2009 AL Central Thread

[Jordan4life_2007]

I can't believe we are still this close, as bad as we are playing. ITs actually encouraging, in a weird way. We get our starting LF and CF back for the next series. Bad as it looks, the Sox are not out of it.

 

That's really the one saving grace we have. Is that this division is simply average. If we were in the AL east? Yikes.

[SoxFan562004]

I can't believe we are still this close, as bad as we are playing. ITs actually encouraging, in a weird way. We get our starting LF and CF back for the next series. Bad as it looks, the Sox are not out of it.

That's kind of my feeling on this season so far too. I've been pretty level during the horrendous play because this division is pretty average and if this team could get their head out of their asses they'll be in it all summer. The one thing that worries me is it's the same old offensive approach and Walker still just sitting on the bench with apparently no job responsabilities. It's scary to see how long Fields swing has become and seemingly no adjustments. Simple scouting report on the Sox must be throw any garbage over for 1st pitch and you'll get ahead, then if you have two strikes throw it away from them and they'll flail at anyting. Also, if you fall behind and it's a hitters count, don't throw them anything to hit because they're not selective and will swing because it's a hitters count.

[Harry Chappas]

That's kind of my feeling on this season so far too. I've been pretty level during the horrendous play because this division is pretty average and if this team could get their head out of their asses they'll be in it all summer. The one thing that worries me is it's the same old offensive approach and Walker still just sitting on the bench with apparently no job responsabilities. It's scary to see how long Fields swing has become and seemingly no adjustments. Simple scouting report on the Sox must be throw any garbage over for 1st pitch and you'll get ahead, then if you have two strikes throw it away from them and they'll flail at anyting. Also, if you fall behind and it's a hitters count, don't throw them anything to hit because they're not selective and will swing because it's a hitters count.

 

Exactly.

 

Also the Sox historically would have been comparable to the Cardinals/Pirates pre-1980 if they did not have the Yankees in the AL for the last 100 years.

 

If they were in the AL east in the early 90's they would have gone to the playoffs a couple of times. They also had no shot against the Injuns from 95-99.

 

These things move in cycles.

 

It is amazing that sports were even watched prior to 1980 with the dominance of the Yankees, Canadians and Celtics in their respective sports.

Edited May 14, 2009 by Jenks Heat

[Chisoxfn]

That's kind of my feeling on this season so far too. I've been pretty level during the horrendous play because this division is pretty average and if this team could get their head out of their asses they'll be in it all summer. The one thing that worries me is it's the same old offensive approach and Walker still just sitting on the bench with apparently no job responsabilities. It's scary to see how long Fields swing has become and seemingly no adjustments. Simple scouting report on the Sox must be throw any garbage over for 1st pitch and you'll get ahead, then if you have two strikes throw it away from them and they'll flail at anyting. Also, if you fall behind and it's a hitters count, don't throw them anything to hit because they're not selective and will swing because it's a hitters count.

From what I've always been told and consistent with what I've read in the paper and heard on the radio, Walker is one of the hardest working batting coaches in all of baseball. He puts in hour after hour personally with the players and does his job. You have to remember that its been a long time since the Sox called up a big time hitting prospect (and no, Josh Fields, is not a big time hitting prospect). Ie, a consensus top 25 prospect in all of baseball.

 

Really, if you look at the Sox, Joe Borchard was the last consensus top offensive prospect that they called up and everyone knew his swing had some adjustments to be made. Anderson was a highly rated prospect as well, who had a long swing and was rated where he was based upon pure potential and well the Sox have really worked hard on him and it shows (his swing is better, but its still not there).

 

Crede and Rowand were the last two solid prospects the club had and Walker did good things with both of them. Quentin didn't come through the system but you have to give Walker some sort of credit as Quentin had his best season (he was also healthy until punchin the bat which helped) in the majors. Walker worked hard with Ramirez last year and it paid off too and he's working hard with him again and it seems like just recently things might have been fixed.

 

Swisher didn't really listen as the Sox had evidently identified exactly what was wrong or at least thats what was always reported.

 

Konerko, Dye, Thome have all been relatively fine with Walker. Konerko's struggles last year were due to health. Thome is getting older so we should expect to see his numbers decline a bit and Dye has been steady.

 

I have no problem handing over our next crop of players to Mr. Walker.

[SoxFan562004]

From what I've always been told and consistent with what I've read in the paper and heard on the radio, Walker is one of the hardest working batting coaches in all of baseball. He puts in hour after hour personally with the players and does his job. You have to remember that its been a long time since the Sox called up a big time hitting prospect (and no, Josh Fields, is not a big time hitting prospect). Ie, a consensus top 25 prospect in all of baseball.

 

Really, if you look at the Sox, Joe Borchard was the last consensus top offensive prospect that they called up and everyone knew his swing had some adjustments to be made. Anderson was a highly rated prospect as well, who had a long swing and was rated where he was based upon pure potential and well the Sox have really worked hard on him and it shows (his swing is better, but its still not there).

 

Crede and Rowand were the last two solid prospects the club had and Walker did good things with both of them. Quentin didn't come through the system but you have to give Walker some sort of credit as Quentin had his best season (he was also healthy until punchin the bat which helped) in the majors. Walker worked hard with Ramirez last year and it paid off too and he's working hard with him again and it seems like just recently things might have been fixed.

 

Swisher didn't really listen as the Sox had evidently identified exactly what was wrong or at least thats what was always reported.

 

Konerko, Dye, Thome have all been relatively fine with Walker. Konerko's struggles last year were due to health. Thome is getting older so we should expect to see his numbers decline a bit and Dye has been steady.

 

I have no problem handing over our next crop of players to Mr. Walker.

well with a few guys in the minors now and see what they draft in June he'll certainly have his chance.

 

We'll see. To me the team is too pitchable to still. The Harrisson (sp?) guy from the Rangers was not pitching as well as his results IMO, they were still trying to pull everything from what I saw, they had some bad ABs against him that are indicitive of struggles they often have, vets included.

 

I'm a big believer in never confusing the amount of work with results...

 

Is he as bad as I or other make him out to be on the board? Probably not, no. I understand he's given specific players with specific skill sets. My main gripe with the offense of this team is that they're pull happy and they seemingly make adjustments to certain types of pitchers.

 

Borchard, Anderson and Fields were high picks, and so far they've gotten very little to nothing from them at the plate outside Fields first extended stint, and i haven't seen that hitter this year. Those are big indictments to me of Walker, as is Swisher. He had an OPS+ of over 120 his last to years with the A's, comes here has an OPS in the low 90's and then with the NYY is above his career average. Maybe the problem isn't Swisher wouldn't listen, but Walker is bad at communicating his ideas

Edited May 14, 2009 by SoxFan562004

[heimelg]

Verlander has 7 ks through 3 innings.

[Chisoxfn]

well with a few guys in the minors now and see what they draft in June he'll certainly have his chance.

 

We'll see. To me the team is too pitchable to still. The Harrisson (sp?) guy from the Rangers was not pitching as well as his results IMO, they were still trying to pull everything from what I saw, they had some bad ABs against him that are indicitive of struggles they often have, vets included.

 

I'm a big believer in never confusing the amount of work with results...

 

Is he as bad as I or other make him out to be on the board? Probably not, no. I understand he's given specific players with specific skill sets. My main gripe with the offense of this team is that they're pull happy and they seemingly make adjustments to certain types of pitchers.

 

Borchard, Anderson and Fields were high picks, and so far they've gotten very little to nothing from them at the plate outside Fields first extended stint, and i haven't seen that hitter this year. Those are big indictments to me of Walker, as is Swisher. He had an OPS+ of over 120 his last to years with the A's, comes here has an OPS in the low 90's and then with the NYY is above his career average. Maybe the problem isn't Swisher wouldn't listen, but Walker is bad at communicating his ideas

Walker had pretty little to do with Borchard. In terms of the other high picks, lets look at the organizations track record when it comes to first round picks the last 10 or so years. It's pretty much pathetic. In terms of Swishers poor production, I believe he's been slumping as of late in New York but I would be the first to admit that if you wanted to point blame at walker stinking, Swisher would be the guy I'd use as bait as he had a solid major league career prior to coming to the Sox where he absolutely was f***ing terrible.

 

[SoxFan562004]

Walker had pretty little to do with Borchard. In terms of the other high picks, lets look at the organizations track record when it comes to first round picks the last 10 or so years. It's pretty much pathetic. In terms of Swishers poor production, I believe he's been slumping as of late in New York but I would be the first to admit that if you wanted to point blame at walker stinking, Swisher would be the guy I'd use as bait as he had a solid major league career prior to coming to the Sox where he absolutely was f***ing terrible.

Swisher still has a 147 ops+ this year, so he's due to come back a little, hell probably end up around his career numbers, which are that of a good player, especially with his OBP and his ability to take a ton of pitches, something this lineup lacks.

 

Yeah, it's hard to say what the ultimate effect of the hitting coach is, I just hate the approach of many of our hitters the last few years and I'm scapegoating Walker. Look, you're going to get a chance for your argument to be right because Walker is going nowhere, so we'll just have to agree to disagree and as a Sox fan, I hope you're right.

 

(Edit: God, my spelling and simple grammar is even worse than it normally is today!)

Edited May 14, 2009 by SoxFan562004

[Chisoxfn]

Swisher still has a 147 ops+ this year, so he's due to come back a little, hell probably end up around his career numbers, which are that of a good player, especially with his OBP and his ability to take a ton of pitches, something this lineup lacks.

 

Yeah, it's hard to say what the ultimate effect of the hitting coach is, I just hate the approach of many of our hitters the last few years and I'm scapegoating Walker. Look, you're going to get a chance for your argument to be right because Walker is going nowhere, so we'll just have to agree to disagree and as a Sox fan, I hope you're right.

 

(Edit: God, my spelling and simple grammar is even worse than it normally is today!)

If I see Getz turn into a dead pull hitter than I'll shut up forever on Walker. But AJ still does his thing, pretty similar to how hes' been his entire career. I'd say he's been a bit better at times and abit worse at other times but he does drive the ball more than he did with other teams.

 

Dye has been similar throughout his career and is not a pull hitter. Thome always has been and as he's gotten older he's bound to become more of one (most pure power hitters turn more and more into pull hitters late in there careers because they tend to have to cheat to some extend to still be successful; see Frank Thomas). Konerko has also been a guy that tends to pull the ball, but still uses all fields pretty well (but his power is and always will be to Left and Left Center). I'd say the exact same thing with Joe Crede (being a primary pull hitter). So as a hole, I think the reason you see this about the Sox is they tend to have had a lot of sluggers and teams with lots of sluggers tend to be a bit more pull happy by nature.

 

The Sox just haven't had many good "pure" hitters on this squad so we think that its the approach but really its more in line with the type of hitter the guys are for the most part, imo.

[JustWin]

Justin Verlander already has 11K's in just 5 IP so far today.

[Kyyle23]

Justin Verlander already has 11K's in just 5 IP so far today.

 

but what will the Cubs do?

[JustWin]

What's with the sarcasm?

[Kyyle23]

What's with the sarcasm?

 

Just funnin with ya

[The Ginger Kid]

the twins are relentless

[The Ginger Kid]

crede with another clutch hit - single completes the comeback, twins up 6-5.

 

Verlander was awesome again today...

[jphat007]

Haha. We could only be 2 games back after tonight if KC loses. That's borderline ludicrous to me. It's gonna be more after this weekend, but if we can get 1 of the 4 that would be nice.

[Kyyle23]

IIRC Crede was going off at this time last year, then June hit and he fell off the face of the planet

[SoxFan562004]

4th inning not kind to Meche tonight

Edited May 15, 2009 by SoxFan562004

[ThunderBolt]

4th inning not kind to Meche tonight

I'm just happy to see Felix Pie starting to hit. Hopefully, he can keep that job despite Reimold being called up.

[greg775]

Say what you want about Joe Crede -- the man gets clutch hits.

Now somebody cite some bizarre sabermetric statistic telling me he doesn't get big hits. Bulls***. The man is a winner.

[ThunderBolt]

Say what you want about Joe Crede -- the man gets clutch hits.

Now somebody cite some bizarre sabermetric statistic telling me he doesn't get big hits. Bulls***. The man is a winner.

Three or Four months from now when his back puts him on the DL, he won't be winning a damn thing.

[Jordan4life_2007]

IIRC Crede was going off at this time last year, then June hit and he fell off the face of the planet

 

He's not even going off right now. He's sportin' a .766 OPS. He's just come up with clutch hits two nights in a row. Not surprising. We saw this plenty in Chicago. But he's having a pretty s***ty year overall at the plate (although his D has been outstanding).

 

 

Three or Four months from now when his back puts him on the DL, he won't be winning a damn thing.

 

Sounds like you're hoping he ends back up on the DL. Which is pretty sad and lame if true.

[ThunderBolt]

Sounds like you're hoping he ends back up on the DL. Which is pretty sad and lame if true.

I stated it as a logical assumption, not a wish. I love Crede, but his back just can't be trusted as this point. Especially, on turf.

[southsider2k5]

IIRC Crede was going off at this time last year, then June hit and he fell off the face of the planet

 

Once he tweeked his back this season was over. I wouldn't be surprised if the samething happened again around June 1st. Joe doesn't seem to be able to get more than a couple of months at a time of his back.

[fathom]

Jim, any idea what's up with Delmon Young. Sounds like a serious family matter. Hope his family is ok, as they seemed very cool when MLB Network showed that amazing documentary on the family.