Official 2009-2010 NFL Thread

[chw42]

Was it speed or just being in the right place at the right time? He had a huge hole to run through, and probably 99 pct of the running backs in the NFL score on that play.

 

Either one works because Forte hasn't gotten either one so far this year.

[witesoxfan]

Anybody see what happened to Eric Wood? That was f***in' nasty. I could barely watch the replay. And I don't consider myself the squeamish type at all.

 

http://www.rantrave.com/Rant/Eric-Wood-Inj...d-to-Watch.aspx

 

yeah, that's nasty. That's exactly what the Bills needed, another season ending injury, and this one to a first round pick, no less. I just hope he can recover completely.

[whitesoxbrian]

I could repost what I posted on TB, but instead, I'll just copy and paste.

 

As I'm sure you all know, I'm a huge Cutler fan.

 

However, he's starting to get on my bad side. Am I denying that the OL sucks? No. Am I denying that the run game isn't there? No. Am I denying that the defense giving up 24 points is good? No.

 

However, in the biggest game of the year, Cutler had to make some throws, and he didn't. He continually missed easy TD's (Hester, Olsen, Knox) and other throws as the game went along.

 

Again, his poor mechanics are...well...poor.

 

I'd do the trade 100 times out of 100. However, maybe this guy just isn't a winner. People make of his Pro Bowl season last year like he won a Super Bowl. Who cares if he made the Pro Bowl? If he were to go 8-8 this year and make the Pro Bowl but we miss the playoffs, are you going to be satisfied? Everyone likes to say he has no talent around him + the coaches suck, but despite having a great WR, a good WR, a great OL, and a great coach last year, he was QBing a team who went 8-8 (IIRC) and lost a 3 game lead in the last 3 weeks of the season.

[Balta1701]

John Elway, Brett Favre, and a fair number of other QB's didn't win when the team around them didn't have the parts. they won when the team around them was just as dominant as they were.

 

If Cutler is going to struggle and cost the Bears games...fine. This season's a wash. Now the Bears need to start filling holes around him. If you put him on a dominant team and he's costing them games, that's a different story.

[lostfan]

I got an idea, let's put together a package for a young Pro Bowl QB who hasn't entered his prime yet this coming offseason.

[CanOfCorn]

John Elway, Brett Favre, and a fair number of other QB's didn't win when the team around them didn't have the parts. they won when the team around them was just as dominant as they were.

 

If Cutler is going to struggle and cost the Bears games...fine. This season's a wash. Now the Bears need to start filling holes around him. If you put him on a dominant team and he's costing them games, that's a different story.

 

Stop making sense, just...stop it.

[Balta1701]

Stop making sense, just...stop it.

It could be worse. You could be a Bills fan.

[Balta1701]

I got an idea, let's put together a package for a young Pro Bowl QB who hasn't entered his prime yet this coming offseason.

If you put Cutler on the market this offseason, wouldn't you be able to score basically the same deal that the bears gave up for him? 2 firsts and, I dunno, Jason Campbell or someone at that level?

[lostfan]

If you put Cutler on the market this offseason, wouldn't you be able to score basically the same deal that the bears gave up for him? 2 firsts and, I dunno, Jason Campbell or someone at that level?

Probably. NFL scouts are smarter than NFL fans and won't be so myopic.

[Harry Chappas]

Has Jay Cutler ever had a winning season as a football QB?

 

Can somebody send me his record while residing in Santa Clause

 

 

Somebody mentioned this on the SCORE this morning and I found it interesting.

 

 

I like Jay and am giving him a pass but I think he is trying to get Olsen involved too much as I think Kellen Davis and Des Clark are better TE's.

[nitetrain8601]

Was last night Cutler's fault? Yes. At the same time, citing a team record as to why a QB stinks/overrated is not too smart.

[DBAHO]

You know, I remember saying this exact thing before the season. But then I was called stupid because I was told that the Bears never had a good QB so things would be different.

I guess Bears' fans thought that with the addition of Orlando Pace, and Chris Williams coming into his 2nd season, things would be better on the O-Line, hence the high expectations.

 

But it goes both ways IMO. Yes, the offensive line has been bad, but Cutler should be used to that by now, so he should escape the pocket more and make plays on the run as Shanahan used to have him do with the playaction back in Denver quite a bit.

 

But then I guess people are going to say well Ron Turner isn't letting him do that.

[lostfan]

Not so much that things would be BETTER on the O-line, but that they wouldn't be manifestly worse.

 

Cutler can't use play action in Chicago. You need a running game for that.

[whitesoxbrian]

John Elway, Brett Favre, and a fair number of other QB's didn't win when the team around them didn't have the parts. they won when the team around them was just as dominant as they were.

 

If Cutler is going to struggle and cost the Bears games...fine. This season's a wash. Now the Bears need to start filling holes around him. If you put him on a dominant team and he's costing them games, that's a different story.

Yeah, and if you put Trent Dilfer on a dominant team, he wins a Super Bowl. Last year, the Broncos had a pretty dominant team aside from the defense, and he went 8-8. Last year, the Bears had an average offense with a bad defense (not as bad as Denver's, but still bad) and they won 9 games.

 

Obviously, if you get on a team that's already dominant, he's going to win. But guys like Peyton Manning are doing it with an above average defense, 1 great WR and 2 young WR's. That's hardly dominant. Am I saying I expect Jay to be a Manning like QB? No. But if he's a franchise QB, he has to be able to carry the team at some points too.

 

Was last night Cutler's fault? Yes. At the same time, citing a team record as to why a QB stinks/overrated is not too smart.

I stated many reasons as to why, and that was one of them, not the only one.

Edited November 24, 2009 by whitesoxbrian

[nitetrain8601]

Yeah, and if you put Trent Dilfer on a dominant team, he wins a Super Bowl. Last year, the Broncos had a pretty dominant team aside from the defense, and he went 8-8. Last year, the Bears had an average offense with a bad defense (not as bad as Denver's, but still bad) and they won 9 games.

 

Obviously, if you get on a team that's already dominant, he's going to win. But guys like Peyton Manning are doing it with an above average defense, 1 great WR and 2 young WR's. That's hardly dominant. Am I saying I expect Jay to be a Manning like QB? No. But if he's a franchise QB, he has to be able to carry the team at some points too.

 

 

I stated many reasons as to why, and that was one of them, not the only one.

 

No offense, but that should never be a reason. I respect if you think he sucks or is overrated as I'm not even a Bears fan, but I disagree. I think he has too crap of a team around him.

[whitesoxbrian]

No offense, but that should never be a reason. I respect if you think he sucks or is overrated as I'm not even a Bears fan, but I disagree. I think he has too crap of a team around him.

But again, if this team is crap, then what do you call last year's Denver's team? Pretty good, right?

 

Yeah, and they won 8 games. Yippee.

[witesoxfan]

Yeah, and if you put Trent Dilfer on a dominant team, he wins a Super Bowl. Last year, the Broncos had a pretty dominant team aside from the defense, and he went 8-8. Last year, the Bears had an average offense with a bad defense (not as bad as Denver's, but still bad) and they won 9 games.

 

Trent Dilfer won a Super Bowl with one of the best defenses in the history of the game. That's beyond dominant.

 

And the Broncos didn't have anything close to a dominant team last year. Their Pyth W-L was 6-10. They scored 370 points, which was 16th (middle of the pack) in the NFL. They allowed 448 points, which was 30th (or 3rd worst) in the NFL. They didn't have anything close to a dominant team. Dominant teams don't go 8-8, and never flirt with 8-8. Dominant teams go 10-6 in a bad season.

 

Obviously, if you get on a team that's already dominant, he's going to win. But guys like Peyton Manning are doing it with an above average defense, 1 great WR and 2 young WR's. That's hardly dominant. Am I saying I expect Jay to be a Manning like QB? No. But if he's a franchise QB, he has to be able to carry the team at some points too.

 

I believe you also just described the 49ers from the 80s, the 49ers from the 90s, the Cowboys from the 90s, the Packers from the 90s, the Bills from the 90s, etc. The Bears don't have an above average defense, they don't have one great wide receiver (unless you think really highly of Devin Hester), and this year, they haven't had anything close to a consistent or respectable running game. The Bears are an awful team.

 

Jesus Christ was the son of God, and he could only turn water into wine - you can't expect Jay Cutler to turn s*** into a trophy.

[SoxAce]

 

Tee Hee.

Edited November 24, 2009 by SoxAce

[whitesoxbrian]

Trent Dilfer won a Super Bowl with one of the best defenses in the history of the game. That's beyond dominant.

 

And the Broncos didn't have anything close to a dominant team last year. Their Pyth W-L was 6-10. They scored 370 points, which was 16th (middle of the pack) in the NFL. They allowed 448 points, which was 30th (or 3rd worst) in the NFL. They didn't have anything close to a dominant team. Dominant teams don't go 8-8, and never flirt with 8-8. Dominant teams go 10-6 in a bad season.

 

 

 

I believe you also just described the 49ers from the 80s, the 49ers from the 90s, the Cowboys from the 90s, the Packers from the 90s, the Bills from the 90s, etc. The Bears don't have an above average defense, they don't have one great wide receiver (unless you think really highly of Devin Hester), and this year, they haven't had anything close to a consistent or respectable running game. The Bears are an awful team.

 

Jesus Christ was the son of God, and he could only turn water into wine - you can't expect Jay Cutler to turn s*** into a trophy.

I said Peyton Manning has an above average defense + 1 great WR.

[jenksycat]

I guess Bears' fans thought that with the addition of Orlando Pace, and Chris Williams coming into his 2nd season, things would be better on the O-Line, hence the high expectations.

 

But it goes both ways IMO. Yes, the offensive line has been bad, but Cutler should be used to that by now, so he should escape the pocket more and make plays on the run as Shanahan used to have him do with the playaction back in Denver quite a bit.

 

But then I guess people are going to say well Ron Turner isn't letting him do that.

 

What defense is biting on a play action with a RB who gets

 

Cutler is the absolute last (or 2nd to last next to Briggs) problem on this team. But far too many "fans" are too stupid/ignorant to realize that there is slightly more to the game than the QB. But by all means, lets keep blaming JC, boo him, run him out of town, etc etc and not worry about the high school level secondary and o-line we have, or the GM that makes the "deal" for JC and then doesn't spend another cent upgrading anything else on offense, or the coaches who insist on running the same 4 plays on shuffle to the point that every team knows whats coming. Love me some stupid bear fans.

 

Also, we should just start taking 2 knees or kicking the FG on first down in the redzone since we insist on wasting the first 2 plays of every series and then get pissed when JC has to force something. Good stuff

[Sonik22]

With the Bears season going down the drain I'm liking what I've seen out of the Titans and VY. I really wish VY was the starter from day 1 because the Titans would be in a lot better shape right now. I'd love to see them somehow find a way into the playoffs, but tough game against Indy next weekend.

[DBAHO]

What defense is biting on a play action with a RB who gets

 

Cutler is the absolute last (or 2nd to last next to Briggs) problem on this team. But far too many "fans" are too stupid/ignorant to realize that there is slightly more to the game than the QB. But by all means, lets keep blaming JC, boo him, run him out of town, etc etc and not worry about the high school level secondary and o-line we have, or the GM that makes the "deal" for JC and then doesn't spend another cent upgrading anything else on offense, or the coaches who insist on running the same 4 plays on shuffle to the point that every team knows whats coming. Love me some stupid bear fans.

 

Also, we should just start taking 2 knees or kicking the FG on first down in the redzone since we insist on wasting the first 2 plays of every series and then get pissed when JC has to force something. Good stuff

I only used play action as one example. Even if you don't fake the run, Cutler should be more active in the pocket to avoid the pressure if he can, and that's something they did in Denver a lot.

 

Aaron Rodgers has had it worse than Jay Cutler this season as far as offensive lines go IMO (and that's due to all of the multiple injuries the Packers Line has had compared to the Bears), and yet he has a QB rating above 100, albeit Ryan Grant is having an above average season with 4.4 yards a carry.

 

So yes, I do think JC deserves SOME of the blame, obviously not all of it, but he has had a disappointing season, and I'm sure he would probably agree. He's a gunslinger like Favre and Romo who likes to throw it into receivers that may be double covered because he think he can get it into those tight spots, and obviously it has backfired for the most part.

[jenksycat]

I only used play action as one example. Even if you don't fake the run, Cutler should be more active in the pocket to avoid the pressure if he can, and that's something they did in Denver a lot.

 

Aaron Rodgers has had it worse than Jay Cutler this season as far as offensive lines go IMO (and that's due to all of the multiple injuries the Packers Line has had compared to the Bears), and yet he has a QB rating above 100, albeit Ryan Grant is having an above average season with 4.4 yards a carry.

 

So yes, I do think JC deserves SOME of the blame, obviously not all of it, but he has had a disappointing season, and I'm sure he would probably agree. He's a gunslinger like Favre and Romo who likes to throw it into receivers that may be double covered because he think he can get it into those tight spots, and obviously it has backfired for the most part.

 

Donald Driver & Greg Jennings vs. Devin Hester & Johnny Knox. Not to mention that A-rodg gets sacked half the time because he holds the ball for 90 seconds. Cutler avoids plenty of rushes, exponentially more than any qb we've had the past several years, but he can't escape it every time.

 

I just don't get it really. One series, Cutler will march down the field 80 yards looking sick, then the next series we'll go 3 and out with a failed WR screen, a run up the middle, then a slant for 3 yards. Why can't we run the plays that march us 80 yards? Why does the coaching staff insist on shoving plays that haven't worked all year and will never work? Why do we call a WR screen that starts -2 yards when we need 8 for a first down? Why is it we run the same set of 3 plays every time in the red zone when we have 3 big and fast TE's?

[IlliniKrush]

What defense is biting on a play action with a RB who gets

 

Cutler is the absolute last (or 2nd to last next to Briggs) problem on this team. But far too many "fans" are too stupid/ignorant to realize that there is slightly more to the game than the QB. But by all means, lets keep blaming JC, boo him, run him out of town, etc etc and not worry about the high school level secondary and o-line we have, or the GM that makes the "deal" for JC and then doesn't spend another cent upgrading anything else on offense, or the coaches who insist on running the same 4 plays on shuffle to the point that every team knows whats coming. Love me some stupid bear fans.

 

Also, we should just start taking 2 knees or kicking the FG on first down in the redzone since we insist on wasting the first 2 plays of every series and then get pissed when JC has to force something. Good stuff

There's a lot of problems with this team, but I'm not sure Cutler is 2nd to last problem on this team this particular season. I'm a huge fan of the Cutler acquisition, hate the Orton dopes, and think it will work out, but it's about time to just face that fact that he is having a poor season.

 

I think he'll be better next year, regardless of what's going on around him. He'll make better decisions and have some better throws. A lot of guys have seasons like this thrown into their career, especially early.

 

But he's sucked this year, and you can't blame all of it on other factors or players. His performance in a vacuum is not what it could be. He is by no means the reason the Bears are 4-6. The team is not good all around him. No one should be saying that he's the sole reason.

 

All of the Cutler supporters are feeling the pressure to defend this guy to the ignorant masses, but it's hard to defend this particular season. Logic defends future seasons, however.

Edited November 24, 2009 by IlliniKrush

[WhiteSoxfan1986]

With the Bears season going down the drain I'm liking what I've seen out of the Titans and VY. I really wish VY was the starter from day 1 because the Titans would be in a lot better shape right now. I'd love to see them somehow find a way into the playoffs, but tough game against Indy next weekend.

 

I'm still not a fan of VY, never have been. The reason the Titans are winning is the fact that Chris Johnson is an absolute beast, VY is just along for the ride. We'll see how VY does if the Titans get down early and are forced to pass.