JPN366 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 ...trade Jermaine Dye to Atlanta for Jeff Francoeur and a pitching prospect. I know it sounds mad, but really think about it. Atlanta's looking to get more offensive production out of their outfielders, and they are also considering trading Francoeur. Yes, he's struggled, but he is barely 25. Maybe he needs a change of scenery or more motivation or pressure to produce. There's not much of either in Atlanta. If it didn't work out, then there wouldn't be any contract constraints with Francoeur. If it did, it would be like getting another Carlos Quentin. Plus, it would put the decision about Dye's 2010 option on the Braves. Discuss... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco72 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 QUOTE (JPN366 @ May 24, 2009 -> 10:36 AM) ...trade Jermaine Dye to Atlanta for Jeff Francoeur and a pitching prospect. I know it sounds mad, but really think about it. Atlanta's looking to get more offensive production out of their outfielders, and they are also considering trading Francoeur. Yes, he's struggled, but he is barely 25. Maybe he needs a change of scenery or more motivation or pressure to produce. There's not much of either in Atlanta. If it didn't work out, then there wouldn't be any contract constraints with Francoeur. If it did, it would be like getting another Carlos Quentin. Plus, it would put the decision about Dye's 2010 option on the Braves. Discuss... Interesting idea, but I'd vote no. One, I'm not ready to give up on 2009 yet. Two, Francouer just isn't that good. Not enough BA for the average power he's shown, and no OBP. He's played essentially four full seasons of major league games now. I'm not sure he's gonna improve. Three, I'd like the Sox to spend a little more time figuring out which of the Paulie/Dye/Thome group gives the Sox the best chance to win in 2010. Dye might be the winner of that competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That funky motion Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 How about for Matt Cain Brian Sabean has gone to market. The Giants G.M. is seeking a bat with Nick Johnson atop his list, according to Andrew Baggarly of the San Jose Mercury News. In a piece posted last night, Baggarly says Sabean is dangling Matt Cain to get a feel for his value on the open-market. "Because Cain is young, controllable and relatively cheap for two more seasons, it would require productive offensive players with similar service-time attributes to strike a deal," says Baggarly. Cain will make only $2.65MM this year and $4.25MM next, with a $6.25MM club option for 2011. Coming off a complete game victory yesterday, Cain is 5-1 with a 2.40 ERA despite an increased walk rate and decreased strikeout rate in 2009. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 (edited) Definitely don't mind Dye and Konerko hanging around for one more year. Would like to see Dye at $8-10 million instead of $12+ in this economy though. The ideal situation would be where Dye splits playing time in RF with a LH hitter (who that is, I have no idea, the closest we have in our system is probably Kroeger), spend about 30-40% of his time DHing, with Konerko and Brandon Allen getting the other AB's at DH. Konerko and Allen would also share 1B. Seems that Thome won't be appreciated around here until he's gone and we have to replace him. Using Flowers as a DH in 2010 isn't logical if you want him to continue improving as a catcher, and we're not sure whether Viciedo will end up at 3B, LF, RF, DH or 1B. Until his bat is ready, he needs to play a field position though, preferably 3B. It wouldn't be the worst idea in the world to start playing him at 1B occasionally...and maybe even in LF, although with Danks/Shelby/Gartrell/Cook, OF time is going to be pretty limited at BIRM. Then again, with all the money invested in him, if they REALLY wanted to try him in the OF, he would have to take precedence over any of those outfielders getting playing time...and, of course, he's not going to threaten Danks in CF, so Jordan will also get all the at-bats in the world leading off for that line-up we have down there. Edited May 24, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 (edited) Francouer is exactly the kind of hitter the White Sox are trying to avoid. Low OBP now his power is starting to wane. I read something Friday where he may be released if he doesn't pick it up soon. He's been that bad. Edited May 24, 2009 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPN366 Posted May 24, 2009 Author Share Posted May 24, 2009 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:12 AM) Francouer is exactly the kind of hitter the White Sox are trying to avoid. Low OBP now his power is starting to wane. I read something Friday where he may be released if he doesn't pick it up soon. He's been that bad. So, say if he does get outright released, should the White Sox sign him and send him to Charlotte? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (That funky motion @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:06 AM) How about for Matt Cain What offensive talent do we have to give up? Sure we could give them Fields or Nix, Pods, Wise, Betemit, etc., but none of those guys are going to comprise the kind of package that would get SF excited. Do they feel they're a JD or Konerko away from competing? Maybe, but then losing Cain would negate anything they gained offensively. Does SF realistically feel it can compete with the Dodgers this year? I don't think so. To make it work, you'd have to be willing to trade anyone/everyone in your minor league system practically besides Beckham and Danks...would rather have Cain (than Peavy), but he will be a more expensive acquisition in terms of talent because it's not as much of a salary dump as the Peavy deal. A more realistic trade would be to see what they would have to give up financially to get Zito out of there...and who would be willing to take him. This would be a lot like Thome/Rowand deal with the Phillies, maybe less talent would have to go in trade than Rowand, depending on the money SF was willing to subsidize. Edited May 24, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:12 AM) Francouer is exactly the kind of hitter the White Sox are trying to avoid. Low OBP now his power is starting to wane. I read something Friday where he may be released if he doesn't pick it up soon. He's been that bad. Who are they going to play in the OF with Francouer and Schafer struggling so badly? Blanco? I wonder how much they are rethinking letting Josh Anderson go for nothing. He's been a very valuable part-time player for the Tigers. Picking up Anderson and Edwin Jackson for almost nothing, two of the better moves any GM made in the last six months in our division. Probably Mike Jacobs in KC would rank up there too, even though his OBP will always be low. They hadn't had a reliable threat at 1B since Mike Sweeney was healthy, and he was about as good at that position as Frank Thomas over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 QUOTE (That funky motion @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:06 AM) How about for Matt Cain Sabean is stupid. I would never do Cain for Dye if I were the Giants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatScott82 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 Cain would be an awesome pick up. Unfortanatley we don't match up with them as far as needs go. I'm sure KW will look into this. . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:26 AM) Cain would be an awesome pick up. Unfortanatley we don't match up with them as far as needs go. I'm sure KW will look into this. . . Renteria, Ishikawa and E. Burris are the statistical weak points of that offense. Ironically, 3B/SS/2B is our situation of most depth, most uncertainty and most "flux" as well. Even if we chose to trade him, Getz isn't going to be the centerpiece of any kind of trade to get a Matt Cain. And we're not going to trade Beckham or Alexei. If I were the Giants, I would rather wait on Ishikawa than hoping Josh Fields could come through, although one of those "change of scenery" trades and going to the NL might actually help Josh Fields (or Brian Anderson eventually). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 why do people have such a crush on Cain? He's not that good in the NL let alone coming to the Cell... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 Because obviously Don Cooper could make him into a Cy Young award winner... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 QUOTE (Reddy @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:38 AM) why do people have such a crush on Cain? He's not that good in the NL let alone coming to the Cell... Because Cain is good...he just gets no run support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatScott82 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (Reddy @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:38 AM) why do people have such a crush on Cain? He's not that good in the NL let alone coming to the Cell... Because it seems as if he found it this year and he is really cheap. Of course I would much rather have a guy at like Peavy or Oswalt, but keeping Poreda and Richard and adding a much needed RHP to our rotation would be a huge positive. Cain's #s. Edited May 24, 2009 by GreatScott82 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 Matt Cain has been Mr. Lucky this year. As of last week, he was leading the majors by allowing a .470 OBP to the leadoff hitter each inning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWhiteSoxinNJ Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 Most crazy ideas should be left unposted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 QUOTE (JPN366 @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:18 AM) So, say if he does get outright released, should the White Sox sign him and send him to Charlotte? Yes. Anything to improve that Charlotte team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 QUOTE (Reddy @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:38 AM) why do people have such a crush on Cain? He's not that good in the NL let alone coming to the Cell... I don't mind him, but if you can get him for Dye, you do it. I wouldn't be focused on trying to get him though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (JPN366 @ May 24, 2009 -> 11:18 AM) So, say if he does get outright released, should the White Sox sign him and send him to Charlotte? yes, but he would sign a major league contract elsewhere Edited May 25, 2009 by witesoxfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderBolt Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 QUOTE (JPN366 @ May 24, 2009 -> 10:36 AM) ...trade Jermaine Dye to Atlanta for Jeff Francoeur and a pitching prospect. I know it sounds mad, but really think about it. Atlanta's looking to get more offensive production out of their outfielders, and they are also considering trading Francoeur. Yes, he's struggled, but he is barely 25. Maybe he needs a change of scenery or more motivation or pressure to produce. There's not much of either in Atlanta. If it didn't work out, then there wouldn't be any contract constraints with Francoeur. If it did, it would be like getting another Carlos Quentin. Plus, it would put the decision about Dye's 2010 option on the Braves. Discuss... Jeff Francouer is a bad baseball player. A really bad baseball player. He's prone to mistakes at the plate, and never learns from them. He's too stubborn to ever experience prolonged success at the Major League level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 24, 2009 -> 04:40 PM) Because obviously Don Cooper could make him into a Cy Young award winner... I've heard about that kind of stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 QUOTE (BearSox @ May 24, 2009 -> 05:14 PM) I don't mind him, but if you can get him for Dye, you do it. I wouldn't be focused on trying to get him though. Sorry, but this a crazy idea. You trade a HR hiting, RBI producer, high average player that also plays pretty good defense for a mediocre pitcher? No way. Once again we don't value our own players enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ May 25, 2009 -> 09:32 AM) Sorry, but this a crazy idea. You trade a HR hiting, RBI producer, high average player that also plays pretty good defense for a mediocre pitcher? No way. Once again we don't value our own players enough If the Sox are truly out of the pennant race and they can get a young, cheap, mediocre but talented pitcher who is under contract for several more years and incredibly affordable for a HR hitting, RBI producing OF with 0.75 years left on his contract (who also won't bring you draft pick compensation when he departs) and at the same time save like $5 million that can go towards next years team...that's a good move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted May 25, 2009 Share Posted May 25, 2009 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ May 25, 2009 -> 11:32 AM) Sorry, but this a crazy idea. You trade a HR hiting, RBI producer, high average player that also plays pretty good defense for a mediocre pitcher? No way. Once again we don't value our own players enough What Balta said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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