Vazquez & Logan Dealt to Braves

[ThunderBolt]

I feel kind of sad that the legend of boone logan is. I'll never forget when he came up.

I'll miss him for his action hero name. It's a shame that the title of coolest name on the team goes back to Broadway with this move. Meanwhile, Egbert waits in silence.

[flavum]

I'm still of the opinion that Alexei will be a disaster defensively at SS.

 

My biggest fear with him is that he'll try to be too flashy. Making dumb throws from the hole when he should eat it.

 

[lostfan]

I think we'll see the Sox trade Dye and than sign Abreu to a 2 year deal with a 3rd year option. The problem is a lot of these guys are going to be more bargain type of signings who don't sign for a while (when they finally realize the market they are expecting isn't out there). Abreu would be a stellar fit in LF and the 2 spot in the order. Sure he's on the downward portion of his career but he is still a well above average offensive player (who will post a very high OBP and hit for average).

That kind of situation always makes me think of Lance Briggs... came crawling back to the Bears once he realized other teams didn't think he'd automatically be Patrick Willis when he left the Bears.

[Steve9347]

You really think a bat is what they are after when there are two glaring holes in the rotation? One of those holes will be filled.

Well they sure as s*** aren't giving a huge pitching contract to Sabathia, let alone any pitcher, so if we're going to guess a big FA signing, then I'll go with Manny.

[lostfan]

Up until a few hours ago, I thought the Sox were looking hard at Furcal and Hudson. However, after reviewing these recent moves, we have so much "depth" with regards to middle infielders that it wouldn't make sense to sign one of these guys.

Eh this is Kenny Williams... almost nobody is untouchable and a trade is pretty much never out of the question. I'm not too worried about "too much depth" being a factor.

[Chisoxfn]

If this trade pans out

Buehrle

Floyd

Danks

Bailey

Poreda/Richard

will probably the most promising starting rotation since when Buehrle and Garland came up, and people like Dan Wright still seemed like they had potential. I don't care if it's unproven it'll be a blast to watch develop.

It might be promising, but it won't come close to matching the production of the 05 Sox or even last years Sox rotation, imo. I would not be really comfortable with a raw and unproven Bailey as the 4th starter, especially since I'm expecting some set backs from Danks/Floyd. I think getting a veteran starter is a must at this point if you plan on competing because you can't expect to contend (key word being expect) when you have only one pitcher who has proven to be able to pitch consistently well at the big league level.

[Chisoxfn]

Good info SEAL...

 

One great thing I hear? THe kid will do whatever it takes to get to the show.

 

The bad? We're already talking DH...for a prospect? I want people who can prevent the other people from scoring runs as well.

 

It's all good, I like the deal...I am not crying for joy, but am far from upset with this deal.

 

It's very obvious only Lillebridge has a shot at coming to Chicago for next season and he is the guy I am very happy about getting...a great acqusition and he's going to win a lot of people over, a typical KW move...grab a talented player kinda out of favor with current club. We got Quentin, Thornton, Floyd for a song and dance...they have been awesome (at least so far)...what Lillebridge follow suit.

Most scouts believe he'll be able to stick at catcher at the big league level. As long as he calls a good game and can hit, I have no problem with him being back there. You'll just have to make sure you have a nice defensive minded back-up. Plus, it isn't like we have the gold standard of catchers behind the plate anyway (in terms of throwing guys out).

[RockRaines]

Well they sure as s*** aren't giving a huge pitching contract to Sabathia, let alone any pitcher, so if we're going to guess a big FA signing, then I'll go with Manny.

You dont think there is an arm on the FA market that is going to go for 3 years with an option? KW just got rid of bad attitudes in the clubhouse and you think he's going to bring one more back in?

[Balta1701]

You dont think there is an arm on the FA market that is going to go for 3 years with an option? KW just got rid of bad attitudes in the clubhouse and you think he's going to bring one more back in?

There's always a difference between "bad" attitudes and "Poor fit" attitudes. AJ Pierzynski had a horrible attitude before he came to Chicago. Manny was believed to be an excellent teammate in L.A. The question with him though is how much of that was him trying to work towards a contract and how much of that was the way Torre ran his clubhouse.

[Chisoxfn]

Uh-oh

 

 

Even Flowers is questioning his long term position at C.

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseb...,0,628845.story

I think he just knows that he pretty much has two spots, catcher and DH. In the NL he only had one spot which means if he was stuck behind a good catcher he might just not be able to get the opportunity (such as in Atlanta, where he was stuck behind McCann). Now not only could he come up as a catcher, but if the club already had a top notch catcher, he could make an impact as a DH.

[DBAHO]

I think if any manager would be able to control Manny, it would be Ozzie anyways (not that I'm advocating signing Manny here though).

[RockRaines]

There's always a difference between "bad" attitudes and "Poor fit" attitudes. AJ Pierzynski had a horrible attitude before he came to Chicago. Manny was believed to be an excellent teammate in L.A. The question with him though is how much of that was him trying to work towards a contract and how much of that was the way Torre ran his clubhouse.

Manny's attitude is alot like Swish's, not a good fit.

[EvilJester99]

Manny's attitude is alot like Swish's, not a good fit.

Attitude might be similar but the bat... well not so much. I think they would have keep Swish if he would have hit....IMO

[caulfield12]

I think he just knows that he pretty much has two spots, catcher and DH. In the NL he only had one spot which means if he was stuck behind a good catcher he might just not be able to get the opportunity (such as in Atlanta, where he was stuck behind McCann). Now not only could he come up as a catcher, but if the club already had a top notch catcher, he could make an impact as a DH.

 

That's not the case with Flowers, of course. His power and strike-zone discipline were evident when he was hitting .288/.427/.494 at high Class A Myrtle Beach, and he already was one of Atlanta's best prospects, so his AFL performance won't rocket him up our list.

 

Flowers still has a lot of work to do in all facets of catching, and he may never be McCann's equal as a defender. You never know how things will play out, so for now the Braves will keep him behind the plate, where he has the most value. If McCann remains entrenched once Flowers is ready for the majors, Flowers then could move to first base, though Casey Kotchman could provide an obstacle there. It would be a stretch to play Flowers on an outfield corner.

from ask Baseball America.com

 

 

[G&T]

Eh this is Kenny Williams... almost nobody is untouchable and a trade is pretty much never out of the question. I'm not too worried about "too much depth" being a factor.

 

Yeah, but KW isn't going to block Beckham for 3 or 4 years if they really believe he will be ready soon and I imagine he's untouchable right now. That would be dumb.

Edited December 3, 2008 by G&T

[Dick Allen]

The White Sox don't want to be 24 guys and Manny, and that is what it will eventually be. Maybe it didn't happen in LA, but that was due to playing for a contract and time constraints. He's a great hitter, but the White Sox aren't going to negotiate with Scott Boras for a guy who undoubtedly will be a problem eventually and cost $25 million a year.

[Baines3]

I am glad Vazquez will be gone. Hopefully everybody passes the physicals.

[Chisoxfn]

He mentioned a deal for Hudson wouldn't surprise him

 

I can't fathom why we'd want to block Beckham for a few years..

Beckham could also play 3B with Viciedo in RF. Beckham could play SS with Ramirez sliding to CF. Or Hudson could move to CF. If the value is there and Hudson doesn't get as much as expected I wouldn't necessarily have a problem with the move. However, if they do make that acquisition, I believe the Sox should look long and hard at moving Lillibridge or Betemeit.

 

I expect the clubs priority to be a starting pitcher and CF and leadoff hitter. Plus they will move Dye I believe (potentially to get one of the parts to the left) and at that point you might see them pick up one of the FA bats (Abreu, Dunn, etc).

[G&T]

Do the Mariners want any of these guys (or all of them) for Ichiro? Because that would be helpful.

[Chisoxfn]

You really think a bat is what they are after when there are two glaring holes in the rotation? One of those holes will be filled.

I think they need to get a pitcher and Cfer as things stand right now. If you move Dye, than you need to get a pitcher, Cfer and another bat. That CF better fill the top of the order too. At that point I can live with giving Getz/Lillbridge/Nix the shot at 2B, Ramirez SS, and Fields/Viciedo/Betemeit 3B.

[Chisoxfn]

Up until a few hours ago, I thought the Sox were looking hard at Furcal and Hudson. However, after reviewing these recent moves, we have so much "depth" with regards to middle infielders that it wouldn't make sense to sign one of these guys.

Unless a team like the Orioles wants one of these guys in a trade for Roberts (obvioulsy in addition to other guys). Or if they will swing one of the 2B prospects and Broadway for Taveras, which than re-opens the odds of going after Furcal or Hudson.

[lostfan]

Yeah, but KW isn't going to block Beckham for 3 or 4 years if they really believe he will be ready soon and I imagine he's untouchable right now. That would be dumb.

That's not really what I mean. I'm saying that if KW wanted to open up a hole at the MLB level for Beckham he will do it.

[caulfield12]

Fathom, I'll respond to your comment earlier.

 

I think we can still compete THIS year with Borbon in the line-up in CF...Minnesota did it with Gomez, and I think Borbon will be a much better all-around player from everything I've seen, read and heard.

 

Sure, we can also get a Taveras or Michael Bourne one-dimensional type, or simply platoon Owens/Anderson, Fields/Betemit and Lillibridge or Getz and Betemit at 2B. Nix, I think, will end up in AAA to start the season and try to rebuild his career.

 

The White Sox have proven over the last 15 years we can find and replace closers fairly easily...for the chance to get an All-Star caliber CF who will be cheap/affordable for six years, at the cost of a closer whose salary is increasing and a pitcher in Poreda who may or may not have what it takes to be a starter, you make this kind of deal in a heartbeat. And we'll throw in BA or Owens just for good measure. Any time you can trade a reliever, even a closer for an everyday player up the middle (C, SS, CF), you have to give it strong consideration.

 

Now this is all contingent on getting at least one veteran and another quality starting pitching prospect (like a Bailey or Edwin Jackson) back...

 

A rotation of Buehrle, Danks, Floyd, Jackson and a veteran fifth starter (FA signing) could easily take this division, possibly with Borbon and even Viciedo or Beckham playing key roles down the stretch.

Edited December 3, 2008 by caulfield12

[RockRaines]

I think they need to get a pitcher and Cfer as things stand right now. If you move Dye, than you need to get a pitcher, Cfer and another bat. That CF better fill the top of the order too. At that point I can live with giving Getz/Lillbridge/Nix the shot at 2B, Ramirez SS, and Fields/Viciedo/Betemeit 3B.

Getz should win the 2B job and be a perfect #2 hitter for us with his OBP and ability to make contact. Right now as it stands we are looking for a leadoff guy in CF, or we will be moving Alexei to CF to make way for a SS that can hit leadoff. You get that and a good arm in the rotation and you call it an offseason.

[caulfield12]

I think they need to get a pitcher and Cfer as things stand right now. If you move Dye, than you need to get a pitcher, Cfer and another bat. That CF better fill the top of the order too. At that point I can live with giving Getz/Lillbridge/Nix the shot at 2B, Ramirez SS, and Fields/Viciedo/Betemeit 3B.

 

 

Here's my scenario.

 

Sign Juan Rivera for 2 years at a reasonable contract for LF (there's your other bat).

Move Quentin over to RF.

Trade Jenks, Poreda and Owens/Anderson for J. Borbon from the Rangers, solving your leadoff and CF problem. (only if KW feels strongly Poreda won't be a starter)

Trade Dye for a young starting pitcher and possibly a second prospect (could be Jackson, Bailey, etc., whoever KW has his eye on)

Keep Konerko and Thome together for one last season.

Get ready to sign a veteran FA pitcher for the 4th/5th spot.

Go with Fields/Viciedo/Betemit at 3B and Lillibridge/Getz/Nix/Betemit at 2B.

Edited December 3, 2008 by caulfield12