TheBigHurt Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 You mean like the 22-year old "bust" that is Homer Bailey? Alpha's got a point. Everybody b****es and moans yet can't come up with anything better. Everybody hates Jerry Owens. Fine. Chone Figgins? Nope. Not good enough. Willy Taveras when he was available? Nope. He can't hit HRs. He sucks. Bobby Abreu? Nope. His defense sucks. Not good enough. When will people realize that Grady Sizemore types ARE NOT AVAILABLE?! Either be content with Jerry Owens or find another damn team to root for. A-f***ing-MEN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bschmaranz Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 12, 2009 -> 10:48 PM) You mean like the 22-year old "bust" that is Homer Bailey? Alpha's got a point. Everybody b****es and moans yet can't come up with anything better. Everybody hates Jerry Owens. Fine. Chone Figgins? Nope. Not good enough. Willy Taveras when he was available? Nope. He can't hit HRs. He sucks. Bobby Abreu? Nope. His defense sucks. Not good enough. When will people realize that Grady Sizemore types ARE NOT AVAILABLE?! Either be content with Jerry Owens or find another damn team to root for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 12, 2009 -> 10:48 PM) You mean like the 22-year old "bust" that is Homer Bailey? Alpha's got a point. Everybody b****es and moans yet can't come up with anything better. Everybody hates Jerry Owens. Fine. Chone Figgins? Nope. Not good enough. Willy Taveras when he was available? Nope. He can't hit HRs. He sucks. Bobby Abreu? Nope. His defense sucks. Not good enough. When will people realize that Grady Sizemore types ARE NOT AVAILABLE?! Either be content with Jerry Owens or find another damn team to root for. Of course, we're not getting Sizemore, Pujols, Hanley Ramirez...even Manny Ramirez. The point is that everyone believes the White Sox, based on their "large market" status, their defending the AL Central championship, their forcing the season ticket holders to "take it or leave it" with the remainders of their deposit money for 2008 playoff tickets...at a time when many of the playoff teams were either keeping prices steady or actually lowering some (like the Rays)...all that adds up to concern and fear of a repeat of 2007. There's the sense we were lucky or fortunate to make the playoffs in 2008 and that our current team is closer to the 2007 version than the 2005/06/08 ones. Trading Konerko for Figgins makes a LOT more sense than trading Dye for Figgins. It would be much easier to replace Konerko than Dye on our team, as currently constituted...or going out into the FA market. That way, there would be a more even balancing of risk for both the White Sox and Angels, who, as one of the truly few large market teams, could take more of a risk than 80-85% of the teams out there on Paulie's deal. Frankly, I don't want them to trade either Konerko or Dye for Figgins, simply because I think there are better options out there...and yes, I would rather have tried to sign Taveras, but once, again, I would have stopped before getting into the $5-6 million range and 2 years. Whether KW was ever part of the negotiations, we might never know. We do know that he believes either Owens or Lillibridge or Getz would be better options for close to the league minimum. Yes, Taveras would arguably be better than those three, but not when you add current economic realities into the equation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shago Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 (edited) If you need more evidence as to why not to trade Dye, rumor out there than when he was with the A's he used to play golf with strippers and have them not only caddy, but also lay down on the greens to give him something to aim at while putting... Na na na na na na na na na na na na na na. Class A stud. Cannot trade the guy. Besides AJ, clearly the Sox most important player. Speaking of which, why does AJ not get more appropriate kudos for turning all these borderline pitchers, Garland, Freddy, Danks, etc. into gamers? Edited January 13, 2009 by La Marr Hoyt HOF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Are you sure you haven't been using some of LaMarr's cocaine, lol? In the last couple of days, we've had Uribe and Dye sex stories. What a strange off-season. I don't know, I wouldn't be surprised by anything about professional athletes, we've all heard the stories about Alex Rodriguez and his many Scores babes...most players have groupies in every city. Just the first time I heard something like that about JD. Working for two years around a minor league team, I guess "Hooters" was more of a normal "manly" environment for the players, writers, umpires and coaching staff than strip joints, although I'm sure there was a little of that, too. By the way. Jon Danks was a first-round draft choice as was Garland, and Freddy Garcia was one of the most highly-sought pitchers in the game when he was pitching for the Astros at the beginning of his career. None of those guys were "made" by AJ, not at all. Garland was with the White Sox for five seasons b4 AJ even arrived on the scene. Danks' success has more to do with Cooper and Buehrle than AJ...or maybe it's 50/50, to be charitable. Garcia's career had been on a downward slant ever since he was overworked the first 4-5 seasons of his career with M's, when he was one of the hardest throwing righties in the game...consistently 93-96 MPH on most days, sometimes a tick better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (La Marr Hoyt HOF @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 05:48 AM) If you need more evidence as to why not to trade Dye, rumor out there than when he was with the A's he used to play golf with strippers and have them not only caddy, but also lay down on the greens to give him something to aim at while putting... Na na na na na na na na na na na na na na. Class A stud. Cannot trade the guy. Besides AJ, clearly the Sox most important player. Speaking of which, why does AJ not get more appropriate kudos for turning all these borderline pitchers, Garland, Freddy, Danks, etc. into gamers? I would LOVE to see a source on that one... Anyways a couple of thoughts. I saw Chone made just under $5 million last year, but it doesn't look like he is signed for 09. What kind of salary is he looking at for 2009? If we are talking about something around that same $5 to $6 million he made before, I really could see a one for one deal happening (maybe stray minor leaguers of the 3rd tier, high ceiling, low achievement kind mixed in). If he ends up closer to the $10 million that lead off hitters like Juan Pierre and Gary Mathews Jr have gotten in recent years, I imagine we would either have to work out something where Anaheim either takes some salary from us (like maybe Mike Mac) or gives us cash back in the deal, so we can make the rumored Abreu deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (La Marr Hoyt HOF @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 05:48 AM) If you need more evidence as to why not to trade Dye, rumor out there than when he was with the A's he used to play golf with strippers and have them not only caddy, but also lay down on the greens to give him something to aim at while putting... Na na na na na na na na na na na na na na. Class A stud. Cannot trade the guy. Besides AJ, clearly the Sox most important player. Speaking of which, why does AJ not get more appropriate kudos for turning all these borderline pitchers, Garland, Freddy, Danks, etc. into gamers? WTF???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 08:14 AM) I would LOVE to see a source on that one... Anyways a couple of thoughts. I saw Chone made just under $5 million last year, but it doesn't look like he is signed for 09. What kind of salary is he looking at for 2009? If we are talking about something around that same $5 to $6 million he made before, I really could see a one for one deal happening (maybe stray minor leaguers of the 3rd tier, high ceiling, low achievement kind mixed in). If he ends up closer to the $10 million that lead off hitters like Juan Pierre and Gary Mathews Jr have gotten in recent years, I imagine we would either have to work out something where Anaheim either takes some salary from us (like maybe Mike Mac) or gives us cash back in the deal, so we can make the rumored Abreu deal. Chone Figgins is one of those Super 2 guys that will be a Free Agent after the 2009 season. I would guess he would get something in the vicinity of $6-7 million next season, just a guess. I'm assuming this year's contract will have to go to arbitration....as he had been working on a three year contract that extended through 2008. http://www.halosheaven.com/2008/6/22/55670...ns-angels-lifer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
103 mph screwball Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Dye >>> Figgins. Dye for Figgins sucks. I'm sure the Sox will either get cash or a prospect or two. Now if you look at the big picture and how a trade could improve the Sox (the way KW would) Figgins + prospect + saved cash spent on Abreu > Dye Figgins 3b Abreu LF TCQ RF Thome DH Konerko 1b Missile SS AJ C Getz/Lilli/Nix winner of 2b job Anderson/Lilli CF OR Figgins + prospect + saved cash towards Michael Young > Dye + (Fields + prospects to trade for Young) Figgins 3b Young SS TCQ LF Thome DH Konerko 1b Missile 2b AJ C Viciedo RF Anderson/Lilli CF OR Figgins + Prospect + saved cash towards Garland/Free agent starter > Dye I still think somehow the Sox need a lead off man and at least one more starting pitcher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joejoesox Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 we aren't getting abreu or figgins, seriously this isn't going to happen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
103 mph screwball Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (joesaiditstrue @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 08:34 AM) we aren't getting abreu or figgins, seriously this isn't going to happen If you say that about every rumor, you would be right most of the time. Every once in a while, a rumor actually happens and that is why I love to think of hot stove scenarios. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Wonder if we could possibly get Nick Adenhart in a deal. His stock went down last season as he was terrible in AAA (Salt Lake City). If you could trade Dye for Figgins and Adenhart, and then sign Abreu to replace Dye, I think that's a move you certainly have to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (DBAHO @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 09:23 AM) Wonder if we could possibly get Nick Adenhart in a deal. His stock went down last season as he was terrible in AAA (Salt Lake City). If you could trade Dye for Figgins and Adenhart, and then sign Abreu to replace Dye, I think that's a move you certainly have to make. As I said before, he's a serious headcase. He's still young and has a lot of time to work out the kinks, but he really needs to get his s*** together. I worked for the Bees out in SLC last summer and got to see a lot of Adenhart. Definitely talented, but was never able to stop big innings from happening. He was also terrible after coming back down from his brief major league stint. And none of this matters because the people in that organization are in love him with. I'd be shocked if they gave him up in a deal for another OF. Edited January 13, 2009 by Felix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Isn't Figgins known to be a little difficult in the clubhouse? I think if it meant Abreu takes JD's place then do the deal. If not, it would be silly IMO. Figgins could be OC II, just counting the days until free agency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 There are a lot of people running around in circles here. There is no debate that on a talent level Dye is better than Bailey, Figgins or Willits. The thing is, the Sox have nobody that has any ability to lead-off and there are two guys (Abreu and Dunn) that could fill the loss of Dye somewhat easily. My question is why would either the Reds or Angels trade for Dye when they could sign Abreu or Dunn for possibly less money and not have to give up anything? Until these guys are off the market, Dye is not really that hot of a product. Everyone wants to write Dye off as aged and useless as they like to do with Konerko and Thome. While that could happen this year, they also could be productive and have a huge impact on the team. None of these guys seem to have the PED questions that could lead to a marked change in production. Owens leading off is scary enough to give up Dye for Figgins. I think OG and KW like Owens enough to not make this move. Figgins/Anderson/Abreu or Dunn is better than Fields/Owens/Dye.........that I think is the question here. You can also put Figgins in center and play Fields at third if defense is not a big thing. I also wouldn't mind bringing Cabrera back on a one year deal if Figgins is brought in.......well I have gone to long now and probably ruined any credabiltiy of my baseball knowledge with that line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I'd even do the trade straight up frankly. Dye is a good player, but the team isnt in dire need of slow boppers, and I would gladly take the hit if we could fill the leadoff hole and inject some speed into the lineup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowch Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I love JD, but he's only getting older. Why not sell him high? Maybe he'll have a terrible year this year and won't even be worth a Figgins. He could also have a good year, but I would rather have some speed than all of the power we already have. That said, I would want more than just Figgins and I imagine KW isn't dumb enough to get just him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 03:58 PM) Isn't Figgins known to be a little difficult in the clubhouse? I think if it meant Abreu takes JD's place then do the deal. If not, it would be silly IMO. Figgins could be OC II, just counting the days until free agency. Yep, he supposedly was a pain in the ass last season in the Angels clubhouse. Figgins isn't cheap, so everyone thinking we'd trade Dye for Chone and then have a ton of money to spend is mistaken. I think Chone is a good player though and a perfect fit for this team...but I think the only way the Angels make this deal is if it's a straight up trade (since they hate to deal their prospects). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 10:10 AM) I'd even do the trade straight up frankly. Dye is a good player, but the team isnt in dire need of slow boppers, and I would gladly take the hit if we could fill the leadoff hole and inject some speed into the lineup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (fathom @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 10:27 AM) Yep, he supposedly was a pain in the ass last season in the Angels clubhouse. Figgins isn't cheap, so everyone thinking we'd trade Dye for Chone and then have a ton of money to spend is mistaken. I think Chone is a good player though and a perfect fit for this team...but I think the only way the Angels make this deal is if it's a straight up trade (since they hate to deal their prospects). I still think this team will add payroll if the sitaution is right. If they do not add payroll and have a bad year, I think a good number of people will cancel, I know I certainly will thin about scaling back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heirdog Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (Jenks Heat @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 11:02 AM) Figgins/Anderson/Abreu or Dunn is better than Fields/Owens/Dye.........that I think is the question here. You can also put Figgins in center and play Fields at third if defense is not a big thing. I also wouldn't mind bringing Cabrera back on a one year deal if Figgins is brought in.......well I have gone to long now and probably ruined any credabiltiy of my baseball knowledge with that line. I do believe a certain Carlos Quentin is a lock in our OF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 QUOTE (heirdog @ Jan 13, 2009 -> 10:56 AM) I do believe a certain Carlos Quentin is a lock in our OF. I was talking 3B/CF/RF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoSox05 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I'm hoping they trade for Figgins just so we never have to hear the rumors of trading for figgins again. I think even if we trade for him there will still be rumors. Rumor - White Sox looking to trade themselves for Figgins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I mean which lineup looks better? 1. Owens CF 2. Getz 2B 3. Q LF 4. Thome DH 5. Dye RF 6. Konerko 1B 7. Alexei SS 8. AJP C 9. Fields 3B 1. Figgins CF 2. Getz 2B 3. Q 4. Thome 5 Konerko 6. Alexei 7 AJP C 8 Fields 9 -Wildcard or Viciedo I honestly think that without Dye we have plenty of power in the lineup and have some flexibility to add a player or check out someone like Viciedo early. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I'd do Dye for Adenhart (if he passes the physical) and Wood. Not too hot for Figgins though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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