Princess Dye Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) First nightmare situation: All the CFs are their usual bad in spring training. The two people who really stand out are Lillibridge and Getz. Would the organization really consider a humongous about face and put Alexei in CF? We'd have our 1 and 2 hitters at ss and 2b. It'd be quite a turn around since they already promised AR his favorite position and just signed his buddy Viciedo to a bloated contract based on his own surprising rookie year. Would suck to now slip ss out from under him. Would they even consider it? Edited February 12, 2009 by Princess Dye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 yeah, or just re-acquire KGj in some form or another Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess Dye Posted February 12, 2009 Author Share Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) Well i suppose Lillibridge in CF is possible. OK well lets still answer the question about Alexei, so yeah, lets make it so -- say Betemit -- takes an IF role out of the blue. Edited February 12, 2009 by Princess Dye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Lillibridge in CF is a possible/probable 2nd option if Owens struggles anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 08:43 PM) Lillibridge in CF is a possible/probable 2nd option if Owens struggles anyway. BP projects Owens at a -27 VORP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claydude14 Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Griffey at under 3 million platoon with Anderson/Dweezy/Thome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Barring a move, I think Owens would have to be awful not to be the opening day leadoff hitter/CF. They're going to give him one last shot at this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 QUOTE (ROC Sox Fan @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 09:22 PM) Griffey at under 3 million platoon with Anderson/Dweezy/Thome. Hopefully he signs with the Mariners in the next few days so this is not a possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daa84 Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (Reddy @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 11:14 PM) BP projects Owens at a -27 VORP. you must be missing a decimal... negative twenty seven? I've never heard of a VORP that low.....hell even wise is projected at "only" -0.5....or is that actually correct? Edited February 12, 2009 by daa84 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 QUOTE (daa84 @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 09:58 PM) you must be missing a decimal... negative twenty seven? I've never heard of a VORP that low.....hell even wise is projected at "only" -0.5 Tony Pena had a -25 VORP last year in one of the least productive seasons in the history of baseball for a hitter with 200+ PA. -2.7 sounds about right for Owens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JorgeFabregas Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 08:37 PM) First nightmare situation: All the CFs are their usual bad in spring training. The last time Brian Anderson had a bad spring training was 2004. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess Dye Posted February 12, 2009 Author Share Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) First nightmare situation: All the CFs are their usual bad in spring training. QUOTE (JorgeFabregas @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 10:19 PM) The last time Brian Anderson had a bad spring training was 2004. i meant it more like, what they do at the plate - it's their usual bad. Career .221/.277 BRIAN LOVAHHHS Edited February 12, 2009 by Princess Dye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Sadly, i can almost guarantee that unless Owens gets hurt this spring their no way he doesn't get the CF job. Regardless of performance this about as much a competition as last years Orton/Grossman battle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 VORP stands for Value over replaced player? Does that mean, Owens is projected to score 27 less runs then whoever he is replacing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (tommy @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 11:05 PM) VORP stands for Value over replaced player? Does that mean, Owens is projected to score 27 less runs then whoever he is replacing? VORP compares a player to a league-average player at his position. Edited February 12, 2009 by scenario Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joejoesox Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 QUOTE (scenario @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 11:12 PM) VORP compares a player to a league-average player at his position. I thought that was OPS+ VORP, i think the other guy is correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 QUOTE (tommy @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 11:05 PM) VORP stands for Value over replaced player? Does that mean, Owens is projected to score 27 less runs then whoever he is replacing? It's the number of runs a player contributes over some average AAAA schmo. There's no way Jerry Owens is projected to have a VORP of -27, that's just epically bad. -2.7 sounds about right however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (scenario @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 11:12 PM) VORP compares a player to a league-average player at his position. EDIT: Thanks for clearing it up. I really want Orlando Hudson, at leadoff 2B, Brian Anderson CF, 9th. Edited February 12, 2009 by tommy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scenario Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (joesaiditstrue @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 11:14 PM) I thought that was OPS+ VORP, i think the other guy is correct? Yep. Sorry. Wasn't thinking when I was typing. Here's the definition from Keith Woolner: Quantifying Replacement Level (VORP) With the preceding ideas about replacement value in mind, I've designed a measure called VORP -- Value Over Replacement Player. We define a replacement level player as one who hits as far below the league positional average as the league backups do relative to league average, who plays average defense for the position, and is a breakeven base-stealer and baserunner. VORP is the number of runs contributed beyond what a replacement level player would contribute if given the same percentage of team plate appearances. How Do We Define Replacement Level? Replacement level is the *expected* level of performance the average team can obtain if it needs to replace a starting player at minimal cost. Individual replacements can perform above or below the expected level, but that does not change what the expectation was at the time of the decision. Specific teams may have better-than replacement level players available in their own systems. This does not change the concept of replacement level -- it shows that team context is important when evaluating particular decisions. If *all* teams had better-than replacement-level players easily available, then that would indicate that your level is set too low. Edited February 12, 2009 by scenario Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess Dye Posted February 12, 2009 Author Share Posted February 12, 2009 QUOTE (tommy @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 11:15 PM) EDIT: Thanks for clearing it up. I really want Orlando Hudson, at leadoff 2B, Brian Anderson CF, 9th. Agreed. I'm fine with BA playing if it's in this scenario. Makes our corner outfielders less of a detriment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Lopez's Ghost Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 QUOTE (flavum @ Feb 11, 2009 -> 09:28 PM) Barring a move, I think Owens would have to be awful not to be the opening day leadoff hitter/CF. They're going to give him one last shot at this. I believe Owens is totally capable of being awful. He's also shown the ability to injure himself out of contention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFanViaSWside Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I think SS is Alexei's for sure. No centerfield for him. Lillibridge can play center if he impresses as well as play backup SS and 2nd. Betemit you will see play mostly 3rd and 1st , rarely if ever 2nd and not a chance at short. I think many of us are hoping/praying Viciendo can impress enough to make the club and make major contributions though I find it unlikely. He will be the one I watch most closely this spring along with Fields, Getz. Lillibridge , Flowers, Poreda, Richards and Beckham. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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