Steff Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 It gives them a chance to play a kids game a make a lot of money. Otherwise they'd be mechanics, lawyers, doctors, etc, etc.. And convenience store workers, and construction workers and poverty in general for most any Latin player. The game is by no means one sided. Both the players and the owners get as well as give. But they both owe it to the game that gives them their livelihood to make the game as good as it can be. Selfish attitudes don't make things better. OK, whatever Rex. You win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 WTF would baseball be WITHOUT the talent Mark? If thats McGwire, I think the question should be asked what would Mark be without roids? That guy wasnt talented, he was just a famous drug addict... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 If thats McGwire, I think the question should be asked what would Mark be without roids? That guy wasnt talented, he was just a famous drug addict... Andro is not a "drug" and it's not illegal. Ever hear of slander..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Mark was definitely on some funny stuff. ANY performance enhancing drug should be illegal IMO... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Mark was definitely on some funny stuff. ANY performance enhancing drug should be illegal IMO... Should be.. but it isn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 So maybe they can use em. But its still cheating, whether its illegal or not. Im proud of guys like Frank wanting to lead the way in drug testing. Ill admit Frank may have been controversial at times but his talent is definitely all natural... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Mark was definitely on some funny stuff. ANY performance enhancing drug should be illegal IMO... You realize how many things could be considered "preformance enhancing drugs"? That is an awful broad brush you paint with there Roman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 So maybe they can use em. But its still cheating, whether its illegal or not. Im proud of guys like Frank wanting to lead the way in drug testing. Ill admit Frank may have been controversial at times but his talent is definitely all natural... Frank took creatine (sp?) in the mid 90's and admited it. They all do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 You realize how many things could be considered "preformance enhancing drugs"? That is an awful broad brush you paint with there Roman. But what else is new... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Frank took creatine (sp?) in the mid 90's and admited it. They all do it. well I guess that makes him just another famous drug addict, right Roman? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Whats creatine? And fine, maybe he did. But he admitted it. Sosa, Canseco, McGwire, they never admitted it. Geez, Sosa almost kills anyone who questions him about it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Whats creatine? And fine, maybe he did. But he admitted it. Sosa, Canseco, McGwire, they never admitted it. Geez, Sosa almost kills anyone who questions him about it... Ummm... Canseco admitted he used roids, and Mark admitted he used Andro. Creatine is (and someone please correct me if I am wrong cause I am not sure) a muscle enhancer. Builds the muscle faster I believe. Not stronger, just faster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Whats creatine? And fine, maybe he did. But he admitted it. Sosa, Canseco, McGwire, they never admitted it. Geez, Sosa almost kills anyone who questions him about it... Umm try again. Both McGwire and Canseco admitted their supliment usages. Mac's was legal, Canseco's was not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Fine. But Sosa never admits it and thats what I hate about him. And Sosa also uses more powerful roids. And if creatine is what you say it is, then Frank still has to build the muscles but it just doesnt take as long. Others make the muscles more powerful than theyre supposed to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Ummm... Canseco admitted he used roids, and Mark admitted he used Andro. Creatine is (and someone please correct me if I am wrong cause I am not sure) a muscle enhancer. Builds the muscle faster I believe. Not stronger, just faster. Creatine was the "designer supplement" for body builders before andro and is still widely used. Creatine creates problems with athletes if they are not properly hydrated. I think you are correct in that its purpose is to make the muscles rebound more quickly after a workout, therefore allowing them to grow faster. Creatine is basically just an offshoot of all of the protein supplements guys use. If taken properly, I have no problem with using creatine. The problem is monitoring those who take it so that it is used safely. If baseball wants to ban some of these substances for competitive reasons, then it has that choice (assuming they can work it out with the players union). But to bash a guy for taking legal substances to better his physique isn't exactly fair. People do it all the time in the gym, whether they are professional athlete's or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Fine. But Sosa never admits it and thats what I hate about him. And Sosa also uses more powerful roids. And if creatine is what you say it is, then Frank still has to build the muscles but it just doesnt take as long. Others make the muscles more powerful than theyre supposed to be. Obviously you don't know anything about the products. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Youre right. Im not a pharmacist. But compared to what other guys are doing, creatine isnt bad... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Youre right. Im not a pharmacist. But compared to what other guys are doing, creatine isnt bad... And just who's doing what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Creatine is legal, steroids are not. That's the main difference besides one builds muscle a lot faster than the other. I see no problem with players using creatine as long as it's legal to the public, but not steroids which are illegal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 And just who's doing what? Sosas on drugs definitely... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Sosas on drugs definitely... The way I like to figure whether a player is taking a supplement is based on how his speed on the basepaths has decreased over time most likely due to a decrease in flexibility due to steroids. With Sosa and Bonds, this has been quite evident. However, it's been more so with Sosa than with Bonds, who still steals bases while Sammy never does. Then again, there are some players who never steal just because they're very slow but looking back at early times in Sammy's career it's quite evident that he isn't running like he used to while Bonds still steals bases. That's not to say that Bonds isn't juicing though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Sosas on drugs definitely... Sigh.. slander. Say.. "I think Sosa is on roids" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 The way I like to figure whether a player is taking a supplement is based on how his speed on the basepaths has decreased over time most likely due to a decrease in flexibility due to steroids. With Sosa and Bonds, this has been quite evident. However, it's been more so with Sosa than with Bonds, who still steals bases while Sammy never does. Then again, there are some players who never steal just because they're very slow but looking back at early times in Sammy's career it's quite evident that he isn't running like he used to while Bonds still steals bases. That's not to say that Bonds isn't juicing though. The other thing that raised Red Flags for me was Sammy and Barry coming to camp 15-20 #'s lighter the year that they start testing for steroids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishmookie Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 i agree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted July 15, 2003 Share Posted July 15, 2003 Bonds is a jag and i hope he's booed heavily tonight ESPN radio said he was at a club dancing. Gee, i wonder if his sick father was at that same club, and he was just spending time visiting him. What an ass that guy is. Doesn't care about fans, doesn't care about the game, and doesn't respect the players that have come before him. He thinks he's bigger than the game. I got news for you barry, you are NOTHING without the game, nothing. You owe everything you have to the game and to the fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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