Is Beckham the new 2B?

[caulfield12]

 

 

FWIW, if Contreras and Colon are close to 100%, the defense isn't nearly as much of an issue as it would be with Marquez inducing a lot of groundballs with his sinker and Clayton Richard out there. Poreda would get more strikeouts (probably) than those two, but we've been complaining about our speed and defense for seemingly a decade, and it's never going to be quite what we want it to be, because the focus will always be on offense first playing 81 home games at USCF.

 

Someone (not sure which thread it was) said that USCF might not be an "offense first" stadium because someone like Jerry Owens/Mackowiak might give up a couple of bloopers or Texas Leaguers that should have been caught...while that's true, it's okay if the player at that position can make up for his defensive mistakes with his bat, which Owens really can't do.

 

Even when we did have speed, Pods wasn't a very good LFer and had a poor arm. He got to some balls because of his speed that someone like Quentin might not have reached, but Quentin's still a better OFer. Heck, burly Michael Restovich is a better OFer than Pods.

 

And even with Brian Anderson, it's fairly reasonable to expect he could hit 18-24 homers with a .240 AVG and maybe a .725-.750 OPS. Not great, but he wouldn't kill you, either, because we SHOULD have above-average offense from every position on the field, with the possible exception of 2B. If we had Beckham at 2B and Ramirez at SS, we would arguably have above-average production from every position on the field (assuming Konerko's healthy and in the same form he was in the final six weeks of the season when he hit 9 homers).

 

We're never going to have a team that trots out 8 great defenders and 8 great offensive players. It just doesn't work that way.

[NorthSideSox72]

The problem with that argument is that so was Jerry Owens...

 

Between his bad reads/jumps and noodle arm, he's definitely in the bottom 33% of CFers defensively, overall. If he had an average arm, you could argue he's close to the middle of the pack.

 

There has to be SOME reason all these teams have never tried him in CF in recent years (like the DBacks, Cubs and now Ozzie in ST)...and why's he being referred to as a possibility for back-up corner infield and 1B (Ross Gload-ish) instead of as a competitor for the starting CF job.

I thought Rock was being sarcastic, referring to the Owens logic.

 

[scenario]

Trust your eyeballs. They'll tell you that Ramirez has a 70+ arm on the rating scale (behind only Furcal, Dunston, Uribe, Valentin in his prime) and that his arm will make up for any number of mistakes out there...is he going to be great? I don't know yet. But I think he'll be very good, just as he was a very good (but not great) 2B, playing a new position in a new country for the very first time in the heat of a pennant race, when he wasn't used to such a long season. But I guess we expect perfection.

 

I just saw a statistical analysis from the other day that "proved" Alfonso Soriano is the best left-fielder in MLB... defensively.

 

As the saying goes... "Statistics don't lie... but statisticians do."

 

Because numbers can be found to support almost any argument.

Edited March 11, 2009 by scenario

[VenomSox]

This was probably already posted in some way.

 

 

Rotowire.com

Manager Ozzie Guillen said Beckham would get starts at second, short and third this spring, but would only play one position once the regular season starts, the Being Ozzie Guillen reports. "I want to make this clear, Guillen said, "I'm going to play this kid at shortstop, third base and second base, not because I want him to be the utility guy, he's too good. I just want him to get at-bats, and keep having the opportunity to open eyes."

 

Spin: Guillen has sung the praises of Beckham's bat all spring, at the 2008 draft pick leads the majors with five doubles through 10 games. The one down side to Beckham bouncing around the diamond during exhibition play is that he will not become acquainted with any one defensive position, which may reduce his chances of making the 25-man roster. However, 2009 is a very very likely ETA.

Thu, Mar 12

[Jordan4life_2007]

I just saw a statistical analysis from the other day that "proved" Alfonso Soriano is the best left-fielder in MLB... defensively.

 

As the saying goes... "Statistics don't lie... but statisticians do."

 

Because numbers can be found to support almost any argument.

 

That's nothing. I discovered the "just enough" HR stat yesterday.

[Bubba Philips]

No matter how well he plays this spring Beckham will start at Birmingham. He is a great ball player but I think that Sox management want him to let him go through the system. If that is so I would make tell everybody to make plans to go to Birmingham to see him play.

[flavum]

No matter how well he plays this spring Beckham will start at Birmingham. He is a great ball player but I think that Sox management want him to let him go through the system. If that is so I would make tell everybody to make plans to go to Birmingham to see him play.

 

If they're telling Beckham he has a chance to make the team, then I think he'll make the team. He's a better baseball player than Getz, Lillibridge, and Nix, and I fully expect he'll outplay them to be the opening day 2B.

[Bubba Philips]

If they're telling Beckham he has a chance to make the team, then I think he'll make the team. He's a better baseball player than Getz, Lillibridge, and Nix, and I fully expect he'll outplay thems to be the opening day 2B.

Gordon is our best option at 2b but when I asked Ozzie yesterday Ozzie said"no, he'll be starting the season at Birmingham"

[flavum]

Gordon is our best option at 2b but when I asked Ozzie yesterday Ozzie said"no, he'll be starting the season at Birmingham"

 

3 weeks to change his mind.

 

I really don't think they can make the wrong decision with Beckham. I certainly couldn't blame them for sending him down for a month or two. On the other hand, I think this kid is ready now, and could be a great spark plug for this team from day 1.

 

My fear is that Getz plays really well, and than they start scrambling to find Beckham a different postion, like LF or CF. That would definitely be a bad move. That's why I kinda hope he makes 2B from day 1, just to lock him in to the job and not cause confusion within the organization.

[Bubba Philips]

3 weeks to change his mind.

 

I really don't think they can make the wrong decision with Beckham. I certainly couldn't blame them for sending him down for a month or two. On the other hand, I think this kid is ready now, and could be a great spark plug for this team from day 1.

 

My fear is that Getz plays really well, and than they start scrambling to find Beckham a different postion, like LF or CF. That would definitely be a bad move. That's why I kinda hope he makes 2B from day 1, just to lock him in to the job and not cause confusion within the organization.

Beckham is as good as advertised and what is so great about him is he doesn't seem spoiled by his new found fame. At spring training no one is better applauded when he is announced. He fields everything that is hit to him and I saw him make some great plays. He seems very relaxed at the plate and seemingly has great plate discipline. He is not great in stature but hits the ball with great authority. Before, after and during the game he smiles constantly being very polite. After Getz who was hitting in front of Beckham hit a foul ball Beckham grabbed his bat and waited for him at the plate. As a matter of fact I overheard Aj who was sitting by Cooper, said ."you're in the big leagues now you don't have to be shagging bats" I am a Beckham fan to me what is amazing is that this spring training thing doesn't seem to phase him. His personality a, good nature seem to just keep shining through. Presently he seems unspoiled and has yet to assume the arrogance that seems so evident in many .major league players. He really seems to enjoy us, the fans.

[ILMOU]

Beckham is as good as advertised

 

 

Yes he is. If Beckham is our best 2B, he should be starting from Day 1.

 

Of course, every game counts the same, but IMO, the start of the season is perhaps the most important. Unless a team just KNOWS they're good, by their collective pedigree, overcoming a bad start is very difficult. A team with several new and unproven pieces, like ours, needs to gain their confidence from winning early.

 

Beckham will be Pedroia with a little less speed and a little more power. I'll take that.

[dmbjeff]

me thinks he is grindy too.

[joejoesox]

does anyone here honestly think chris getz is a better option at 2B than beckham to start the season, and is a better (more capable) baseball player at this point in time?

 

seriously, there's really no reason why Getz should be given a shot over Beckham, not one good reason

 

and before someone says "what if Beckham struggles and has to be sent down, and hurts his confidence?"

 

my response

 

if Beckham struggles, getz is DEFINITELY going to struggle because Beckham > Getz

[bighurt4life]

does anyone here honestly think chris getz is a better option at 2B than beckham to start the season, and is a better (more capable) baseball player at this point in time?

 

seriously, there's really no reason why Getz should be given a shot over Beckham, not one good reason

 

and before someone says "what if Beckham struggles and has to be sent down, and hurts his confidence?"

 

my response

 

if Beckham struggles, getz is DEFINITELY going to struggle because Beckham > Getz

 

 

Yes there are several good reasons.

 

1. Beckham is not a natural 2B and should be given every chance to stay at SS as he'll have the most value for us at that position.

2. Getz has worked his way through the minors and has succeeded at every level.

3. Getz is older and has more experience than Beckham, his skills are more refined.

4. Getz would be a more natural lead off hitter than Beckham as he has above average speed and has a great eye at the plate. He actually averaged more BB's than K's in his minor league career and we need a good OBP guy at the top of the order, there's plenty of guys in our lineup with power but we need people to actually get on base for that power to help us..

5. Getz has already played a bit for us in the majors. That plus his minor league experience makes him more of a known quantity than a guy who has played 30 games for us in our organization so far.

 

There's five reasons for you and I could probably come up with more if you want. Don't confuse tools/talent with readiness. It's obvious that Beckham is a baller and as tons of talent but he's not a finished product yet. So he has had a great spring training, BFD. Lots of guys murder the ball in ST, lets see what he does in AA for a couple of months before anointing him the new 2B messiah. It's a long season and the cream always rises to the top. If he's supposed to be in the bigs, they'll find a spot for him.

Edited March 14, 2009 by bighurt4life

[GreatScott82]

Yes there are several good reasons.

 

1. Beckham is not a natural 2B and should be given every chance to stay at SS as he'll have the most value for us at that position.

2. Getz has worked his way through the minors and has succeeded at every level.

3. Getz is older and has more experience than Beckham

4. Getz would be a more natural lead off hitter than Beckham as he has above average speed and has a great eye at the plate. He actually averaged more BB's than K's in his minor league career and we need a good OBP guy at the top of the order.

5. Getz has already played a bit for us in the majors. That plus his minor league experience makes him more of a known quantity than a guy who has played 30 games for us in our organization so far.

 

There's five reasons for you and I could probably come up with more if you want. Don't confuse tools/talent with readiness. Beckham has had a great spring training for us. BFD, lots of guys murder the ball in ST, lets see what he does in AA for a couple of months before anointing him the new 2B messiah. It's a long season and the cream always rises to the top. If he's supposed to be in the bigs, they'll find a spot for him.

1. I agree with that as I can see the Sox sending Beckham down to start the year to get some 2b experience.

4. I disagree with that. Beckham is a much better hitter than Getz and therefor would be a better leadoff hitter.

 

The pressure will be on Getz to maintain his job in the majors. Beckham is already knocking on the door. I'm guessing Getz will have two months to prove himself.

 

If Getz does prove himself and starts the season off strong- better for us. Once Beckham is ready- we could trade Getz for value... were still looking for a CF Kenny!

Edited March 14, 2009 by GreatScott82

[Pants Rowland]

1. I agree with that as I can see the Sox sending Beckham down to start the year to get some 2b experience.

4. I disagree with that. Beckham is a much better hitter than Getz and therefor would be a better leadoff hitter.

 

The pressure will be on Getz to maintain his job in the majors. Beckham is already knocking on the door. I'm guessing Getz will have two months to prove himself.

 

If Getz does prove himself and starts the season off strong- better for us. Once Beckham is ready- we could trade Getz for value... were still looking for a CF Kenny!

 

I'll tell you what, if Getz proves himself in the show, Beckham continues to impress at SS down in AA, and the motley crew of CF continues to confound us with misplays and poor ABs, there is a solution many here have suggested. The only concern will be the D of Alexei in CF.

[Bubba Philips]

I have not been sold on the play of any of our 2nd base candidates. The play at short whether played by Alexei, Beckham or others seemed to be better played.. I think that Alexei might be the best fielding second baseman. I haven't seen any attempts by Ozzie to play Beckham at second yet.

[Chisoxfn]

The best option might be Ramirez in CF, Getz at 2B, and Beckham at SS. I just don't know if Beckham is ready defensively and he obviously still is pretty inexperienced, but darn does he look good.

[Princess Dye]

The best option might be Ramirez in CF, Getz at 2B, and Beckham at SS. I just don't know if Beckham is ready defensively and he obviously still is pretty inexperienced, but darn does he look good.

 

I was of this mindset also. But AR's range and rocket arm are probably gonna take SS for years to come.

[Princess Dye]

does anyone here honestly think chris getz is a better option at 2B than beckham to start the season, and is a better (more capable) baseball player at this point in time?

 

It's possible to rush a guy along too fast too. I'm not saying Beckham has the mental makeup to get down on himself and what not.

 

But it could happen, it's still an unknown. I dont think Beckham is the last piece of the puzzle to a championship right now, so let him destroy at AA for awhile.

 

Then you get to finally see whats going on with a guy like Getz and either find a place for him for years up at the club, or see if he can be a tradeable asset.

[SkokieSox]

I'm not so sure we should be in a hurry to move Rameriz from SS. Between the two, I don't think we can say Beckham would fare better there.