Anyone else wish we still had...

[SouthsideDon48]

It still kills me to see him in a Cubs uniform, and I really don't know why we even traded Cotts away in the first place.

 

Did we even really need to get Aardsma? I thought that trade was extremely lopsided when it occurred, but then again I might be a little biased since Cotts is a 2005 Post-Season Hero.

 

Now that Aardsma is long gone, and who knows whatever became of that Carlos Vazquez dude that was thrown in the deal, the trade is clearly in favor of the Cubs.

 

It sure would've been nice to have Cotts as the 2nd lefty in the bullpen along with Thornton. Then even throw in Richard as the 3rd lefty then our bullpen would've looked more complete with: Jenks, Linebrink, Thornton, Dotel, Cotts, Carasco, Richard.

 

Kenny, this is one trade where I have to ask you... "What were you thinking?"

Edited March 7, 2009 by SouthsideDon48

[Kalapse]

Neal Cotts sucks, pining for his return is silly. He's a 29 year old lefty with 2 pitches, both of which are unimpressive who can't get lefties out and hasn't posted an OPS against lower than .884 in high leverage situations in any season outside of 2005. Neal Cotts's are a dime a dozen.

[lvjeremylv]

Eh I've said this before, but I think Cotts was one of a few Sox bullpen guys from 2005 that were "enhancing" themselves with something. He, along with Dustin and Cliff, came virtually out of nowhere to post phenomenal numbers.

 

And spare me the "bullpens are fickle from year to year" and "this happens all the time" garbage. Look at their stats before 2005, and their stats after 2005, and tell me it doesn't at least look suspicious.

 

But to answer your question, no, I don't think you're in the majority when you say you miss Neal Cotts.

[Jimbo's Drinker]

No

 

next question

[witesoxfan]

And spare me the "bullpens are fickle from year to year" and "this happens all the time" garbage. Look at their stats before 2005, and their stats after 2005, and tell me it doesn't at least look suspicious.

 

Bullpens ARE fickle from year to year.

 

Neal Cotts has never had anything more than a 92 MPH fastball and a mediocre curve. He was good in 2005 because the hitch in his delivery made it appear as though the ball was coming out much faster, and it was hard to pick up. He stopped doing that sometime during the 2006 season, perhaps because it hurt, and he got his s*** lit up. It's pretty simple.

 

Hermanson had always been a very solid pitcher and he had some pretty solid years with the Expos and Cardinals as I seem to recall (don't have B-R open). He was an absolutely dynamite reliever for 3 months and was then just a very solid reliever.

 

Cliff Politte had a couple solid seasons with the Phillies and Blue Jays, and had a fantastic season with the Sox. When you have a 98 MPH fastball, you can have years like that. He was probably the best reliever in baseball that season.

 

There are 3 perfectly reasonable explanations for those 3 pitchers. Do you still think they were taking PEDs?

[lvjeremylv]

Bullpens ARE fickle from year to year.

 

Neal Cotts has never had anything more than a 92 MPH fastball and a mediocre curve. He was good in 2005 because the hitch in his delivery made it appear as though the ball was coming out much faster, and it was hard to pick up. He stopped doing that sometime during the 2006 season, perhaps because it hurt, and he got his s*** lit up. It's pretty simple.

 

Hermanson had always been a very solid pitcher and he had some pretty solid years with the Expos and Cardinals as I seem to recall (don't have B-R open). He was an absolutely dynamite reliever for 3 months and was then just a very solid reliever.

 

Cliff Politte had a couple solid seasons with the Phillies and Blue Jays, and had a fantastic season with the Sox. When you have a 98 MPH fastball, you can have years like that. He was probably the best reliever in baseball that season.

 

There are 3 perfectly reasonable explanations for those 3 pitchers. Do you still think they were taking PEDs?

Yes, I do think there's a better than good chance they were using. You don't go from being mediocre at best (Cotts & Hermanson, as Politte had some success before 2005 like you pointed out) to absolutely lights out, then back to mediocre at best unless you're cutting corners somewhere. Just doesn't happen.

[scenario]

Another point about Cotts...

 

Pitchers who average walking more than 4 batters per 9 innings generally struggle to succeed in MLB.

 

Cotts' career BB/9 = 4.5

[fathom]

Neal Cotts in 2005 had the luckiest season ever. He's a lefty who throws nothing but high fastballs, and he managed to give up only one homer the whole season.

[sircaffey]

Huh?

[Chisoxfn]

I loved Neal in 05, the guy was unhittable with that hitch. No one could catch his fastball and he was dominant. HIs arm started hurting and he had to make some mechanical adjustments and unfortunately the deception in his delivery went away and without it he was unable to be successful. I wish Neal nothing but the best and will always remember when he became a member of Soxtalk and went on to be the most productive member in Soxtalk history (thus far).

 

And I say that as him being an open member of Soxtalk (ie, who actually posted).

[SoxFan562004]

is this a troll job? Cotts is not very good. Stop listening to Cubs fans, their management and their announcers who are trying to convince everyone that they're bullpen is good on paper. On paper it's average.

[SouthsideDon48]

is this a troll job? Cotts is not very good. Stop listening to Cubs fans, their management and their announcers who are trying to convince everyone that they're bullpen is good on paper. On paper it's average.

 

A troll job? Why would I be trolling about Neal Cotts? Just because I happen to like someone that used to be a former Sox member, and he kinda sucks now, I'm a troll? If so, then anyone who wishes Joe Crede is still on the Sox are trolls as well.

 

I don't even listen to or watch Cubs games, so I have no clue about what the Cubs' organization opinion of Cotts is. I was under the impression that Cotts was getting lost in the shuffle among Cubs relievers, though.

 

And even though Cotts may no longer be as dominating as he was in 2005, and that he has a 4.5 walk ratio, I still think he'd be serviceable as a 5th or 6th inning reliever if he was still on the Sox. I definitely think Cotts is still better than Wassermann, Russell, and MacDougal.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Yes, I do think there's a better than good chance they were using. You don't go from being mediocre at best (Cotts & Hermanson, as Politte had some success before 2005 like you pointed out) to absolutely lights out, then back to mediocre at best unless you're cutting corners somewhere. Just doesn't happen.

You're so right. Players never have career years unless they are on roids. Please, find another sport.

[scenario]

I still think he'd be serviceable as a 5th or 6th inning reliever if he was still on the Sox. I definitely think Cotts is still better than Wassermann, Russell, and MacDougal.

 

I agree that he could compete with those guys for a roster spot... in Charlotte.

 

Because none of those guys are going to make the Sox 25-man roster.

 

 

[santo=dorf]

Neal Cotts in 2005 had the luckiest season ever. He's a lefty who throws nothing but high fastballs, and he managed to give up only one homer the whole season.

To Jason freaking Dubois in a blowout game we won. That's lame.

[GoodAsGould]

To Jason freaking Dubois in a blowout game we won. That's lame.

 

How many teams will ever go through 3 closers in a season and win the world series, what a magical year.

[kjshoe04]

He went to ISU so I love him. I don't want him wearing a Sox jersey though.

[nitetrain8601]

I like him. Miss him. Didn't know he used to post on here. Seemed cool. Loved the hitch.

[witesoxfan]

Yes, I do think there's a better than good chance they were using. You don't go from being mediocre at best (Cotts & Hermanson, as Politte had some success before 2005 like you pointed out) to absolutely lights out, then back to mediocre at best unless you're cutting corners somewhere. Just doesn't happen.

 

2005 was the first year that suspensions were in line for positive tests, and none of them tested positive. None of them have tested positive afterwards either.

 

Neal Cotts did have a solid background. He had a K/9 of 11.1 in AA the year he was called up and a 2.17 ERA. He was an absolutely dominant pitcher when he had any control of his pitches. That was all because of the hitch in his delivery, and he no longer has that. I don't get why you don't understand that.

 

I also assume that the 39 innings that Hermanson had with the Giants in 03 where he had a 3.00 ERA in 39 innings is because he was using as well. Get real, Hermanson was a pitcher with very solid stuff who pitched well over a 3 month period. That happens too.

 

To suggest that those two were using is absolute blasphemy and an insult.

 

[elrockinMT]

It still kills me to see him in a Cubs uniform, and I really don't know why we even traded Cotts away in the first place.

 

Did we even really need to get Aardsma? I thought that trade was extremely lopsided when it occurred, but then again I might be a little biased since Cotts is a 2005 Post-Season Hero.

 

Now that Aardsma is long gone, and who knows whatever became of that Carlos Vazquez dude that was thrown in the deal, the trade is clearly in favor of the Cubs.

 

It sure would've been nice to have Cotts as the 2nd lefty in the bullpen along with Thornton. Then even throw in Richard as the 3rd lefty then our bullpen would've looked more complete with: Jenks, Linebrink, Thornton, Dotel, Cotts, Carasco, Richard.

 

Kenny, this is one trade where I have to ask you... "What were you thinking?"

 

 

That wasn't a good trade for the Sox. I liked Neal Cotyts, but I am not sure he has the consistency we need to be a winner. Thornton is for sure the best lefty releiver we have

[RockRaines]

Eh I've said this before, but I think Cotts was one of a few Sox bullpen guys from 2005 that were "enhancing" themselves with something. He, along with Dustin and Cliff, came virtually out of nowhere to post phenomenal numbers.

 

And spare me the "bullpens are fickle from year to year" and "this happens all the time" garbage. Look at their stats before 2005, and their stats after 2005, and tell me it doesn't at least look suspicious.

 

But to answer your question, no, I don't think you're in the majority when you say you miss Neal Cotts.

Eh, if you've said it before then you have been a f***ing moron more than once. I know Neal personally and you couldnt be more wrong. Neal was actually a good prospect and started the futures game at the cell, but of course any player that has a good year is on the juice. Thanks for your input.

[Vance Law]

Just doesn't happen.

 

Yes it does. It happens all the time. Every season. That's relief pitching.

[Paint it Black]

He went to ISU so I love him. I don't want him wearing a Sox jersey though.

THIS.

 

Isn't it crazy that he received the highest signing bonus from an ISU athlete ever, let alone getting drafted in the second round.

[GREEDY]

Neil Cotts was a left hander that bought into Ozzie/Coop's: Throw a first strike above all mentality.

 

Hermanson did the exact same thing in '05.

 

For the majority of the season Cotts was put in the game in situations where it would be easy for him to succeed. He took the ball and threw strikes... and he wasn't exposed to much risk.

 

I remember someone posting Neil's flyball ratio going into '06; the poster explained how he should have given up nearly ten more home runs in '05 and that he was very lucky. The poster claimed that Cotts would be out of baseball by '08; while he wasn't completely correct, that was a pretty big statement considering at the time Cotts was a top lefty reliever in baseball an appeared poised to be around forever.

 

This is prolly something better suited fot it's own thread but has anyone noticed Coop has had success taking "stuff" pitchers and getting them to "dial it back a bit" and throw strikes? It is like he has taken the same approach with every new pitcher he gets his hands on.

Edited March 8, 2009 by GREEDY

[lostfan]

This is prolly something better suited fot it's own thread but has anyone noticed Coop has had success taking "stuff" pitchers and getting them to "dial it back a bit" and throw strikes? It is like he has taken the same approach with every new pitcher he gets his hands on.

Yeah, this has been noted on this board a few times. Seems to be Coop's MO. Worked with Floyd, didn't work with Vazquez.