Dayan or Beckham at 3rd if Fields can't do it

[southsider2k5]

I disagree. Josh handles the breaking balls the best, and when he's behind in the count, he's gonna see a lot of breaking balls low and over the plate or away.

 

For instance, his hit today vs. Greinke was a curve low on a 1-2 count. That's a pitch he's always been able to handle. I don't get why pitchers don't challenge him up and in with fastball more often. If I was a pitcher, every time I got 2 strikes on him, I'd challenge with a fastball on the inner portion of the plate above the belt. He can't hit that pitch if it's over 90 mph.

 

As for not being able to hit the meatball right down the middle on 2-0, 2-1, 3-1, it's mainly because he's afraid to pull the trigger, IMO. Yes, his swing is long and he has slow bat speed which makes it a lot tougher. But the whole world knows a fastball is coming, but Fields doesn't pull the trigger until it's a mili-second to late and he fouls it away.

 

His long swing and slow bat speed come into play when he has 2 strikes on him. He's up there trying to protect, and when he gets that fastball, his very late and rarely makes contact if it's over 90 mph.

 

Normal hitters see a lot of breaking balls. Guys that can't hit a fastball, get a fastball. Fields gets lots of fastballs in breaking ball counts.

 

The guy has a breaking ball pace swing. I know you don't like the guy and all, so fear makes your point of view look better, but with as long as of a swing as he has, its obvious why he can't catch up to a major league fastball right now.

[everafan]

Anyone else want to eat crow and admit Ozzie was right about not putting too much pressure on Getz and Fields? Originally he had no intention of batting them 1 and 2, but acquiesced. They were hot to start but then regressed. They moved down in the lineup and now they are coming along.

[lostfan]

Anyone else want to eat crow and admit Ozzie was right about not putting too much pressure on Getz and Fields? Originally he had no intention of batting them 1 and 2, but acquiesced. They were hot to start but then regressed. They moved down in the lineup and now they are coming along.

Fields should never have been batting 2nd, that's about the worst possible spot for him to bat save for leadoff. Hell, he may as well have put Anderson there, that would be just as bad. Getz moving down had nothing to do with him folding under pressure, it was all about the other pitchers making adjustments and he wasn't producing, plus, Pods came back.

[ILMOU]

I wouldn't mind watching Alexei play 3B, I think he could handle it well

 

Lexi's handling SS very, very, well, thank you. Sure, he's had a few stinkers, and it was frustrating watching him lose that popup in the sun yesterday, but overall he looks pretty darn slick out there. When you have a guy who's succeeding defensively at the most important position, you don't move him.

 

If there's any legit concerns about GB, it would be with the fielding - 9 errors between AA and AAA in just over 40 games. He may well be better for us at 2B or 3B, long term. Right now, it's a competition between Fields, Getz, and perhaps Nix to hold their position on the team, and this competition might be helping to improve the play of each - not a bad thing.

 

[BearSox]

Normal hitters see a lot of breaking balls. Guys that can't hit a fastball, get a fastball. Fields gets lots of fastballs in breaking ball counts.

 

The guy has a breaking ball pace swing. I know you don't like the guy and all, so fear makes your point of view look better, but with as long as of a swing as he has, its obvious why he can't catch up to a major league fastball right now.

Fields is still getting breaking balls in breaking ball counts. There's no denying that. He's been getting more fastballs as the season progresses, but pitchers now a days are stupid. Look at the replays of all his hits from the past week. They've either been on low breaking balls or either a slow fastball that was below 90. He did however have that one hit to RF on a fastball away and another broken bat single on a fastball that jammed.

 

Also, it doesn't matter if you have the slowest swing in the world, if you know fastball is coming, and you are gearing up fastball, and you see that fastball coming out of the pitchers hand, you can hit if you don't hesitate. Fields has just a very tense stance, and when he sees that fastball coming, he's just a bit hesitant and that's the difference between driving it and fouling it away.

 

Also, don't start that BS with me, saying I'm gonna make stuff up to prove my point. I like Josh Fields, I've rooted for him since 05. However, I don't see a good ball player when I see him play. I call it how I see it.

[Kyyle23]

Also, don't start that BS with me, saying I'm gonna make stuff up to prove my point. I like Josh Fields, I've rooted for him since 05. However, I don't see a good ball player when I see him play. I call it how I see it.

 

 

Fields is still getting breaking balls in breaking ball counts. There's no denying that. He's been getting more fastballs as the season progresses, but pitchers now a days are stupid.

 

 

[BearSox]

What. Pitchers are stupid.

 

Actually, pitchers don't have much control over the game anymore. It actually be more like the catcher/bench coach are stupid.

[Kyyle23]

What. Pitchers are stupid.

 

Actually, pitchers don't have much control over the game anymore. It actually be more like the catcher/bench coach are stupid.

 

You always call players stupid when what is happening doesnt mesh with what you say. How do you back up your argument on Josh Fields inability to hit a fastball(which you call fear)? By calling the pitchers stupid, hmmm, thats not making anything up, thats just calling it how you see it, huh?

Edited June 1, 2009 by kyyle23

[BearSox]

You always call players stupid when what is happening doesnt mesh with what you say. How do you back up your argument on Josh Fields inability to hit a fastball(which you call fear)? By calling the pitchers stupid, hmmm, thats not making anything up, thats just calling it how you see it, huh?

I've been calling pitchers stupid for a long time now. I just didn't start. I've been saying this for however long I've been here, and the board I was on previous to this one. All the time we see completely idiotic pitch selection when the count is 0-2, 1-2, 2-2. We see it a lot with Pierzynski and our pitchers some times.

 

And if you read my post, there were two different points.

 

1.) Pitchers (or Catchers) are stupid, and instead of throwing breaking balls to Fields in breaking ball counts, they should be throwing fastballs in and above the belt. However, I have no problem if they keep throwing low breaking balls to fields in breaking ball counts because that's always been the pitch Fields can drive.

 

2.) The reason why Fields struggles with fastballs in fastball counts is because he doesn't pull the trigger fast enough. If you watch him, there is a slight hesitation in him, and that leads to a lot of 2-0, 2-1, 3-1 fastballs being fouled off instead of being driven.

 

I really don't see what you don't get about my points. Disagree, fine. But don't start BS and saying I make up s*** just to make my points look better. That's f***ing BS.

Edited June 1, 2009 by BearSox

[Kyyle23]

I've been calling pitchers stupid for a long time now. I just didn't start. I've been saying this for a longest time. All the time we see completely idiotic pitch selection when the count is 0-2, 1-2, 2-2. We see it a lot with Pierzynski and out pitchers some times.

 

And if you read my post, there were two different points.

 

1.) Pitchers (or Catchers) are stupid, and instead of throwing breaking balls to Fields in breaking ball counts, they should be throwing fastballs in and above the belt. However, I have no problem if they keep throwing low breaking balls to fields in breaking ball counts because that's always been the pitch Fields can drive.

 

2.) The reason why Fields struggles with fastballs in fastball counts is because he doesn't pull the trigger fast enough. If you watch him, there is a slight hesitation in him, and that leads to a lot of 2-0, 2-1, 3-1 fastballs being fouled off instead of being driven.

 

I really don't see what you don't get about my points. Disagree, fine. But don't start BS and saying I make up s*** just to make my points look better. That's f***ing BS.

 

 

Im sorry, is calling someone stupid some sort of statistical analysis now? Is this some sort of Bearsox PECOTA that I never noticed before? Is that a great way to make your point now? Just a blanket "(person) is stupid, and thats why Josh Fields is getting hits now" and that works for your theories?

 

I did notice you have been calling pitchers/players stupid for a while now, if you would read MY post, you would see that I said "You ALWAYS call people stupid...."

 

Its an opinion, something that you decided, not a fact that pitchers are stupid. Therefore, in your opinion, pitchers are stupid, which is something you made up.

 

So, yeah, BS. Pitchers ARENT stupid IN MY OPINION and most of them could probably run laps around you in the baseball knowledge department.

[lostfan]

Pitchers who give up runs are stupid, I thought that was obvious.

[Kalapse]

Anyone else want to eat crow and admit Ozzie was right about not putting too much pressure on Getz and Fields? Originally he had no intention of batting them 1 and 2, but acquiesced. They were hot to start but then regressed. They moved down in the lineup and now they are coming along.

Chris Getz should never have been forced to leadoff in the first place.

[bigruss]

Chris Getz should never have been forced to leadoff in the first place.

Same with Wise.

 

We just didn't have anybody to put there though, and we were hoping to get a Span like player in that spot with Getz. I see no fault with that move, if he struggled you move him down, but for awhile he really helped the team in that role.

[BearSox]

Im sorry, is calling someone stupid some sort of statistical analysis now? Is this some sort of Bearsox PECOTA that I never noticed before? Is that a great way to make your point now? Just a blanket "(person) is stupid, and thats why Josh Fields is getting hits now" and that works for your theories?

Fine, it's opinion. Isn't mostly everything in here opinion anyway? Josh Fields is good, Josh Fields is bad, it's all f***ing opinion.

 

And that's not true at all. If you've noticed, I've said for a long ass time that the breaking ball low is a pitch Fields could always handle. And it's because of pitchers stupidity to keep throwing it that allows him to get more hits. You shouldn't be throwing Fields anything but fastball up and in until he proves he can turn on one. Is that an opinion, yes. But is it wrong? You tell me.

 

I did notice you have been calling pitchers/players stupid for a while now, if you would read MY post, you would see that I said "You ALWAYS call people stupid...."

No, you said I always call people stupid if it doesn't match what my POV is. And that is complete f***ing bulls***. I call people stupid when I see stupidity.

 

Its an opinion, something that you decided, not a fact that pitchers are stupid. Therefore, in your opinion, pitchers are stupid, which is something you made up.

Yeah, it's an opinion, but it's not something I made up out of thin air one day. You might have a different opinion, good for you, but I would hope you made your opinion based on what you've seen and not what you want it to be.

 

So, yeah, BS. Pitchers ARENT stupid IN MY OPINION and most of them could probably run laps around you in the baseball knowledge department.

I would sure as hell hope so, because guess what, they are major league baseball players.

 

EDIT: ALso, I'm sorry if all of this doesn't make sense, but I'm in a rush right now.

Edited June 1, 2009 by BearSox

[Kalapse]

Same with Wise.

 

We just didn't have anybody to put there though, and we were hoping to get a Span like player in that spot with Getz. I see no fault with that move, if he struggled you move him down, but for awhile he really helped the team in that role.

There was a big problem with relying on Getz and Wise, you're praying to catch lightning in a bottle and leaving yourself with no good high OBP replacement when they fail. Sure you move them down in the order once they prove they're not up to the task but then you're just replacing them with another half-assed solution. Kenny Williams did a dreadful job addressing the situation this offseason, he went in to ST with hopes that one of the four bad/ill-prepared in-house candidates caught fire and made him look like a genius, unfortunately for him and the team this was not going to happen. Relying on the likes of Wise, Owens, Lillibridge and Getz to grab hold of the leadoff spot for a full year is just kind of sad for a team with a close to $100M payroll.

[lostfan]

There was a big problem with relying on Getz and Wise, you're praying to catch lightning in a bottle and leaving yourself with no good high OBP replacement when they fail. Sure you move them down in the order once they prove they're not up to the task but then you're just replacing them with another half-assed solution. Kenny Williams did a dreadful job addressing the situation this offseason, he went in to ST with hopes that one of the four bad/ill-prepared in-house candidates caught fire and made him look like a genius, unfortunately for him and the team this was not going to happen. Relying on the likes of Wise, Owens, Lillibridge and Getz to grab hold of the leadoff spot for a full year is just kind of sad for a team with a close to $100M payroll.

Even still, Getz was a far better option than either Wise, Lillibridge, or Owens. He should not have been there, but he was pigeonholed there. He doesn't lose points as a player in my eyes for hitting his wall when he did.

[Kalapse]

Even still, Getz was a far better option than either Wise, Lillibridge, or Owens. He should not have been there, but he was pigeonholed there. He doesn't lose points as a player in my eyes for hitting his wall when he did.

Agreed, no reason to look at him as any less of a player because he hit the rookie wall.

[NorthSideSox72]

Fields in last 8 games: 11-for-27 (.407), .448 OBP, 3 2B

 

Just sayin'.

 

[Kyyle23]

Fields in last 8 games: 11-for-27 (.407), .448 OBP, 3 2B

 

Just sayin'.

 

those numbers are stupid

[SoxAce]

those numbers are stupid

 

[bigruss]

There was a big problem with relying on Getz and Wise, you're praying to catch lightning in a bottle and leaving yourself with no good high OBP replacement when they fail. Sure you move them down in the order once they prove they're not up to the task but then you're just replacing them with another half-assed solution. Kenny Williams did a dreadful job addressing the situation this offseason, he went in to ST with hopes that one of the four bad/ill-prepared in-house candidates caught fire and made him look like a genius, unfortunately for him and the team this was not going to happen. Relying on the likes of Wise, Owens, Lillibridge and Getz to grab hold of the leadoff spot for a full year is just kind of sad for a team with a close to $100M payroll.

With the situation we were in I had no problem with Getz being the leadoff man. Yes, KW made a huge mistake leaving the leadoff position in such turmoil to begin the season and we have been fortunate to have Pods doing such a decent job so far. But how long will that last and you have to go back to a rookie or to a Wise? Hopefully Pods can keep it up but I dont see how he reasonably can (between performance and injuries, his past dictates he will be injured at some point or his performance will drop).

[ChiSox_Sonix]

those numbers are stupid

 

No, only the pitchers who threw 11 of those pitches

[southsider2k5]

Im sorry, is calling someone stupid some sort of statistical analysis now? Is this some sort of Bearsox PECOTA that I never noticed before? Is that a great way to make your point now? Just a blanket "(person) is stupid, and thats why Josh Fields is getting hits now" and that works for your theories?

 

I did notice you have been calling pitchers/players stupid for a while now, if you would read MY post, you would see that I said "You ALWAYS call people stupid...."

 

Its an opinion, something that you decided, not a fact that pitchers are stupid. Therefore, in your opinion, pitchers are stupid, which is something you made up.

 

So, yeah, BS. Pitchers ARENT stupid IN MY OPINION and most of them could probably run laps around you in the baseball knowledge department.

 

I am with you. I call BS on the BS, BS. Just imaging the emotions of a player to fit your percieved image of him is crap.

[caulfield12]

KW pretty much lucked out with how Pods has performed so well, SO FAR. He's been fortunate with Clayton Richard, too. Or fortunate Peavy turned down that trade offer, it was legit. (Why they didn't find out if Jake would approve a trade without them guaranteeing the option year or asking for a year-to-year opt-out clause before it went public is an interesting question).

 

The CF situation has only become murkier, although with the team playing so well, the short-term is obviously more important than one year from now.

 

Will BA ever get a chance to prove himself against all pitching? Or is the organization silently waiting on Jordan Danks? Or where we see a Danks/Anderson platoon (haven't yet looked at Jordan's splits, but the assumption is Ozzie would go in this direction) in 2010?

 

My position in the offseason was to go after Crisp, but he's been remarkably injury-prone. Taveras (maybe we could have gotten away with Josh Anderson, an Anderson Squared Platoon) and Edwin Jackson might have put this team over the top...and it would have taken two weapons away from the Tigers.

 

But KW still has something up his sleeve. If we can go 8-4 and 9-3 on this coming homestand, it would really put us right back into the thick of things in the division race and all the discussion about 2010 suddenly becomes more interesting in terms of what players (if any) you're willing to sacrifice for another AL Central Division crowd with a team that's at least 2 players away. Do you trade the likes of Poreda or Flowers in hopes of replacating the 2006 Cardinals or 1987 Twins?

Edited June 1, 2009 by caulfield12

[scenario]

Talking about stupid numbers... Beckham is 2-2 so far tonight (Monday)... 3 for 4 last night...

 

Making him 9 for 17 (.529) since getting promoted to Charlotte.

 

He's not waiting for someone on the Sox roster to screw up to get promoted. Looks like he might simply force Sox management's hand.

Edited June 1, 2009 by scenario