Colon/Contreras Update

[iamshack]

The funny thing was everyone laughed at Kenny when we had the worst farm system on the planet and he said it would take no time to fix it. It took him all of a year and a half to get it back to respecful, contributing levels.

 

Jeesh, I hate to say I told you (not you in particular) so, but I told you so...

Edited March 9, 2009 by iamshack

[chunk23]

I'm starting to think that us having four picks in the first two rounds is meaning less and less for us. I forget where, but I read that this upcoming draft class is one of the worst talent and depth-wise (most depth with college arms) in a while and there's not much talent besides a few college guys, a select group of high school arms, and a high school star OF named Donovan Tate, who has five tool potential. I think we'd be lucky to get one decent impact guy in the earlier rounds out of this draft. Hopefully that changes as the college and high school seasons progress.

 

Maybe they'll do what the Yankees did and not sign their picks so they get protected ones next year to ensure better positions in the FA market for 2010.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

I'm starting to think that us having four picks in the first two rounds is meaning less and less for us. I forget where, but I read that this upcoming draft class is one of the worst talent and depth-wise (most depth with college arms) in a while and there's not much talent besides a few college guys, a select group of high school arms, and a high school star OF named Donovan Tate, who has five tool potential. I think we'd be lucky to get one decent impact guy in the earlier rounds out of this draft. Hopefully that changes as the college and high school seasons progress.

There are impact guys in every draft, you just have to do the scouting. 2005 and 2006 had some great talent yet we came away with Broadway and McCulloch in the first rounds of those drafts. I'm more confident in our new regime finding talent in a supposedly weak draft than I'd be with our old regime running things during a stacked draft class.

Edited March 10, 2009 by Kenny Hates Prospects

[soxfan3530]

Bartolo looking good????

 

Pop up for Bartolo

WHITE SOX | Colon's first pitches to live hitters definitely make some noise

 

March 10, 2009

BY JOE COWLEY [email protected]

 

GLENDALE, Ariz. -- Throwing to only a catcher's mitt for the last week, Bartolo Colon was more methodical than impressive.

 

''Facing humans with bats in their hands,'' as White Sox pitching coach Don Cooper put it, guess who flipped the switch Monday?

 

Colon and Jose Contreras made their first 2009 appearances against live hitters, and it was Colon who was the talk of camp. The 35-year-old right-hander was locating his fastball and changeup in the strike zone, and the ball made a certain ''pop'' when it darted past the hitter and into the glove.

 

Even Contreras was impressed with what he saw -- and heard -- from his teammate.

 

''It's an honor to be around a guy like Bartolo,'' Contreras said through interpreter Rafael Santana. ''Nobody thought he would throw the way he did [Monday]. It was very good. We all know the quality of pitcher that he is.

 

''I was very much impressed the way Bartolo located his pitches, and he was throwing hard. It was popping, and the location was more than anything else. It was very impressive. I think Bartolo is almost ready.''

 

Not quite, but very soon.

 

The two veterans took turns throwing 20 pitches to a group of minor-leaguers, then sitting while the other one threw, before throwing 20 more.

 

Contreras, as he has since last week, unleashed his entire arsenal, including breaking balls and dropping his arm to the three-quarters angle he prefers. He has had no setbacks with the ruptured left Achilles tendon that was supposed to take a year to rehabilitate.

 

Director of conditioning Allen Thomas said he has put Contreras through every type of drill that involves running, fielding his position and covering the bag, on every type of surface, to test the injury.

 

Colon is coming off an elbow clean-up surgery, so the Sox had been a bit more tentative with him. That's no longer the case as Cooper even had to pull back on the reins Monday, reminding Colon that this was still a process.

 

''Bartolo has tremendous pitchability,'' Cooper said. ''He's got really good movement, and he can change speeds. He threw fastballs and changeups only, and we spun about three breaking balls. Everything went good for him.

 

''The feeling I'm getting, and he's saying it a little bit: 'I've got more. I've got more.' But we don't need more right now. More ain't better, and where he's at is fine. We're going to continue to progress from here.''

 

That ''progress'' will take them to one more live batting-practice session, likely Thursday because Contreras is off to Tampa, Fla., to become a U.S. citizen and won't be back until Wednesday.

 

Then comes a date this weekend against major-league hitters in a Cactus League game. If there are no setbacks, they will be worked into the rotation with the rest of the starting pitchers, putting them on track for Opening Day.

 

''That's the main thing, see how they feel [today],'' Cooper said. ''Another step forward as far as I'm concerned. It's been a while for both of them since they've done that. It's another positive step in the direction we're hoping to go, which is getting them ready for the fourth and fifth [starting spots].

 

''It looks like we're going to have a chance to do that, no different than the other day. We're hoping this continues.''

 

If it does, Colon would pitch April 10 against Minnesota at U.S. Cellular Field, with Contreras pitching the second game of that three-game series. It also would put Clayton Richard and Jeff Marquez in line to be middle relievers, ready to step in for spot starts.

 

''The possible addition of Colon and Contreras is not only experience and a track record, [but] maybe some of those other guys are going to slide to the bullpen,'' Cooper said. ''That's something to think about. What that means is we're stronger and have more depth. It gives us options.''

[RockRaines]

I'd love to see Colon return to form with us. He can be dominating and at least serviceable.

[DBAHO]

Either way, it's nice to have some depth for those 4th/5th starter jobs right now, and hopefully Colon and Contreras continue to impress, because it sounds like they're impressing everyone over in Glendale ATM.

[maggsmaggs]

Either way, it's nice to have some depth for those 4th/5th starter jobs right now, and hopefully Colon and Contreras continue to impress, because it sounds like they're impressing everyone over in Glendale ATM.

Yeah it is. Marquez has really done well, so i have changed my opinion on him. I though he would suck, but he has really impressed me with his natural movement and location. He looks like a solid pitcher. Richard can be a great reliever and spot starter. I love the depth we have right now. Poreda looks like a stud in the making, Egbert even looks solid so far. KW deserves a lot of credit for his moves this off-season, he kept the team in good shape payroll wise while still having a great future and a solid change this year. We haven't had this kind of pitching depth in awhile.

[ThunderBolt]

I still miss Swish, but if Marquez can pitch like this on a consistent basis, I will miss him significantly less. Regardless, it sounds like Swish had no place on this team now and in the future. On the Contreras front, it sounds like nothing except caution from the coaches will stop him from being in the rotation on opening day.

[Harry Chappas]

If this team stays healthy they win the division. They are the only team you can say that about.

[Reddy]

I still miss Swish, but if Marquez can pitch like this on a consistent basis, I will miss him significantly less. Regardless, it sounds like Swish had no place on this team now and in the future. On the Contreras front, it sounds like nothing except caution from the coaches will stop him from being in the rotation on opening day.

it is nothing short of MIRACULOUS that he's healed so fast. it's insane. it's only been 7 months or so since his injury. that's 5 MONTHS ahead of schedule. suddenly it looks like we have a lot more depth than we thought... i love it.

[Y2HH]

I don't want to sound overly optimistic or anything, but I'm really *really* liking what our starting rotation is looking like.

[southsider2k5]

http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=277874

 

Sox' secret weapons in Colon, Contreras?

Well, maybe more unexpected than secret when it comes to starters

By Scot Gregor | Daily Herald Staff

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Published: 3/10/2009 12:06 AM

 

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* Buerhle back and feeling good [3/10/09]

 

GLENDALE, Ariz. - When he was piling up wins for the Indians, Expos, White Sox and Angels from 1998-2005, Bartolo Colon would often dial his fastball up to 100 mph in the eighth and ninth innings.

 

His killer instinct was legendary, and so was Colon's competitive nature.

 

On a sleepy Monday morning at the Sox' spring-training complex, Colon conjured up some memories of his brilliant past.

 

"It's incredible the way Bartolo threw today," Jose Contreras said.

 

White Sox pitching coach Don Cooper was saying much the same about Colon - and Contreras for that matter.

 

Both of the veteran right-handed starters were question marks when spring training opened last month, but Colon and Contreras were impressive after throwing live batting practice for the first time Monday.

 

"Another step forward as far as I'm concerned," Cooper said after Colon and Contreras threw 40 pitches apiece to a group of minor-league hitters. "They're facing humans with bats in their hands. It's been awhile for both of them since they've done that. Everything continues to go.

 

"It's another positive step in the direction we're hoping to go, which is getting them ready for the fourth and fifth (rotation spots). It looks like we're going to have a chance to do that."

 

Heading into camp, the White Sox were set at the top of the rotation with Mark Buehrle, Gavin Floyd and John Danks.

 

After that, they had their fingers crossed with Colon at No. 4. And with Contreras seemingly unavailable until after the all-star break after rupturing his left Achilles' tendon last August, a group of young pitchers including Jeff Marquez and Clayton Richard were positioned to compete for the No. 5 spot.

 

If Colon and Contreras continue to make progress, the Sox are going to run out a potentially powerful - and proven - starting five.

 

"Let me tell you something - no matter who we leave with to start, we're going to feel good about any of them," Cooper said. "Nobody's getting on that plane unless we feel they can help us win.

 

"Whether that's Bartolo and Contreras at 4 and 5, which is looking like it's going to happen, or Marquez, Richard or any other name you want to choose from, we're going to feel good about them. We're going to go to battle and try to win the division, no matter what.

 

"I think the possible addition of Colon and Contreras is not only experience and a track record, maybe some of those other guys are going to slide to the bullpen. That's something to think about. What that means is we're stronger and have more depth."

 

If Colon (who had bone chips removed in October) and Contreras stay healthy, there is little doubt the Sox will be a stronger team in 2009.

 

The duo are a combined 215-197, while Richard was 2-5 with a 6.04 ERA last season. Marquez and another starting candidate, Aaron Poreda, have no major-league experience.

 

"I think that's real good, to add some veterans to the staff," Danks said. "Obviously, it makes us deeper. We have the young guys that are capable of getting outs, and then to throw in some veterans like that, it does nothing but help."

 

If Colon - in particular - builds off his brief outing Monday, opposing hitters are going to be needing the help. Throwing fastballs, changeups and a few curves, the 35-year-old offered a big thumbs up after coming off the mound.

 

"Bartolo has tremendous pitch ability," Cooper said. "He's got really good movement and he can change speeds.

 

"Everything went good today for him. The feeling I'm getting, and he's saying it a little bit: 'I've got more. I've got more.' But we don't need more right now. More ain't better and where he's at is fine. We're going to continue to progress from here."

[Balta1701]

BP Session again today. Cowley twit:

Colon and Contreras pitch again... all went well.

[RockRaines]

I get the feeling that Marquez is the 6th starter right now in their eyes.

[Balta1701]

I get the feeling that Marquez is the 6th starter right now in their eyes.

If the 2 vets are healthy enough to go 6+ innings with no troubles, that's exactly where he should be. If he performs in the minors this year, he'll get his chance to step in at some point, and there's likely 2 rotation spots opening up at the end of this season if he can continue to earn it.

[caulfield12]

"Pitchability" is the new buzzword this season from Cooper I think...

 

MacDougal, Sisco, Aardsma, etc.=no pitchability, but live arms

[Balta1701]

Comments on throwing session today

Contreras was joined by Colon in the duo's second bullpen session this week, preceded by three side sessions the week before. The next step for their recovery programs comes in game action, as Colon follows Contreras' start with his own on Monday at home against the Royals.

 

According to White Sox pitching coach Don Cooper, the goal is to have Contreras and Colon throw one or two innings. Their bullpens have been aligned with game action, as Contreras threw 25 pitches Thursday and then sat down and gave way to Colon's 25 pitches. Contreras then came back to the mound for inning No. 2 against Minor Leaguers Miguel Negron, Keith Ginter, Freddie Thon and Javier Collina.

 

"They are ready, pitch-total- and arm-strength-wise, to give us two, so we will see how it goes," said Cooper of Contreras and Colon. "Every time we come out here, we are doing things and we are climbing and getting closer to them being back and getting into the fourth and fifth spot. Nothing today is pointing in any other direction."

 

A few more split-fingers were featured by Contreras on Thursday. Cooper explained how the split-finger is a "feel pitch," so Contreras threw a few more to get that feel back again. Colon, once again, focused on the fastball and change, mixing in a few curves, while throwing to the glove and showing great movement on his pitches. But the accuracy or velocity of their fastballs, not to mention pinpoint location, won't be how Contreras and Colon are rated their first time out.

 

"It's going to be how they feel before, during and after and the next day," Cooper said. "If they feel good before, during and after and the next day, then we can take the next step and climb."

 

"I was very focused today, and it's kind of difficult sometimes with the setting," Contreras said. "But I was trying to be focused, so it shouldn't be any different when I [start]."

[2nd_city_saint787]

I honestly see these two guys pushing each other the whole season and both having phenomenal seasons. I also see the top 3 guys feeding off these guys as well, and im gonna go out on a limb and say this starting staff will be better than the 05 staff. I might just be saying this cause im a sox fan but i think this team has a legit chance at doing A LOT of damage. Are either of Counts or Colons games gonna be on tv???

[southsider2k5]

Comments on throwing session today

 

Anyone know if Freddie Thon is ex-Astro Dickie Thon's kid?

[Cubano]

I honestly see these two guys pushing each other the whole season and both having phenomenal seasons. I also see the top 3 guys feeding off these guys as well, and im gonna go out on a limb and say this starting staff will be better than the 05 staff. I might just be saying this cause im a sox fan but i think this team has a legit chance at doing A LOT of damage. Are either of Counts or Colons games gonna be on tv???

 

 

The only thing pushing Contreras this season is $$$$$$ free agency.

[Dick Allen]

The only thing pushing Contreras this season is $$$$$$ free agency.

That is silly. He's never been one to give anything but max effort.

[Cubano]

That is silly. He's never been one to give anything but max effort.

 

 

For the first time I read a positive comment from you regarding cuban baseball or a player from Cuba in general.

 

Contreras won't be the first one to try to do well in his contract year especially when this may be his last contract.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

Never underestimate the motivational power of one last big payday.

[southsider2k5]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseb...?obref=outbrain

 

White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen cautious about Bartolo Colon being ready by Opening Day

Starter wild in 1st appearance since elbow surgery

 

By Mark Gonzales | Tribune reporter

March 17, 2009

 

PHOENIX — The script calls for Jose Contreras and Bartolo Colon to be the White Sox's fourth and fifth starters on April 10-11.

 

That's enough time for Colon to work on his control after he displayed a lack of command Monday in his first start since undergoing surgery last fall to remove bone chips from his right elbow.

 

"He's reacquainting himself with the mound and with baseball and the game, and I think we got all that accomplished," pitching coach Don Cooper said after Colon threw only 22 of 40 pitches for strikes in a 12/3-inning stint of an 11-7 loss to Kansas City. "Now, we have a starting point like Contreras."

 

One day after Contreras pitched two scoreless innings against Seattle in his exhibition debut after healing from a torn left Achilles' tendon, Colon was charged with four runs while allowing three hits, two walks and striking out one. His fastball was clocked at 89 m.p.h.

 

Related links

 

*

Thome misses 5th straight exhibition due to back spasms

 

"He pushed too many pitches up in the zone," Cooper said. "He tried to go from the level of intensity he was at batting practice up a level. I think he was quick from the stretch. He always is quick, but he hasn't been in the stretch for a while."

 

Contreras and Colon will pitch Friday, but Colon's outing will occur in a minor-league game so the Sox's staff can have more control over his work. Jeff Marquez will follow Contreras against San Francisco, primarily as a fallback if Contreras and/or Colon aren't ready by the start of the regular season.

 

The Sox will be satisfied if Colon, 35, can build his endurance to throw six innings by the first weekend of the season, but manager Ozzie Guillen spoke cautiously of Colon's return.

 

"All arm injuries, we have to be careful," Guillen said. "And we're not in a hurry with him. Hopefully, he starts with us on Opening Day. To me, we've got three more weeks. It could happen, but it's not in my managing plans."

 

Cooper, however, reiterated his optimism that Colon would be ready by Opening Day.

 

Colon started the first inning by retiring Coco Crisp on two pitches, but he then walked David DeJesus before Alex Gordon hit a triple to right field. Ryan Shealy's sacrifice fly gave Kansas City a 2-0 lead.

 

Colon's control problems became more apparent in the second when he threw only 11 of 22 pitches for strikes and failed to finish the inning. He walked Mark Teahen and allowed a single to Ross Gload before retiring Alberto Callaspo and Luis Hernandez on fly balls to left.

 

But Crisp hit a two-out single to score Teahen and prompt Guillen to pull him.

 

Mark Buehrle, staying on his normal schedule leading up to his Opening Day start against Kansas City on April 6, surrendered an RBI single to DeJesus that allowed Gload to score and charged Colon with another run.

 

Colon declined to talk to reporters.

[Balta1701]

It doesn't hurt us that much to give Marquez a start or two.