iamshack Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Apr 3, 2009 -> 08:40 PM) IF you say Phillip Rivers you must include Cutler. RIght now, if you are starting an NFL franchise I believe the three guys people start with at the QB position are Jay Cutler, Phillip Rivers, Big Ben, Eli Manning, and Matt Ryan. I'd say that its probably in that exact order as well but that could be debated (i might flip flop Manning and Ryan). The next group of people would be Aaron Rodgers, Cassel, and Flacco). I didn't put Big Ben as high up because I don't think he's that good of a pure passer, although he has super bowl rings so you got to give him credit for that. Either way, Cutler is clearly in that group of potential franchise building guys. Yeah, Rivers was tough for me, but I put him in that category because he has proven he can win in the playoffs. I think Jay has more talent than Rivers, to be honest (and I definitely think he has more talent than Big Ben), but he might not have the intangibles those guys have... More than any other position in sports, intangibles are so important in a QB....Rivers has "it"....so does "Rothelisberger...that's why I put them in that group and not Cutler yet. I do NOT think Eli belongs there. He did win a Super Bowl. I do not think he will win another. Edited April 4, 2009 by iamshack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 You know Eli was pretty much flawless in the playoffs though right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxbrian Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 Tony Romo is not a franchise QB. Sorry. Cutler isn't there yet, but he's well on his way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 QUOTE (whitesoxbrian @ Apr 3, 2009 -> 11:59 PM) Tony Romo is not a franchise QB. Sorry. Cutler isn't there yet, but he's well on his way. Yes he is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 QUOTE (lostfan @ Apr 3, 2009 -> 09:48 PM) You know Eli was pretty much flawless in the playoffs though right? For one year, yes...let's see him be a bit more consistent, shall we? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T R U Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 QUOTE (rangercal @ Apr 3, 2009 -> 10:06 PM) Yes he is. Hes a franchise QB in the terms of someone who is without question going to man your team and there's really no one you are going to get that would unseat him. Hes never won a playoff game and is starting to turn into a celebrity QB. It depends where you draw the line on what defines a franchise QB. Cutler is sub .500 in his career and has never had a winning season, but many still consider him a franchise QB as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 QUOTE (T R U @ Apr 3, 2009 -> 11:31 PM) Cutler is sub .500 in his career and has never had a winning season, but many still consider him a franchise QB as well. You're right. He is top 10 and most consider him a lock for top 5 QB in the NFl for the next several years. But yes, wins and losses are still something that acan be tracked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamshack Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 QUOTE (RockRaines @ Apr 4, 2009 -> 02:01 AM) You're right. He is top 10 and most consider him a lock for top 5 QB in the NFl for the next several years. But yes, wins and losses are still something that acan be tracked. Agreed, but I think that one stat floating around is also fairly indicative of what kind of QB Jay Cutler is... When his defense gives up 21 points or less, he is 13 - 1 as a starter. As I said earlier in the thread, I think quite a few of his numbers will change when he isn't forced to throw 40 times a game, or that whomever has the ball last will win. Sometimes your defense just sucks... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RME JICO Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (iamshack @ Apr 4, 2009 -> 08:17 AM) Agreed, but I think that one stat floating around is also fairly indicative of what kind of QB Jay Cutler is... When his defense gives up 21 points or less, he is 13 - 1 as a starter. As I said earlier in the thread, I think quite a few of his numbers will change when he isn't forced to throw 40 times a game, or that whomever has the ball last will win. Sometimes your defense just sucks... Yeah and his leading rusher last year had only 343 rushing yards. In 2007 the leading rusher had 729 yards. Just think how much better he would be with a true running threat. Someone also made a good point about the value of the trade. If you considered Cutler the #1 pick (like if the Bears were going for Stafford), the picks we gave up would barely get us the 4th pick overall this year (based on the draft value charts). I know it is not a clean way to assess value, but looking from that perspective, the Bears did pretty good. Edited April 4, 2009 by RME JICO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Zelig Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 QUOTE (rangercal @ Apr 3, 2009 -> 11:06 PM) Yes he is. OMG, I'm having MBINAA flashbacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 I don't know about Eli, while I don't believe the Giants currently have any intentions of replacing him obviously, he is still pretty inconsistent and after two mediocre seasons might be gotten rid of. I see him as something of a Chad Pennington. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T R U Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 QUOTE (bmags @ Apr 4, 2009 -> 01:22 PM) I don't know about Eli, while I don't believe the Giants currently have any intentions of replacing him obviously, he is still pretty inconsistent and after two mediocre seasons might be gotten rid of. I see him as something of a Chad Pennington. Except Chad Pennington has a career QB rating of 90.6 and Eli has a rating of 76.1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 check this out http://www.pro-football-reference.com/lead...ngle_season.htm King Cutler is 17th for most passing yards in a single season. That's more than Favre ever had, and Peyton Manning has only one season with more yards than Cutler's 4,526. I know it's just one stat category, but DAMN. Is he really just 25? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 I know that people were saying that Cutler had 200 more attempts than Orton did, but besides being in a pass-happy offense, to get more attempts you also need to be converting first downs and moving the chains which Orton wasn't always the best at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeBatterz Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 It's a great move by the Bears and really has me excited about the upcoming season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipps Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 Now that the boner that I had from this trade has dwindled down I feel kinda worried about him now. This guy might wind up being the biggest asshole in the history. The dumb look on this guys face at the press conference when they are taking his picture is classic. He looked less than thrilled to be here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 QUOTE (shipps @ Apr 5, 2009 -> 09:50 AM) Now that the boner that I had from this trade has dwindled down I feel kinda worried about him now. This guy might wind up being the biggest asshole in the history. The dumb look on this guys face at the press conference when they are taking his picture is classic. He looked less than thrilled to be here. That dumb look has been permanently burned on his face. He just has a natural Jim Brewer stonerface Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipps Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 QUOTE (kyyle23 @ Apr 5, 2009 -> 09:52 AM) That dumb look has been permanently burned on his face. He just has a natural Jim Brewer stonerface I know, its just that you learn as a kid that when someone is taking your picture that you should smile. Even if its not a huge one. Just look at Alexei's smile in his official photo, now thats a f***ing smile for a photo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFan562004 Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 QUOTE (EvilJester99 @ Apr 3, 2009 -> 04:57 PM) http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4040009 How about Burress?? I hear he will only get probation for his legal issue. On the radio I've heard the direct opposite, basically the DA has said any plea has to include a minimum of jail, I've heard 5 months to a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 (edited) Is it me, or is the level of excitement generated by this move unprecedented in Chicago sports history? Not including championships (the Bulls 6 titles, the Bears '85 title, the White Sox '05 title), when has a single Chicago sports happening single-handedly transform the city? The only thing I can think of that exceeds this move in terms of excitement generated is when Jordan came back in '95. Then again, the whole world transformed when that happened. Edited April 5, 2009 by Jordan4life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Apr 5, 2009 -> 12:25 PM) Is it me, or is the level of excitement generated by this move unprecedented in Chicago sports history? Not including championships (the Bulls 6 titles, the Bears '85 title, the White Sox '05 title), when has a single Chicago sports happening single-handedly transform the city? The only thing I can think of that exceeds this move in terms of excitement generated is when Jordan came back in '95. Then again, the whole world transformed when that happened. It was pretty exciting when the Sox got Thome, when the Bulls got Rodman, and I am told when the Cubs got Nomar it was like this. The Bears going to the Superbowl was pretty crazy too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 QUOTE (kyyle23 @ Apr 5, 2009 -> 01:32 PM) It was pretty exciting when the Sox got Thome, when the Bulls got Rodman, and I am told when the Cubs got Nomar it was like this. The Bears going to the Superbowl was pretty crazy too This is bigger than all those combined to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeNukeEm Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 I think the excitement level is really attached to the possibilities that Cutler gives the Bears. Chicago doesn't know what a franchise QB looks like, and now that we have one it makes us believe everything about our team will become exponentially better. I think you'll expectations become a little bit more reasonable by the time the season starts, but right now people have to realize that Jay Cutler alone is not going to win us Superbowls. The Broncos didn't even make the playoffs last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 QUOTE (DukeNukeEm @ Apr 5, 2009 -> 01:37 PM) I think the excitement level is really attached to the possibilities that Cutler gives the Bears. Chicago doesn't know what a franchise QB looks like, and now that we have one it makes us believe everything about our team will become exponentially better. I think you'll expectations become a little bit more reasonable by the time the season starts, but right now people have to realize that Jay Cutler alone is not going to win us Superbowls. The Broncos didn't even make the playoffs last year. We would have with Cutler. I say Cutler would have been worth 2-3 more wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeNukeEm Posted April 5, 2009 Share Posted April 5, 2009 We would have with Cutler. I say Cutler would have been worth 2-3 more wins. We could've won the NFC with Cutler, I think he's going to make a big difference. But we gotta temper our expectations a bit, Cutler is not going to throw for 4500 yards with our current offense. Maybe in a season or two when the pieces begin to fall into place, but not right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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