The indoctrination starts already

[NorthSideSox72]

I am glad to see we are looking to emphasize community service or national civilian service in various fashions. I think we all agree on that.

 

As to "requiring" it...

 

For kids up through high school, I am OK with requiring it, as long as its not much more than that 50 or so hours. These kids already are doing a LOT, typically. But I think its a positive thing.

 

Now, once they turn 18 and are set loose on the world as "adults"... then it should NOT be required. Emphasizing it by way of scholarhips and grants and loadn guarantees, and by supporting groups like peace corps and americorps, I am good with though. Very good with. I think giving people the opporunity to serve their country in ways beyond just the military, in exchange for help with college, is a very, very good thing.

 

[HuskyCaucasian]

From the same website:

 

 

 

How dare they give college students the OPTION to perform community service.

i didnt like the college part. that's much better.

[YASNY]

LOL. Love the oversight.

 

There is still that word at the beginning ... Require. Not sure this is really an option.

[southsider2k5]

I kind of broached this a while back in another topic, but it seems appropriate here... Is requiring public service an acceptable action to place on people who are not paying federal income taxes, or people who are paying a negative income tax rate?

[BigSqwert]

There is still that word at the beginning ... Require. Not sure this is really an option.

 

Am I the only person that watched Obama in the debates? Seems like he mentioned it at least a couple of times that he would give college students the option of a tax credit in exchange for community service.

[YASNY]

I kind of broached this a while back in another topic, but it seems appropriate here... Is requiring public service an acceptable action to place on people who are not paying federal income taxes, or people who are paying a negative income tax rate?

 

Wait! Are you suggesting we make people work when they are being subsidized by the taxpayer. You barbarian!

[YASNY]

Am I the only person that watched Obama in the debates? Seems like he mentioned it at least a couple of times that he would give college students the option of a tax credit in exchange for community service.

 

I watched him, but I was so mesmorized by his eloquence that I didn't really hear what he was saying.

[NorthSideSox72]

Wait! Are you suggesting we make people work when they are being subsidized by the taxpayer. You barbarian!

So you'd be OK with the requirement based on tax bracket?

 

[southsider2k5]

From the same website:

 

 

 

How dare they give college students the OPTION to perform community service.

 

I have no problem with it being a term of service for accepting the scholarship. Out of curiousity would anyone look at the program differently in the light that it would require predominantly poor and/or minority students to be doing this work, as they would be the biggest groups utilizing a program like this?

[YASNY]

So you'd be OK with the requirement based on tax bracket?

 

If people are healthy and able to work, why not? They would then feel they were contributing members of society instead of just being catagorized as leeches.

[BigSqwert]

I have no problem with it being a term of service for accepting the scholarship. Out of curiousity would anyone look at the program differently in the light that it would require predominantly poor and/or minority students to be doing this work, as they would be the biggest groups utilizing a program like this?

 

With the insane increase in the cost of college tuition I'm curious why you would think that.

[Steff]

There is still that word at the beginning ... Require. Not sure this is really an option.

 

 

Cause requiring them to give back would be terrible? As a parent even with the word.. gasp... "require" I'm fine with this. JMO

[southsider2k5]

Am I the only person that watched Obama in the debates? Seems like he mentioned it at least a couple of times that he would give college students the option of a tax credit in exchange for community service.

 

Would it really be an "option" for those who struggle to afford college? To me it would be optional in the same idea that loans were "optional". My other option was no college and a crappy job.

[YASNY]

Cause requiring them to give back would be terrible? As a parent even with the word.. gasp... "require" I'm fine with this. JMO

 

But Steff, if its a requirement, and we will do this in return whether you think that is fair or not, it is not a choice.

[BigSqwert]

Would it really be an "option" for those who struggle to afford college? To me it would be optional in the same idea that loans were "optional". My other option was no college and a crappy job.

 

So you prefer every student gets that $4000 tax credit for free?

[southsider2k5]

With the insane increase in the cost of college tuition I'm curious why you would think that.

 

Rich people can afford college, and they are predominatly not minority. By that single piece of logic, you be forcing poor and minority students into service at a rate disproportionate to the rest of the population.

[Steff]

With the insane increase in the cost of college tuition I'm curious why you would think that.

 

 

Well that was much nicer than the response I had all typed out.

[southsider2k5]

So you prefer every student gets that $4000 tax credit for free?

 

I already said what I thought up above. I was curious as to the logic of why people were thinking what they were on this topic, especially when viewed through the historical context how programs tend to be labeled based on the groups they affect.

[Steff]

But Steff, if its a requirement, and we will do this in return whether you think that is fair or not, it is not a choice.

 

 

And I said I am ok with it.

[NorthSideSox72]

If people are healthy and able to work, why not? They would then feel they were contributing members of society instead of just being catagorized as leeches.

I think you will naturally get more poor and underprivileged folks anyway, as SS2K5 said, doing the volunteering for the scholarship. But I'd prefer that we NOT require civil service for only some people, based on income. That, to me, is a big step towards national indentured servitude, and that is not a good thing.

 

[BigSqwert]

I think you will naturally get more poor and underprivileged folks anyway, as SS2K5 said, doing the volunteering for the scholarship. But I'd prefer that we NOT require civil service for only some people, based on income. That, to me, is a big step towards national indentured servitude, and that is not a good thing.

 

So children from low income families should just get handouts in order to go to college?

[NorthSideSox72]

So children from low income families should just get handouts in order to go to college?

Huh? Where are you getting that from? I think you should re-read my post. I said nothing about handouts.

 

ETA: Quite the opposite, I said that income should not be used as a determinant for requiring or not requiring this sort of thing.

 

[clyons]

GMAB.

 

That is nowhere near the same thing.

 

By that logic, I am forced by the evil government to stop at stop signs and not punch random people in the face if I want to stay out of jail.

 

Damn.

Where do you want that break?

 

Since we're talking about middle school/high school/collegiate requirements (did you even read the article before posting?), its EXACTLY the same thing. Geometry, Algebra, Spanish and drivers ed were a waste of my time, and I wouldn't have bothered with any if not "forced" to take them. BFD.

 

What does being forced to stop at stop signs and refraining from criminal assault have to do with the subject of mandatory graduation requirements?

 

Double down on your "Damn".

 

 

[southsider2k5]

So you prefer every student gets that $4000 tax credit for free?

 

To answer a little more precisely, no. In the big picture, I do not like seeing the giveaways for free that our government has in most programs. I really like the idea of requiring service in exchange for a scholarship. There are some excellent lessons in life that kids can learn. The first being that yes, in the real world, there is a price for everything. They aren't just going to be handed anything. I also believe if so many things weren't made so easy, there would be more incentive to not depend on the government. I believe it teaches work ethic, and it also exposes them to more things that they might not otherwise see in their lives. I believe it also gives them incentive to stay in school, as the things you see as a volunteer can really inspire you to do more with your life. I have been working in various forms of volunteer work since I was a freshman in high school. I think it has done wonders for me.

[Steff]

Huh? Where are you getting that from? I think you should re-read my post. I said nothing about handouts.

 

ETA: Quite the opposite, I said that income should not be used as a determinant for requiring or not requiring this sort of thing.

 

 

 

Your response to Yas got a bit mixed up in the college convo. I got confused for a sec there also.