Official 2009-2010 NFL Thread

[hammerhead johnson]

Haha, mhizzle don't know his football too well.

 

And you do?

 

yeah

 

[MHizzle85]

So the Cowboys fan thinks Romo is as good as Rivers and the Steelers fan thinks Big Ben is better than Rivers, while the rest seemingly disagree... interesting eh?

Rivers had a better 08, Romo had a better 07...I'd say that Romo had a better 06 even if he only started 10 games opposed to Rivers's 16...

 

Tony Romo is better than Phillip Rivers. Not because I'm a Cowboys fan, but because the numbers prove it.

[hammerhead johnson]

Your logic is atrocious. You deserve to be chastised. Lucky for you that they're trying to turn this place into a utopian society.

 

Romo is damn good, but Rivers is on a different level. That should be pretty obvious to anyone that pays close attention to the NFL.

 

My advice is just to watch more games.

[Brian]

Rivers had a better 08, Romo had a better 07...I'd say that Romo had a better 06 even if he only started 10 games opposed to Rivers's 16...

 

Tony Romo is better than Phillip Rivers. Not because I'm a Cowboys fan, but because the numbers prove it.

 

I hate the Cowboys, and I would agree that Romo is better than Rivers. I don't need numbers. Just watching them play, I would take Romo over Rivers everytime.

[hammerhead johnson]

Brian - Rivers absolutely exploded last year. His game log is insane. 3-to-1 TD-to-INT ratio with a 65% completion percentage and a 105 QB rating.

 

Yeah, he had his worst regular season game of the year in Pittsburgh, but when they played the Steelers in the divisional round, here's the line that he finished with:

 

3 TDs

1 INT

308 Yards

60% Completion Percentage

105 QB Rating

 

^ All true to his regular season numbers w/ the exception of the completion percentage.

 

Romo is a 2-to-1 TD-to-INT ratio type if he's lucky (more like 1.75). That ain't the end-all-be-all, and his completion percentage is comparable to that of Rivers, but there's no way that these guys are on the same level. Rivers is approaching Manning and Brady - you can not say the same for Romo.

 

And like mhizzle said, the numbers tell the story. I don't know what numbers he was looking at , but yeah, if you know what to look for, Rivers is the obvious choice when trying to determine who is more valuable.

Edited August 26, 2009 by hammerhead johnson

[Palehosefan]

So the Cowboys fan thinks Romo is as good as Rivers and the Steelers fan thinks Big Ben is better than Rivers, while the rest seemingly disagree... interesting eh?

 

Rivers and Ben are pretty equal as QB's. Rivers had more weapons and put up fantastic numbers, but Ben did more with less and didn't have the Chargers OL or rushing attack. If the Steelers OL has a nice turn-around, then Rivers' and Ben's numbers should be pretty similar.

 

 

 

You can put Brady, Manning, McNabb, and Brees out in front. But the fight for the 5th position has a lot of contenders like Rivers, Romo, and Roethlisberger all around the same area. I would personally put Romo a notch behind Rivers and Roethlisberger, but if Romo can put up big numbers and put Dallas into the playoffs without TO, then he belongs in the same echelon.

 

Chargers fans and Fantasy owners would take Rivers, and Steelers fans would take Big Ben. Polling owners and GM's on this would be an interesting proposition.

 

 

[hammerhead johnson]

You can put Brady, Manning, McNabb, and Brees out in front.

 

There's no way that McNabb can compare to Rivers at this point. One would only need to look at their respective game logs.

 

I hesitate to diss Roethlisberger because he was so awesome in 2007, but his 2008 numbers are crap - a 1.1 TD-to-INT ratio with an 80 QB rating? Yikes. Nowhere near the same league.

 

Rivers is obviously progressing, and then some. I don't know what Roethlisberger is doing - he's too inconsistent from year to year.

[Palehosefan]

There's no way that McNabb can compare to Rivers at this point. One would only need to look at their respective game logs.

 

I hesitate to diss Roethlisberger because he was so awesome in 2007, but his 2008 numbers are crap - a 1.1 TD-to-INT ratio with an 80 QB rating? Yikes. Nowhere near the same league.

 

Rivers is obviously progressing, and then some. I don't know what Roethlisberger is doing - he's too inconsistent from year to year.

 

If Rivers puts up another similar season this year then he will rocket up the top 5 chart and pass guys like McNabb. But I like McNabb more than most, he puts up consistent numbers each year and makes some absolutely mediocre WR's put up decent numbers.

 

As for Ben, the Steelers OL has been putrid at worst, and average on it's best days since the departure of Alan Faneca and Jeff Hartings in 06. He takes a ridiculous beating every game and manages to put up numbers. In the old days up until 06, the Steelers obviously ran to set up the pass, but since the 05 superbowl the Steelers have passed to set up the run. Ben has the entire offense on his shoulders now.

 

I hold my breath waiting for the hit that is going to put him out for a while, you can't take 46, 47, and 46 sacks each year and remain healthy. Instead of fixing the obvious weakness at OL, the Steelers have ignored it and taken "luxury" picks the past few years in the draft. So now the Steelers have excess talent at RB, WR, and LB, but journeymen and mediocre LT's getting franchise tags protecting the franchise QB yet again.

[MHizzle85]

Your logic is atrocious. You deserve to be chastised. Lucky for you that they're trying to turn this place into a utopian society.

 

Romo is damn good, but Rivers is on a different level. That should be pretty obvious to anyone that pays close attention to the NFL.

 

My advice is just to watch more games.

Blah Blah Blah, If you're gonna "chastise" me then do it. If not, don't even bring it up. Thankfully, I'm so "lucky"

 

I watch enough NFL, thanks. Perhaps taking your own advice would be good.

 

Brian - Rivers absolutely exploded last year. His game log is insane. 3-to-1 TD-to-INT ratio with a 65% completion percentage and a 105 QB rating.

 

Yeah, he had his worst regular season game of the year in Pittsburgh, but when they played the Steelers in the divisional round, here's the line that he finished with:

 

3 TDs

1 INT

308 Yards

60% Completion Percentage

105 QB Rating

 

^ All true to his regular season numbers w/ the exception of the completion percentage.

 

Romo is a 2-to-1 TD-to-INT ratio type if he's lucky (more like 1.75). That ain't the end-all-be-all, and his completion percentage is comparable to that of Rivers, but there's no way that these guys are on the same level. Rivers is approaching Manning and Brady - you can not say the same for Romo.

 

And like mhizzle said, the numbers tell the story. I don't know what numbers he was looking at , but yeah, if you know what to look for, Rivers is the obvious choice when trying to determine who is more valuable.

Again, all you've confirmed is that Rivers had a good 2008 & now all of a sudden he's an elite QB? Get outta here. As for numbers, all you've given was a ratio for one season. (They're both 2-to-1 over their career.) With a better completion % & a better QB rating. So who's more valuable?

[hammerhead johnson]

I hear you, Palehose.

 

Again, all you've confirmed is that Rivers had a good 2008 & now all of a sudden he's an elite QB? Get outta here. As for numbers, all you've given was a ratio for one season. (They're both 2-to-1 over their career.) With a better completion % & a better QB rating. So who's more valuable?

 

His 2008 season wasn't just merely good. His performance was off the charts. He had a better season than Romo could ever hope to have.

 

I was waiting for that Rivers to show up. In 2007, he had 7 games with a 100+ rating, and 9 games with a sub-75 rating. A lot of people figured that it was only a matter of time before he'd put it all together, and god damn did he come with the thunder in '08.

 

Is anyone not expecting the same this year? Stop and consider that he was only 26 years old for the bulk of the 2008 season.

[T R U]

Rivers also only has one 30+ TD season as well & only thrown only 4,000 once...Oh, but he's better right?

Just because Rivers had a really good year last year, it doesn't all of a sudden shoot him up to top 5 in the league. Do it again, then we can talk.

 

That was Rivers THIRD year in the league, McNabb has been a starting QB for 10 years and Rivers has already surpassed McNabbs season highs in TDs, Yards, Comp%, and Rating. So yes, ide say hes a better QB than McNabb.

 

Rivers also had a really good year his first year starting as well, and his second year wasn't that bad either.

 

I already gave you the Romo argument, ide say they are even but if you still wanna give him the nod ide put Rivers at 4th then. Either way, hes top 5 for sure.

[rangercal]

I am going to defend Mhizzle here. I actually agree with his list 100%. BTW , Romo is hated on so much, I think it is to the point where is is now underrated. Unbelievable how much hate that guy gets. All I know is the Cowboys looked more lost without him, then the Patriots did without Brady.

[rangercal]

 

Haha, mhizzle don't know his football too well.

 

Add me to that list. His list is spot on.

Edited August 27, 2009 by rangercal

[whitesoxfan101]

no

 

You always seem to disagree with my posts. I give you credit though, you always come out, disagree, give no reasons why, and are wrong. So you're consistent. Take a look at the difference in wide receivers between Cutler and Rivers (especially last year), take off the Bears/Cutler beer goggles, and then try again.

Edited August 27, 2009 by whitesoxfan101

[rangercal]

You always seem to disagree with my posts. I give you credit though, you always come out, disagree, give no reasons why, and are wrong. So you're consistent. Take a look at the difference in wide receivers between Cutler and Rivers (especially last year), take off the Bears/Cutler beer goggles, and then try again.

 

I've been a Cutler fan a season before joining the bears (granted it was because Brady went down week 1, and I needed a replacement for my fantasy QB.) However, I watched most Bronco games because they were usually late games and I needed 10-15 pts to win my week. Not many players I can say I know much more about other than highlight reels, occasional prime time game watching and box score reading. Jay Cutler is one of the top 5 most talented QB's I have ever witnessed. He made his weapons.

 

 

Everybody talks about how important Wide Receivers are, well Tight Ends are vastly underated. They are the targets when you desperately need 7 yards to keep the chains moving. Remove Gates and Rivers becomes Eli.

 

LT,Sproles,Gates,Jackson,Chambers>> Marshall,Royal and anyone else you want to throw in there. It's not even close.

 

 

I think Billy Volek would agree.

Edited August 27, 2009 by rangercal

[T R U]

Add me to that list. His list is spot on.

 

Yeah, no it isn't.

 

Kurt Warner isn't better than Phil Rivers..

[rangercal]

Yeah, no it isn't.

 

Kurt Warner isn't better than Phil Rivers..

 

What has Rivers done that has him ranked so high? 2 great seasons and 1 ok season? Sorry, I think he still belongs in the same tier as Cutler and Romo. Warner's numbers the last 2 seasons look better than Rivers the last 2 seasons.

[witesoxfan]

BTW, without looking, I believe Phillip Rivers led the league in passer rating last year. That's a hell of a testament when his biggest targets are Antonio Gates (the best receiving TE in the game, but only averaged 11.7 yards per catch and only had 60 receptions), LdT, who is growing closer to Westbrook injury-proneness, Vincent Jackson, who is a good, but not great #1, Chris Chambers, who is older, though still solid, and Malcom Floyd, a 29 year old receiver this year, who was not drafted; they have virtually no one else. Yes, Rivers had a running game, but considering they threw the ball 50+ more times than they ran it, and LdT ran for 3.8 a carry...he didn't have a lot. Rivers became the offense last year, he took over, and led the league in passer rating and threw for 30 touchdowns.

 

For f*** sakes, Phillip Rivers might just be the most underrated QB in the league. The dude took the Patriots to a 1-score game in the AFC Championship when they won 16 games in the regular season ON A TORN ACL when LdT COULDN'T PLAY. And he had a pretty good game too. I'd say Phillip Rivers is one of the top 3 QBs I would like leading my team for the next 5 years, and that list still includes Peyton Manning, even if he is a bit older.

Edited August 27, 2009 by witesoxfan

[rangercal]

BTW, without looking, I believe Phillip Rivers led the league in passer rating last year. That's a hell of a testament when his biggest targets are Antonio Gates (the best receiving TE in the game, but only averaged 11.7 yards per catch and only had 60 receptions), LdT, who is growing closer to Westbrook injury-proneness, Vincent Jackson, who is a good, but not great #1, Chris Chambers, who is older, though still solid, and Malcom Floyd, a 29 year old receiver this year, who was not drafted; they have virtually no one else. Yes, Rivers had a running game, but considering they threw the ball 50+ more times than they ran it, and LdT ran for 3.8 a carry...he didn't have a lot. Rivers became the offense last year, he took over, and led the league in passer rating and threw for 30 touchdowns.

 

For f*** sakes, Phillip Rivers might just be the most underrated QB in the league. The dude took the Patriots to a 1-score game in the AFC Championship when they won 16 games in the regular season ON A TORN ACL when LdT COULDN'T PLAY. And he had a pretty good game too. I'd say Phillip Rivers is one of the top 3 QBs I would like leading my team for the next 5 years, and that list still includes Peyton Manning, even if he is a bit older.

 

How about Phillip Rivers accomplish more than Chad Pennington before we put him in the top 3. I still don't see him above the Romo/Cutler tier just yet.

[Kyyle23]

Favre causing a "schizm" in the Vikings lockerroom? Say it aint so

[hammerhead johnson]

Looking at three or four year splits is not gonna give you that good of an indication as to where Philip Rivers is at going into the 2009 season.

 

I'm looking at progression from year to year.

 

Rivers put up MVP stats last season, and I have no reason to believe that he won't be just as good this year (it would be hard to surpass the numbers that he put up in '08).

 

If this was the stock market, you'd take Rivers over Romo without even blinking.

[Steve9347]

Wow, just wow.

 

I can't believe the Rivers hate in here. He's easily the third-best QB in the league, and he might even be better than Brees. (Brees' numbers look good bc of the sheer volume of passes).

 

Rivers will be the best QB in this league by next season.

[SoxAce]

Wow, just wow.

 

I can't believe the Rivers hate in here.

 

I absolutely HATE Rivers.. hate the prick.. one of the biggest dicks/ego inflated assholes, in the game today. But you got to give credit where credit is due. He's a damn good quarterback.

[Steve9347]

hate the prick.. one of the biggest dicks

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SoxAce]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I guess I set myself up for that one huh? You know what I meant.