue where I couldn't cross) and I may or may not have been in that pic depending on the time of day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kapkomet Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 09:51 AM) Satellite image of yesterday's crowd. The people really do look like ants. That is a crazy picture, but I agree with lostfan that it was either two hours before or 30 minutes after... because the mall was PACKED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jan 20, 2009 -> 06:50 PM) Nobody is trying to be against and afraid of Christianity nor its crazies. I just feel like faith and the Church is very out of place in an event where a Federal official who represents all races, creeds and religions is being sworn in. I mean, isnt it a BIT weird that there was almost a mini religious service right before a civic ceremony was held? It just doesnt belong there. I just read this on the Trib online... Welcome, nonbelievers If I were a Christian, I'd have been embarrassed by Rick Warren's invocation at the Inauguration. It was aggressively evangelical, serving to exclude everyone who doesn't accept the divinity of Jesus. Warren invoked his name four times, in four different languages, and closed by reciting the Lord's Prayer, a specifically Christian supplication. He seemed to think he was at a revival rather than a secular event meant for all--in a country whose constitution rejects official sponsorship of any faith. No one expected Warren to pretend to be something other than an evangelical Christian. But better pastors know how to to strike themes that resonate with believers without making everyone else feel slapped in the face. Nonbelievers are asked to respect religion by sitting quietly during prayers of this sort. It's not too much to expect a measure of restraint in return. Warren's prayer was the bad news for those of us who are not persuaded of the existence of the Almighty. The good news came from Barack Obama. In his address, he declared, "We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus and nonbelievers." Including people of various religions is commonplace in political speeches. But making a point of embracing people of no religion was something new to me. I asked Joe Conn of Americans United for Separation of Church and State if any other president had included atheists and agnostics in an inaugural speech, and he couldn't think of one. I can only be grateful to Obama for reminding his audience--including Rick Warren--that nonbelievers are Americans, too. LINK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 If I were a Christian, I'd have been embarrassed by Rick Warren's invocation at the Inauguration. It was aggressively evangelical, serving to exclude everyone who doesn't accept the divinity of Jesus. If the writer was a Christian, he would not be embarrassed by excluding non-Christians in a prayer. That's the whole idea of Christianity, promoting Christ's divinity. But, Warren did drag on and overdid the prayer. If he had kept it simpler, it would have been better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 In a CNN article about Obama's first day as President, I found this: Obama arrived in the Oval Office and spent 10 minutes alone, reading a note left for him in the desk by outgoing President George W. Bush. I would LOVE to know the contents of that note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskyCaucasian Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 02:00 PM) I would LOVE to know the contents of that note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxy Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 03:00 PM) In a CNN article about Obama's first day as President, I found this: I would LOVE to know the contents of that note. It was actually two notes in an envelop. The first one says, when the first major thing goes wrong, blame it one me. If something else awful happens open the second note. The second note says, sit down and write two notes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 QUOTE (Soxy @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 02:05 PM) It was actually two notes in an envelop. The first one says, when the first major thing goes wrong, blame it one me. If something else awful happens open the second note. The second note says, sit down and write two notes. I was thinking that same thing - the well-told story. But as Obama has already blamed so much on Bush, I'm not sure how long that will work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_genius Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 09:51 AM) Satellite image of yesterday's crowd. The people really do look like ants. i saw those on CNN yesterday and was thinking the same thing. then the CNN guy was like "Kind of looks like ants going to a sugar cube" Edited January 21, 2009 by mr_genius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 In a CNN article about Obama's first day as President, I found this: I would LOVE to know the contents of that note. Probably took him 2 minutes to read the drivel and he spent the other 8 minutes laughing his ass off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_genius Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 (edited) not sure this has been mentioned. Obama took the oath of office again today. just to make sure it was all done correctly Edited January 22, 2009 by mr_genius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 02:01 PM) I used to luv reading that book to my little brother... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted January 22, 2009 Author Share Posted January 22, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (mr_genius @ Jan 21, 2009 -> 07:49 PM) not sure this has been mentioned. Obama took the oath of office again today. just to make sure it was all done correctly It was odd that they didn't let cameras in there. The whole point of this was to nip any potential controversy in the bud by showing everybody he's done it again, 100% correctly. So why not have video cameras (they had print journalists and took regular pictures at least) and show everyone? Just doesn't make much sense to me. Edited January 22, 2009 by lostfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 QUOTE (lostfan @ Jan 22, 2009 -> 08:47 AM) It was odd that they didn't let cameras in there. The whole point of this was to nip any potential controversy in the bud by showing everybody he's done it again, 100% correctly. So why not have video cameras (they had print journalists and took regular pictures at least) and show everyone? Just doesn't make much sense to me. video from inside the oval office like that is very, very rare. They almost never allow it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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