fathom Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Greg Walker is not very good at his job. 8 shutouts, with a handful of them coming at the Cell, is pathetic this early in the season. We've been quick to can people this year who aren't performing, and he should be next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitoMB345 Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 03:59 PM) Greg Walker is not very good at his job. 8 shutouts, with a handful of them coming at the Cell, is pathetic this early in the season. We've been quick to can people this year who aren't performing, and he should be next. But we all know he is not going anywhere. How long til he gets resigned to an extension (aka when is his contract up)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I blame the shutouts on injuries, and having guys like Lillibridge, Betemit, Miller, Ramirez at the beginning of the year, and Fields during his horrid stretch in the lineup. I imagine Walker will be fired at some point this year if this continues, though, since someone has to take the fall. I also wonder if it's the scouting contributing to this inability to hit pitchers they've never seen before, or if it's a player mindset, like "we can't win in the Metrodome"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (almagest @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 09:21 PM) I also wonder if it's the scouting contributing to this inability to hit pitchers they've never seen before, or if it's a player mindset, like "we can't win in the Metrodome"? I was going to make the comparison between hitting guys we've never seen before and winning in Minnesota. Both have become mental issues it seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almagest Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 04:23 PM) I was going to make the comparison between hitting guys we've never seen before and winning in Minnesota. Both have become mental issues it seems.I'm inclined to think it's a mental issue, since it's much harder to believe that the Sox scouts are simply unable to provide a decent report on opposing pitchers, and no changes have been made if this is the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 AJP vs. LHP,Fields, Wise, Beckham playing his first game, Nix. Those are your 5-9 hitters in today's game. It should surprise no one they had trouble scoring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (BobDylan @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 01:42 PM) 8 shutouts this early into the season doesn't merit a good discussion? If this isn't a topic that merits a discussion, please, point me to one that does. I imagine it's a pretty glorious topic. As soon as that discussion starts, let me know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 (edited) All 15,000+ season ticket holders could be against Greg Walker, and it wouldn't really matter. Realistically, what does one expect? Him to make lemons out of lemonade? This isn't the same team from last year. Quentin and Getz haven't been able to get into a consistent rhythm because they've been so injury-prone this season. Take away Carlos Quentin MVP 2008 and you'll get very inconsistent results. The struggles against LHP, rookies, journeymen, starters in their first outings against us, that goes back for at least a decade. Wise, Lillibridge, Owens, Corky Miller, etc., were getting significant at-bats and none of those guys should be utilized as anything but the last player off the bench. What hitting coach could get results from that group? Betemit couldn't field well at ANY infield position, so he became a liability and was strictly a salary dump for Uribe. Can we just get Uribe back and let Nix work on his hitting in Charlotte? That would be a much better idea. Betemit was perhaps our best hitter the 2nd half of ST, but he never was given consistent AB's, so how can Walker be blamed for that? Ramirez has seemingly come out of his slump, minus some of the power...but hopefully that will come. The core of the line-up (Thome, Dye, Konerko, AJ) has been just as good as or BETTER than expect (Konerko). Pods has been a pleasant surprise...considering it seemed like he was done 3 years ago. If there are any two players to be debated on this team (and Walker's affect/influence), it's Fields and Anderson, not coincidentally two former 1st rounders with wide-ranging takes on their ability to be regulars at this level. If we had a healthy CQ, and 2nd half 08 Alexei Ramirez and Gordon Beckham on this team and we were still getting shut out frequently, then you MIGHT be able to point a finger at Walker. Edited June 4, 2009 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Nix really needs to stop being all pull happy. Today, with Wise on second, he got an easy pitch to poke through the right side for an easy RBI single, and instead he tried to pull it and rolled over it for an easy ground ball out to the left side. Ramirez gets into that habbit much too often as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (BearSox @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 05:28 PM) Nix really needs to stop being all pull happy. Today, with Wise on second, he got an easy pitch to poke through the right side for an easy RBI single, and instead he tried to pull it and rolled over it for an easy ground ball out to the left side. Ramirez gets into that habbit much too often as well. That's what happens when you get 4 homers so quickly and are tricked into thinking you're a power hitter at USCF. Ramirez has been very good at hitting up the middle and to the right side since he's recovered... KW made egregious mistakes overestimating the ability of Lillibridge, Owens and Corky Miller, not to mention Wise and Betemit (1/5th of a roster). He's addressed that with Castro and Beckham, but any casual White Sox fan knew this team would struggle offensively because the talent just wasn't there. We can't just take discards like Nix, Miller and Lillibridge and just POOF, hope they can become regulars or even contributors in the AL when they failed in the much softer NL. We're incredibly lucky to be 4 games out of first place at this point in the season. Mortgaging the future with trades for McLouth when we're still 2-3 more players away would be silly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobDylan Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 05:24 PM) As soon as that discussion starts, let me know. Alright, Mr. Condescending Admin. I will let you know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (Soxfest @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 04:20 PM) Including today 28.57% of SOX losses have been shutouts! NO MORE EXCUSES SOX BRASS! How many times were they shutout in wins? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 05:34 PM) That's what happens when you get 4 homers so quickly and are tricked into thinking you're a power hitter at USCF. 3 of his 4 homers are on the road, i think its just the fact that he got the HRs quickly is messing him up, not the Cell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 It's hard to say about Nix. What we've seen is what was expected...good athlete, great defensive skills and strong arm, so-so bat. He started out so well, perhaps we expected a miracle, but the guy is a career .261 minor league hitter. And that was with almost 8 years of time to get it together offensively. I would think coming to the White Sox and seeing the power generated from the veterans...you could easily fall into bad habits and become pull happy. To me, it seemed like 85% of the time that this is exactly what Quentin was trying to do, with just a couple of balls laced into the RCF gap instead of rolled over to the left side of the infield. Then again, the opposite has happened with Anderson and Fields...and Ramirez is only on pace for 10-12 homers, although that should pick up through the summer months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Tizzle Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 QUOTE (BobDylan @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 05:55 PM) Alright, Mr. Condescending Admin. I will let you know. I think I've figured out Balta: Step 1: Generalized statement about a thread that suggests it's reactionary. Step 2: Questioning whether a thread meets his standards. These standards are not yet known, but I believe a catchy title is what ultimately draws him in. This thread fails in that regard. Step 3: Disappear into the political section to regroup his self esteem after a thorough verbal beat down. Step 4: Erase evidence of thorough verbal beat down ("it has nothing to do with the topic") Step 5: Make conscious effort to follow, on Soxtalk, those who dare take him on. You and I have been marked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 So, you're going to let this personal attack stay here and not delete it before Balta sees it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I've wanted Walker gone since 2006. Pull the plug. Enough is enough. Also do the White Sox have a minor league video program, or a minor league video coordinator? How do all these young starters continue to dominate us? It seems to be an organizational problem that has lingered for quite some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 QUOTE (CWSOX45 @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 09:32 PM) Also do the White Sox have a minor league video program, or a minor league video coordinator? How do all these young starters continue to dominate us? It seems to be an organizational problem that has lingered for quite some time. I've wondered this as well. Can it take that much work in the You Tube age to find videos of these guys for the hitters to watch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 05:27 PM) So, you're going to let this personal attack stay here and not delete it before Balta sees it? Frankly, on this one, I'm willing to take it. If they want to come after me for thinking that the immediate response to any and all bad series is "Fire Greg Walker!" regardless of anything, and I piss people off by ridiculing those threads, I'm so game. There's no analysis to saying "Fire the hitting coach!" any time something weird happens in someone's statistics. Does it suck we're getting shut out, yes. Why is it happening? The first-time seeing a starter thing is really getting obnoxious. I think we can all agree on that. That I actually accept as a trend. Why is our offense doing so poorly? It's not because we can't hit people the first time thorugh, it's because somehow, we're hitting .222 at home with a whopping .649 OPS. We're actually one of the better offenses in the league on the road. We're #7 in MLB and #6 in the AL in OPS on the road, and we haven't yet played in Yankee Stadium. We're # 9 in MLB and #6 in the AL in runs scored on the road. But at U.S. Cellular field...we are literally the worst offense in baseball by every single metric out there. We have scored 88 runs in 25 games at home this year. The Padres have scored 95. The Padres have a .669 OPS at home. U.S. Cellular field is behaving like Petco Park for the White Sox right now. Anyone got a good reason for that? And no, "Fire Greg Walker" is not a very intelligent response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 08:46 PM) But at U.S. Cellular field...we are literally the worst offense in baseball by every single metric out there. We have scored 88 runs in 25 games at home this year. The Padres have scored 95. The Padres have a .669 OPS at home. U.S. Cellular field is behaving like Petco Park for the White Sox right now. Anyone got a good reason for that? And no, "Fire Greg Walker" is not a very intelligent response. IIRC we were pretty damn good at home last year, and a .500 team on the road. Remember how a lot of teams last year were dominant at home and pretty bad on the road, seemed like there is pattern.. No, I don't have any proof on hand or any reason to explain why we are so bad at home this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clyons Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I have a hard time accepting that its a purely mental thing: too many different professional hitters have been befuddled too long by too many different pitchers, regardless of skill, style or stuff. It has to be poor scouting and/or pre-game preparation; i.e., sending hitters up there without an idea as to what to expect, or a plan to attack it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Each hitter should have a laptop and White Sox scouting should email them DVD video of probable upcoming starting pitchers. Then Walker should hold a meeting prior to batting practice where he goes over the plan of attack. Does anyone know if he does anything but suggest hitting styles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I heard today that the 1993 White Sox with Frank Thomas, Robin Ventura, Tim Raines...........had been shutout 7 times at the same stage. Only one less time than the current group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 07:10 PM) I heard today that the 1993 White Sox with Frank Thomas, Robin Ventura, Tim Raines...........had been shutout 7 times at the same stage. Only one less time than the current group. Greg Walker had retired 3 years earlier. That must have been his fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitoMB345 Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 4, 2009 -> 09:11 PM) Greg Walker had retired 3 years earlier. That must have been his fault. So if the hitting coach has nothing to do with the team's hitting.. please, explain to me why the job exists? s***s and giggles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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