Aaron Poreda called up

[spiderman]

Why would a team desperate for hitters trade its hitters? Unless you want to set the franchise back to the days after the strike, you better try to win.

 

You're framing my question though from the perspective that the proper thing to do is make trades to improve the current team.

 

Unless we're going to gut the minor league system, for a chance to win a bad division, how long are you willing to give this team before you would agree that this team isn't going win?

[VAfan]

For all the guys posting that you want a "firesale," who do you expect to put out there in place of the guys you are dumping? Or do you just want to see the Sox drop to last place and stay there for a couple of years while we "rebuild"?

 

Jermaine Dye. I don't want him moved. I'd want to extend his contract for another 2 years instead of the 1 year option we have now. The guy is still the most consistent hitter on the team, and the only one who has fully kept his HR stroke. (Thome and Konerko are dropping off. And Quentin is also in a bit of a funk, though I expect him to rebound.) I think Dye will not hold down RF if we got a legitimate replacement, instead moving to DH, but his bat is still valuable for a team that can't hit. We have absolutely no one on our team or in our system right now who can replace Jermaine Dye in RF this year or next year. And you can't expect some team to send us a younger version of Dye in trade. You get prospects. Maybe players. Who will take 2 or more years until they can even come close to replacing Dye's production.

 

Jenks. Why would you want to move Big Bobby? The guy is still extremely solid as a closer. Plus, he's tied to us for a few more years before he can be a free agent. If you take Bobby out of the back end and put Thornton there, then who's covering Thornton's job? Instead of 4 really solid relievers -- Dotel, Linebrink, Thornton, Jenks -- you start thinning out and then you get overworked guys who aren't as sharp. Jenks is not costing us much. Why move him?

 

Dotel. I could see trading Dotel because he is probably going to be gone next year by someone who will outbid us for him. I could also see offering him arbitration and taking the draft picks. I could also see extending his deal for another 2 years. He doesn't look like he's losing his fastball, and he's a reliable part of an excellent bullpen. Don't underestimate his value to keeping this pen together.

 

Linebrink. He's signed for a bargain price. I can't see moving him.

 

Thome. Frankly, unless the Sox make some moves for young sluggers, I'm not sure Jimmy is going to be gone next year either. I know he's going to want to keep hitting HRs. And I know he likes the Sox. Plus, we have no lefty power other than him. If we had a Nate McLouth, who could take Dye's place in RF and provide lefty power, you could move Dye to DH and let Jimmy go. But we didn't make that trade. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Sox keep Thome for another year. He's the second most productive hitter on the team. I'd be happy to move on if we had some better alternative, but no rookie is going to fill his shoes, and I'm not eager to weaken our hitting even more.

 

Konerko. I would move Paulie if we had an offer, but I expect with his no-trade status we're just going to keep him through next year when his contract is up.

 

*************

The guys who need to be moved are the younger players who aren't really major league caliber. Wise, of course. But also Getz and probably Fields. Anderson has value as a LIDP, and always will. Fix those slots before you start talking about "firesale."

[TitoMB345]

Not a fan of this move at all. Another starter being wasted away in the bullpen.

 

Maybe we'll use a 7-man rotation?

Edited June 9, 2009 by TitoMB345

[Chet Lemon]

It did work for:

 

Buehrle

Garland

McCarthy

 

And even McCarthy is debatable b/c I remember him performing better as a starter before they moved him to the pen in '06.

[Dick Allen]

You're framing my question though from the perspective that the proper thing to do is make trades to improve the current team.

 

Unless we're going to gut the minor league system, for a chance to win a bad division, how long are you willing to give this team before you would agree that this team isn't going win?

Dye, Thome, Contreras and Dotel have expiring contracts. The youth movement will start soon enough. Detroit is in first place. The Sox should have swept them yesterday as awful as they played the first game. There is no reason to give up on this season. The division is woefully weak. If Quentin can get healthy, and maybe an astute addition or two, there's no reason to think they can't win it. Teams don't give up top prospects for 3 months of play anymore, unless you are a guaranteed difference maker, and the Sox aren't loaded with those. If it looked like a couple of teams in the division were really stacked, I could understand the Sox going under some sort of re-build, but this division is and will be terrible unless teams add players. There is no team in better position to add better players the next couple years than the White Sox.

[JPN366]

My guess is Ozzie doesn't want to play the kids and wants to keep Wise and Kenny said the kids are going to play and Wise is gone. Also from a marketing standpoint saying the team is horses**** isn't likely to put butts in the seats.

 

I don't understand why anybody would be stumping for Wise. No offense, but everybody here realizes that he's just a AAAA type of player and he didn't all of the sudden do anything last year in Charlotte that he didn't do with other AAA teams in the years before. I don't wish him any ill will, but he's not a long term 25 man roster guy. Maybe a week or two, but not for weeks or months or seasons at a time. I am partial to David Cook in all honesty, but I think he could provide more for the big club than Dewayne Wise. I think a lot of people would agree. Hell, Michael Restovich would be more productive. Ozzie and Wise must be in love. Photoshop anyone? Brokeback Ozzie/Weezy? That's the only thing that justifies the situation.

Edited June 9, 2009 by JPN366

[Balta1701]

Why would the Sox release Colon?

Because they want to use the roster spot for someone younger that could benefit from big league experience, and because someone would probably claim him off of waivers.

[spiderman]

Dye, Thome, Contreras and Dotel have expiring contracts. The youth movement will start soon enough. Detroit is in first place. The Sox should have swept them yesterday as awful as they played the first game. There is no reason to give up on this season. The division is woefully weak. If Quentin can get healthy, and maybe an astute addition or two, there's no reason to think they can't win it. Teams don't give up top prospects for 3 months of play anymore, unless you are a guaranteed difference maker, and the Sox aren't loaded with those. If it looked like a couple of teams in the division were really stacked, I could understand the Sox going under some sort of re-build, but this division is and will be terrible unless teams add players. There is no team in better position to add better players the next couple years than the White Sox.

 

I think it's too early too decide for certain which way the Sox should go. The more and more I watch from this team though tells me that this team just isn't more than average, and that may be somewhat kind. I'm willing to wait a bit longer though, and hope they prove me wrong.

 

Come July though, should this team continue to play sub .500 baseball, I do start to look at next season, specifically for anyone who I don't think will be part of next year's team.

 

I don't think we're going to get any 5 star minor leaguers for Dye, Thome, etc, but if we are going to move on without them, I'm not adverse to acquiring a decent prospect or two.

 

Again, though, this is all based on the team not improviing it's play. The Sox are lucky to be in this division, but soon enough, they have to begin to make their own luck.

[whitesoxbrian]

They can't. No one is going to want Colon and Contreras could have been had for nothing a month ago.

Colon has been a surprise, if you ask me. If you would have told me his ERA would be where it is now (this low), I would have taken it and so would everyone here. Ask 100 people what they thought his ERA would be before the year, and I'm guessing 80 of them would have said 5 or higher.

 

Anyways, welcome to the bigs, Aaron.

Edited June 9, 2009 by whitesoxbrian

[soxfan3530]

Colon has been a surprise, if you ask me. If you would have told me his ERA would be where it is now (this low), I would have taken it and so would everyone here. Ask 100 people what they thought his ERA would be before the year, and I'm guessing 80 of them would have said 5 or higher.

 

Anyways, welcome to the bigs, Aaron.

His ERA is very very very misleading. He has a few errors in games, then proceeded to give up a million runs. Last outing and the 20-1 debacle come to mind.

[Pants Rowland]

Yeah a greek Jew.

 

Per the ever-reliable Wikipedia...

 

Youkilis is the son of a Jewish jewelry wholesaler of Romanian heritage.

 

I used to think he was Greek as well, but the spelling of his last name goes against preferred spellings of Greek surnames. It looked like he could be Lithuanian, a la another Greek-sounding non-Greek, Alex Sinelius (In loving memory of Ursula).

 

There once was a thriving Greek Jewish population in the north of Greece, I believe in Salonika/Thessaloniki but the Nazis did a number on them.

 

There was also a big Jewish/Greek-Jewish community in Smyra/Izmir in Turkey but they were pretty much wiped out by the Turkish troops during the war with Greece in the 1920s. If anyone has read Middlesex, there is reference to it in there.

 

 

[thedoctor]

the indians radio guys were talking a lot about colon during the game this past sunday. they said that in their pre-game talks with white sox officials the team was concerned that colon was throwing almost exclusively fastballs and was not really willing to go to any other pitches. they thought he was trying to change from a power guy into someone who relied almost exclusively on location and movement. that's an awful big transition for a guy to make. it can be done, but it's just difficult.

 

 

[jordans323]

I presume the rotation will involve this list of characters: Buehrle, Floyd, Danks, Contreras, Poreda.

 

 

I could be very happy with that list of characters....if Jose pitches as he did last night

[shipps]

I could be very happy with that list of characters....if Jose pitches as he did last night

 

Welcome to soxtalk brother.

 

Stay around long enough to not be happy anymore.

[JPN366]

If anyone has read Middlesex, there is reference to it in there.

 

I have it, haven't read it though. Is it good?

[RockRaines]

I dont understand how people can be packing it in for the season when we are 5 games out. If we are still this far out going into the last week of the season I will still have hope we make the playoffs. Once you are in, anything can happen as evidenced by the Cards a few years ago.

[thedoctor]

I dont understand how people can be packing it in for the season when we are 5 games out. If we are still this far out going into the last week of the season I will still have hope we make the playoffs. Once you are in, anything can happen as evidenced by the Cards a few years ago.

 

i'm never ready to pack it in this early and frankly i'm not sure how well a pronounced firesale would go over with the fanbase, particularly when the team is not far out, playing without tcq, and has mostly not hit when many people think they will.

 

that said, i did not think this team was a legit series contender from the outset. i felt like some guys who's years powered us last season (floyd, danks, tcq to be specific) would come back to earth a bit as the league adjusted to them. it was also difficult for me to see so many uncertain questions (fields, getz, contreras/colon, centerfield/lead-off) being answered as resoundingly positive as they were last year.

 

so although i don't advocate unloading at this point i have a difficult time envisioning a scenario where this team all of a sudden becomes able to play great defense and execute offensively when the home runs aren't there. without those, even divisional title hopes are a pipe dream, imo.

[Pants Rowland]

I have it, haven't read it though. Is it good?

 

I really enjoyed it. It is interesting how the main character takes on the role of the storyteller/muse like in traditional Greek mythology. Pretty entertaining, though.

[SoIL]

For all the guys posting that you want a "firesale," who do you expect to put out there in place of the guys you are dumping? Or do you just want to see the Sox drop to last place and stay there for a couple of years while we "rebuild"?

 

Jermaine Dye. I don't want him moved. I'd want to extend his contract for another 2 years instead of the 1 year option we have now. The guy is still the most consistent hitter on the team, and the only one who has fully kept his HR stroke. (Thome and Konerko are dropping off. And Quentin is also in a bit of a funk, though I expect him to rebound.) I think Dye will not hold down RF if we got a legitimate replacement, instead moving to DH, but his bat is still valuable for a team that can't hit. We have absolutely no one on our team or in our system right now who can replace Jermaine Dye in RF this year or next year. And you can't expect some team to send us a younger version of Dye in trade. You get prospects. Maybe players. Who will take 2 or more years until they can even come close to replacing Dye's production.

 

Jenks. Why would you want to move Big Bobby? The guy is still extremely solid as a closer. Plus, he's tied to us for a few more years before he can be a free agent. If you take Bobby out of the back end and put Thornton there, then who's covering Thornton's job? Instead of 4 really solid relievers -- Dotel, Linebrink, Thornton, Jenks -- you start thinning out and then you get overworked guys who aren't as sharp. Jenks is not costing us much. Why move him?

 

Dotel. I could see trading Dotel because he is probably going to be gone next year by someone who will outbid us for him. I could also see offering him arbitration and taking the draft picks. I could also see extending his deal for another 2 years. He doesn't look like he's losing his fastball, and he's a reliable part of an excellent bullpen. Don't underestimate his value to keeping this pen together.

 

Linebrink. He's signed for a bargain price. I can't see moving him.

 

Thome. Frankly, unless the Sox make some moves for young sluggers, I'm not sure Jimmy is going to be gone next year either. I know he's going to want to keep hitting HRs. And I know he likes the Sox. Plus, we have no lefty power other than him. If we had a Nate McLouth, who could take Dye's place in RF and provide lefty power, you could move Dye to DH and let Jimmy go. But we didn't make that trade. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Sox keep Thome for another year. He's the second most productive hitter on the team. I'd be happy to move on if we had some better alternative, but no rookie is going to fill his shoes, and I'm not eager to weaken our hitting even more.

 

Konerko. I would move Paulie if we had an offer, but I expect with his no-trade status we're just going to keep him through next year when his contract is up.

 

*************

The guys who need to be moved are the younger players who aren't really major league caliber. Wise, of course. But also Getz and probably Fields. Anderson has value as a LIDP, and always will. Fix those slots before you start talking about "firesale."

 

Good post! I don't understand the trade Jenks mentality at all and why screw with a solid bullpen by moving Linebrink, Thorton or Dotel? I would hold on to Getz for a while though, he may turn out to be a very reliable player. I don't want to give up on Anderson yet. Feilds, who knows?

[chw42]

I presume the rotation will involve this list of characters: Buehrle, Floyd, Danks, Contreras, Poreda.

4 left handers...what have we turned into?

[BigSqwert]

If anyone has read Middlesex, there is reference to it in there.

Tedious but good read.

[WHarris1]

4 left handers...what have we turned into?

I think thats 3?

[danman31]

I think thats 3?

It is.

[JPN366]

I really enjoyed it. It is interesting how the main character takes on the role of the storyteller/muse like in traditional Greek mythology. Pretty entertaining, though.

 

Speaking of Jeffrey Eugenides, have you or anybody read The Virgin Suicides? It's better than the movie, even though that's not all that bad.

[RockRaines]

Speaking of Jeffrey Eugenides, have you or anybody read The Virgin Suicides? It's better than the movie, even though that's not all that bad.

That movie was Coppola's coming out party. (Sophia)