Bill O'Reilly called George Tiller "a baby killer" witho

[spiderman]

From politifact.com

 

Bill O'Reilly called George Tiller "a baby killer" without attribution

 

Liberals are criticizing conservative talk show host Bill O'Reilly for his harsh comments about Dr. George Tiller, who was shot to death

while attending church on May 31, 2009, in Wichita, Kan.

 

Their argument is that O'Reilly repeatedly named Tiller as a late-term abortion provider and called him a "baby killer." That publicity

contributed to Tiller's death, they say. Antiabortion activist Scott Roeder, 51, has been charged with Tiller's murder.

 

To be clear, we haven't found anyone saying that Roeder watched O'Reilly's show or was influenced by him directly. And we aren't attempting to check any claims or suggestions that O'Reilly's words incited violence.

 

O'Reilly responded to his critics in an opinion article posted on BillOReilly.com and in the conservative journal Human Events . He began by saying that Tiller "did not deserve his fate" and was "an American citizen entitled to protection."

 

"No matter what you think about abortion, it is a sad day for the country when vigilantism takes a life," O'Reilly wrote.

 

O'Reilly said that liberal groups were targeting him unfairly.

 

"Even though I reported on the doctor honestly, the loons asserted that my analysis of him was 'hateful,'" O'Reilly wrote. "Chief of among the complaints was the doctor's nickname, 'Tiller the baby killer.' Some prolifers branded him with that, and I reported it. So did hundreds of other news sources."

 

O'Reilly went on to criticize media outlets for glorifying Tiller in order to silence those who oppose abortion, especially late-term abortion.

 

We wanted to see what O'Reilly had said about Tiller, to see if O'Reilly was indeed being criticized for his reporting on other groups' characterization of Tiller as he said.

 

We searched transcripts of The O'Reilly Factor , his show that appears on the Fox News Channel.

 

We found at least 42 instances of O'Reilly mentioning Tiller by name, going back to 2005. In 24 instances, we found that O'Reilly referred to Tiller specifically as a "baby killer."

 

Most of the time, O'Reilly would simply refer to the Tiller as "Tiller the baby killer" or as "Dr. George Tiller, known as Tiller the baby killer" without attributing it to anyone. We found four times when O'Reilly said that "some" called him Tiller the baby killer. We did not find any instance where O'Reilly named an individual or a

particular antiabortion group that referred to Tiller that way.

 

Here is how O'Reilly has discussed Tiller in 2009, prior to Tiller's death:

 

• May 15: O'Reilly discussed President Barack Obama's commencement speech at Notre Dame University, saying he was troubled that a Catholic school would allow Obama to speak. "Barack Obama throughout his political career has enabled abortion. There's no doubt that he has. All right? He has recently appointed Gov. (Kathleen) Sebelius to (Secretary of) Health and Human Services. Gov. Sebelius is the most proabortion governor in the United States. Based upon Dr. Tiller, the baby killer in her state and all of that, all right."

 

• May 11: O'Reilly wondered whom Obama would nominate to the Supreme Court, saying that he thought Obama was "callous" when it came to abortion. "I mean, the guy puts Sebelius in as the health — you can't get a more fanatically — and that woman is proabortion," O'Reilly said. "She wants the babies done for. She supported Tiller the Baby Killer out there. So, enough with her."

 

• April 27: O'Reilly discussed Sebelius' nomination as secretary of Health and Human Services. O'Reilly said that Sebelius "recently vetoed a bill that placed restrictions on late-term abortions in Kansas. The bill was introduced because of the notorious Tiller the Baby Killer case, where Dr. George Tiller destroys fetuses for just about any reason right up until the birth date for $5,000. There's no question Ms. Sebelius is one of the most proabortion politicians in

America."

 

• March 27: Tiller was charged with misdemeanor offenses for violating Kansas law on late-term abortions. Tiller was acquitted. O'Reilly said, "Now, we have bad news to report that Tiller the baby killer out in Kansas, acquitted. Acquitted today of murdering babies. I wasn't in the courtroom. I didn't sit on the jury. But this, there's got to be a special place in hell for this guy."

 

• March 26: O'Reilly talked about the ongoing trial: "Another revolting situation is Dr. George Tiller in Kansas, known as Tiller the Baby Killer, who's on trial for killing babies who are about to be born, late-term abortions." O'Reilly also said, "If you want to kill a baby, you hire Tiller, you've got to pay him 5,000 up front, and he'll kill the baby. ... You should know, his best friend is the governor of Kansas, Sebelius. ... She has taken specific steps to carve out the law so that it will protect Tiller the baby killer."

 

• March 17: Still on the Tiller trial, O'Reilly said, "You know this George Tiller, called Tiller the baby killer, is charged with 19 misdemeanors. And what this guy does, and we have proven it beyond a reasonable doubt, Kelly, is that he kills babies in late term. He aborts them in late term. They're no longer fetuses. They're viable babies. He aborts them for any and all reasons if you pay him $5,000."

 

• March 2: O'Reilly said Sebelius took "campaign money from George Tiller, known as Tiller, the baby killer. He's currently charged with a variety of crimes centering on his abortion practice. He aborts babies at any time for just about any reason if you pay him $5,000."

 

• Jan. 26: O'Reilly discussed an executive order Obama signed allowing federal money to go to international family planning groups that provide abortions. O'Reilly complained that Obama quietly signed the order rather than publicizing it. "I wanted George Tiller the baby killer going, 'Yeah, can I make more money killing babies now,'" O'Reilly said.

 

That's just from 2009. There were many other examples in previous years.

 

These instances and others we reviewed clearly show that O'Reilly was not reporting the views of others, but was expressing his own views on the doctor. O'Reilly said in his column that "Some prolifers branded" Tiller a baby killer, "and I reported it," as if he were reporting the views of others. But the transcripts show O'Reilly repeatedly referred to Tiller as a baby killer without attribution. So we find his statement that liberal groups are targeting him for his reporting of

what others said to be False.

[Jenksismyhero]

free speech?

[lostfan]

Well, in fairness to O'Reilly, late-term abortion pretty much IS killing a baby (look up how it's done, it makes my stomach turn).

 

I might be confusing it with partial-birth abortion, but pretty much the same concept.

Edited June 10, 2009 by lostfan

[StrangeSox]

Partial-birth is just the name given to the procedure by pro-life activists. There is no such medical terminology. There was an interesting discussion on another board I visit over whether or not this procedure is less risky for the mother than just carrying the child to term.

 

The OP is a bit of a stretch, IMO.

[lostfan]

There's probably legit medical reasons to do late-term abortions... but it had better be damn good. Not a reason like "I'm not ready to have this baby now." No, that is a decision you make and act on as soon as you find out you're pregnant, if you must... after about the first trimester, the window closes IMO.

[Texsox]

Very intelligent men and women study abortion, regardless of term, and arrive a vastly different opinions.

[Jenksismyhero]

Very intelligent men and women study abortion, regardless of term, and arrive a vastly different opinions.

 

Eh. I think there's an argument when "life" begins. Not sure if people disagree as to whether a late-term "thing" is a living being.

 

Interestingly my sister recently became pregnant. She told me that at 5-7 weeks the baby had a heartbeat, which i didn't realize happened so fast. That sorta changed my opinion of the abortion debate a little. I was always on the "it's ok so long as it's the first trimester" side of the argument. I don't buy the "at conception" argument, but certainly there's a point before the end of the first trimester that there is a living being that's allowed to be killed.

 

Regardless, as it pertains to this thread I'm not seeing a problem with what O'Reilly says. He's a talking head with free speech rights like everyone else. Certainly no worse than what guys like Olbermann have said about Bush or the like.

Edited June 10, 2009 by Jenksismybitch

[lostfan]

Eh free speech means nothing in this case. Certainly he is free to say whatever he wants. But if people have a problem or want to call him out for what he said (which I am not doing, btw) then he is not at all protected from that. It comes with the territory. In fact, if Fox decided they wanted to fire him tomorrow (not saying they will because that would be f***ing dumb) and citing that as their reason, then they can.

[Chet Lemon]

• May 11: O'Reilly wondered whom Obama would nominate to the Supreme Court, saying that he thought Obama was "callous" when it came to abortion. "I mean, the guy puts Sebelius in as the health — you can't get a more fanatically — and that woman is proabortion," O'Reilly said. "She wants the babies done for. She supported Tiller the Baby Killer out there. So, enough with her."

 

Nobody is 'proabortion.' O'Reilly is either extremely ignorant on this point or is trying to jack up indignation among his viewers. My guess is the latter.

 

[GoSox05]

There's probably legit medical reasons to do late-term abortions... but it had better be damn good. Not a reason like "I'm not ready to have this baby now." No, that is a decision you make and act on as soon as you find out you're pregnant, if you must... after about the first trimester, the window closes IMO.

 

I think it's something like less than 1% of abortions are late term. In every case i've ever read about the abortions that Dr. Tiller peformed, none of them were like "I'm due to have this baby tomorrow, but I really wanna go on vacation, so i'm gonna abort it. The cases i've read were things like having the baby would put the mothers life at risk or the baby is brain dead and might not live long after birth. Very serious and hard choices people have to make.

 

The person who murdered Dr. Tiller was gonna do it with or without O'Reilly.

 

 

We should be more worried that soon even though abortion is legal, it won't be.

[Jenksismyhero]

We should be more worried that soon even though abortion is legal, it won't be.

 

I would bet my life on this not happening. Roe v Wade will never be overturned.

[GoSox05]

I would bet my life on this not happening. Roe v Wade will never be overturned.

 

 

I don't think it will be either. Because it won't have to. The killing and harrasing of abortion doctors is actually working. Doctors do not want to get into because they are fearful. Why would you get into it if you knew that your life was in danger or at the very least you would be harassed 24 hours a day.

Edited June 10, 2009 by GoSox05

[ChiSox_Sonix]

I don't think it will be either. Because it won't have to. The killing and harrasing of abortion doctors is actually working. Doctors do not want to get into because they are fearful. Why would you get into it if you knew that your life was in danger or at the very least you would be harrased 24 hours a day.

 

Money.

 

 

[Cknolls]

There's probably legit medical reasons to do late-term abortions... but it had better be damn good. Not a reason like "I'm not ready to have this baby now." No, that is a decision you make and act on as soon as you find out you're pregnant, if you must... after about the first trimester, the window closes IMO.

 

 

[CanOfCorn]

I know this would be nearly impossible to prove, but if there was some evidence, could O'Reilly be brought up on charges for murder? For instance, if there was proven contact between the murderer and O'Reilly?

 

Also, could Tiller's family bring up a civil suit against O'Reilly?

 

Just curious from one of the 7 people left on the planet that's not a lawyer.

[Rex Kickass]

It's such a touchy subject, this.

 

I don't think Tiller actively sought to encourage late term abortions, but he performed them. Probably for two reasons - first - he was very good at them, and it is a risky procedure that few doctors will do. Second - it is a legal medical option when the fetus is not seen as viable in Kansas. He was brought up on charges that on 19 occasions that ended up to be the case. He was acquitted on every single charge.

 

For all the vilification that Tiller received, the evidence points to nothing more than a skilled doctor acting professionally and properly within the framework of the law, however you interpret that law to be.

 

Bill O'Reilly is a jackass. But a jackass who is free to call people a baby killer.

[Jenksismyhero]

I know this would be nearly impossible to prove, but if there was some evidence, could O'Reilly be brought up on charges for murder? For instance, if there was proven contact between the murderer and O'Reilly?

 

Also, could Tiller's family bring up a civil suit against O'Reilly?

 

Just curious from one of the 7 people left on the planet that's not a lawyer.

 

No. An accomplice maybe, but he didn't do the killing.

[bmags]

To implicate oreilly in this legally, he would have had to hold a rally, start riling them up about how tiller was killing babies and yell at the crowd to go kill tiller, or to that effect.

[Balta1701]

Money.

Do you really think that is a particuarly lucrative type of practice? Especially if you factor in what you have to pay in things like security, perhaps life insurance, etc.?

[ChiSox_Sonix]

Do you really think that is a particuarly lucrative type of practice? Especially if you factor in what you have to pay in things like security, perhaps life insurance, etc.?

 

No idea, although I'd suspect it pays pretty well.

 

The point was more or less just to answer why anyone would chose to do anything. In this case, it just happened to apply to abortion doctors.

[BearSox]

Do you really think that is a particuarly lucrative type of practice? Especially if you factor in what you have to pay in things like security, perhaps life insurance, etc.?

 

Tiller got 5 grand for every abortion late-term abortion he did, and considering the amount of abortions he did (the number is quite sickening), he's made a ton.

[BearSox]

If Bill O'Reilly and conservatives are to blame for Dr. Tiller's death... is the liberal media to blame for the Army Recruiters death in Arkansas?

 

After all, the muslim terrorist who killed the Army Recruiter did it for what the "Military has done to his people overseas." And all the liberal media talks about is how evil Bush is, how evil the war on terror is, and how we've tortured hundreds of muslims.

 

However, I'm not an idiot. Anyone who blames O'Reilly or any conservative or any liberal in the media for a crazy persons actions needs to get their head checked. Now, according to the Liberal Media, conservatives are to blame for the shooting at the holocaust museum... wow. This is stupid. The liberal media is beyond stupid. How can you blame anyone for the actions of an insane person? Stupidity.

 

Another interesting thing I heard. Outside of Fox News, Tiller's murder has had about 3 total hours of coverage on CNN and MSNBC, but the army recruiter who got killed has had only about 30 minutes of coverage... Yeah, the media isn't biased at all.

 

And one more thing, anyone who thinks late term abortion is okay, they're messed up, IMO. Okay, I can somewhat stomach the arguement for first term and even 2nd term abortion... but 3rd term? That's a viable baby. Okay, if there's some serious health risks, I can understand it. But otherwise, you are killing a human being, no question about it. With today's medicine, a baby can now survive being born months before the due date.

 

What Tiller did was sickening. There were several reports and accounts of him making up conditions so he could preform the abortions. This man didn't care, he just wanted his money.

Edited June 11, 2009 by BearSox

[BearSox]

It's such a touchy subject, this.

 

I don't think Tiller actively sought to encourage late term abortions, but he performed them. Probably for two reasons - first - he was very good at them, and it is a risky procedure that few doctors will do. Second - it is a legal medical option when the fetus is not seen as viable in Kansas. He was brought up on charges that on 19 occasions that ended up to be the case. He was acquitted on every single charge.

 

For all the vilification that Tiller received, the evidence points to nothing more than a skilled doctor acting professionally and properly within the framework of the law, however you interpret that law to be.

 

Bill O'Reilly is a jackass. But a jackass who is free to call people a baby killer.

How many times have you actually watched O'Reilly? Or do you just believe everything the liberal media writes and says about him?

 

If you actually took time to watch his show, you'd see that while he is a conservative, he presents both sides of the argument and then states his opinion. He's got liberals and conservatives on every night for every argument. While you might think he's some crazy conservative talking head, he's really fair and balanced. Probably the most of all the prime time shows.

[BearSox]

I would bet my life on this not happening. Roe v Wade will never be overturned.

 

True, but the reasoning behind it is very sketchy and it is poorly written.

[BearSox]

Nobody is 'proabortion.' O'Reilly is either extremely ignorant on this point or is trying to jack up indignation among his viewers. My guess is the latter.

Nobody is pro-abortion? Well, you basically got 5 groups of people.

 

1.) Strict pro-life, no abortions for any reason.

2.) Pro-life but can see justification in abortions in some scenarios and are very strongly anti-late term abortion.

3.) Don't care.

4.) Pro-choice who feel it's the women choice, but don't necessarily support abortion

5.) The people who think abortion is alright at anytime for any reason. You can also include eugenics people in here (I love how no one calls out Hilary Clinton for her deep admirition in Marget Sanger even though she was as racist as they come and dreamed of an all white society).

 

Maybe it isn't a real word, but there are plenty of proabortion people out there. And pro choice people certainly aren't anti-abortion.

Edited June 11, 2009 by BearSox