6/18 Sox @ Cubs 1:20 CSN

[SoxFan562004]

Frankly ANY fastball pitcher we were going to put out there may have been a wrong choice. I wouldnt have minded Poreda's sinker in that situation. As we can see by Thornton's results, the Cubs just react well to hard stuff, and they were bound to get some hits at home with the wind blowing out.

 

We dominated them on their home turf for 17 innings, I like it alot. I think we start to heat up a bit here, especially with the bottom of the order looking so sexy.

I think it might have been a good chance to get him in there in the beginning of the 8th but had Dotel or Thorton ready. He needs to pitch or go down to AAA.

 

Good point about Thorton, he fit what the Cubs like to do well, but after the Lee HR, he should have pitched to Soto.

[Chisoxfn]

Matty still got 3 outs, didn't he? He shouldn't even have been in the 9th, if Ozzie was doing his job.

And technically Linebrink got 3 outs, but there was an error. Thornton failed just like Linebrink failed. Linebrinks failure was much more massive though.

[RockRaines]

Also lost his this horrible overreaction was that our two young pitchers came into a hostile environment, lots of pressure and emotion and pitched their asses off.

Fixed, but great point. Gavin out battled the Cubs "Ace" today and Danks made them do twice as many interviews about their offense because he was so good.

[SoxFan562004]

Beckham was 2-for-2 today with a run, a walk and an RBI.... just saying.

Yup and BA had some good ABs and Getz hit well...

[whitesoxbrian]

Everyone here knows I'm pessimistic as hell. But hear me out, please:

 

We went to Wrigley and went 1-1. Despite the Cubs being average this year, it's still a place that is never fun to play in as an opposing player. Beckham is starting to get hot, whether it's taking a walk, HBP, or getting a solid single to the right side. Getz was a HR shy of the cycle in these 2 games combined. Floyd is starting to really pitch and Danks has 2 straight great starts. Ramirez hopefully gets going again with 2 HR in 2 games. Also, Anderson had 2 hits today as well.

 

Again, you'd like to think Cooper can help the pen. Thornton didn't look too good today, Jenks hasn't looked too crisp on his breakers lately, and Linebrink has been brutal. But Dotel has looked pretty solid and you'd like to think Thornton and Jenks can get back to normal.

 

Now let's go to Cincy and beat up a bad SP tomorrow in Arroyo.

 

Edited June 18, 2009 by whitesoxbrian

[Chisoxfn]

Chisox,

 

Thornton had basically 0 margin for error, if Thornton does the exact same job starting the 8th, he retires 1 batter, 1 batter gets on base, and retires the next 2.

 

Ozzie puts his bullpen in positions to fail.

It was a 4 run lead, there is nothing wrong with going with Linebrink to start the inning. Thornton did have less of a margin for error but bottom line he didn't execute either. Linebrink had an error, etc.

 

I realize the excuses being thrown out there and everyone wants to blame Ozzie but bottom line, the team failed to execute. Sure, I'd have went to Thornton after two were put on but the time to pull Linebrink was after two were put on or following Lee's homer. Him staying in and pitching to Soto, that was the terrible part. Prior to that I can't call any of what he (Oz) did "terrible".

[watchtower41]

Loving all the optimism here, but you people do just realize the Sox blew a 4 run lead with back-to-back HR's from two guys with less than 10 HR's combined since ASB last year?? This is 2003 all over again. Ohh well, at least Beckham is up.

[RockRaines]

I think it might have been a good chance to get him in there in the beginning of the 8th but had Dotel or Thorton ready. He needs to pitch or go down to AAA.

 

Good point about Thorton, he fit what the Cubs like to do well, but after the Lee HR, he should have pitched to Soto.

Maybe, but the Cubs are notorious for getting shut down by RHP, even so much that they traded one of their best players in the offseason. It happens, whatever. Split at Wrigley, win the series in Cincy, then come home and win again. I think we are heating up.

[Cali]

The AL Central is s***ty. The Sox will never be more than 5 games out of 1st, no matter how bad they play... I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing Haha

[WhiteSoxfan1986]

Obviously there is blame to go around everywhere today, but Ozzie deserves a lot of it. You want to have Linebrink start the 8th? Fine, it was a 5-1 game. No way he should have been facing Soto.

[RockRaines]

Loving all the optimism here, but you people do just realize the Sox blew a 4 run lead with back-to-back HR's from two guys with less than 10 HR's combined since ASB last year?? This is 2003 all over again. Ohh well, at least Beckham is up.

Scotty PODS hit an HR at wrigley with the wind blowing out, big deal. I was surprised Floyd didnt give up more runs in those conditions.

[JohnCangelosi]

Here's my philosophy: with a 4 run game heading into the 8th, if we pitch Thornton for an inning and Jenks for an inning, I'll tip my cap to the opposition if they can score 4 runs before we get 6 outs.

 

It's SO SIMPLE but true. Amazing that Ozzie doesn't see this. I dont care what you say, these games a more important, this is bragging rights. What a joke Ozzie is with his decisions, I think a 3rd grader could've managed this one better

[caulfield12]

Seriously, I raelize Ozzie made some bad calls, but you do realize the beloved savior all of you guys wanted to put in, Thornton, also failed to get the job done. His job was more difficult than Linebrinks but he too failed.

 

Bottom line you win as a team and lose as a team and the Sox didn't execute on bit. I personally don't care, the club isn't going anywhere and I'm watching games to see how the future of the organization does. I hope we win, but I hope its because of our young guys developing and while Getz had a less than stellar defensive game thats okay because he's starting to hit and figure stuff out and defensively he is darn good.

 

 

It seems as if Anderson and Getz might end up having the remainder of the season to prove they're everyday players, which many here have wanted.

 

Beckham will get to play everyday as well, leaving Fields (and Nix) obviously as the odd men out.

 

If nothing else, we should know whether those two guys can be counted on for 2010.

 

Ramirez is starting to look a little more clutch, and no longer an offensive liability. Six weeks ago, you couldn't even be sure he would rally and look like a major league regular again in 2009.

 

Playing without Quentin and Thome is another issue...the White Sox weren't THAT good LAST season, and that was with a HEALTHY/PRODUCTIVE CQ.

 

Perhaps we can pull off competing for the entire season without adding pieces at the break (especially if the starting pitching continues to do well), but we're neither as good or yesterday or as bad as today. As you said, we're a team in flux/transition from the old to the new.

 

Actually, it's nice they are still in the race and it looks like we will be playing meaningful games for at least a couple more months.

 

 

[RockRaines]

Loving all the optimism here, but you people do just realize the Sox blew a 4 run lead with back-to-back HR's from two guys with less than 10 HR's combined since ASB last year?? This is 2003 all over again. Ohh well, at least Beckham is up.

So you wanted to bring in Thornton against a guy who is a better hitter against LHP and pretty much only hits fastballs?

[fathom]

Maybe, but the Cubs are notorious for getting shut down by RHP, even so much that they traded one of their best players in the offseason. It happens, whatever. Split at Wrigley, win the series in Cincy, then come home and win again. I think we are heating up.

 

The funny thing is if you told me before series we'd split, I would have been "perfect, don't tell me any more info, I'm happy". Just disappointing how close we were to winning.

[Soxbadger]

Chisoxfn,

 

My biggest problem is that to start the inning I commented about how this would go. And it went exactly in that fashion. Maybe Thornton does go out there and get shelled, but im so tired of losing with our best pitchers still in the pen.

 

If Thornton is going to have to pitch an inning today, let him pitch the 8th with no one on base.

 

If its a 3 run lead, the game is "close" but if its 4, its "in hand". I guess to me it was just to close for comfort and Id rather go with the best and lose with the best, than sit here and say "What if".

 

No one would have questioned if Thornton came in and lost, because hes the best we have.

Edited June 18, 2009 by Soxbadger

[ThunderBolt]

I think we need to consider shutting Dye down for a week. Send Wise down for Kroeger, and see what happens.

[fathom]

Chisoxfn,

 

My biggest problem is that to start the inning I commented about how this would go. And it went exactly in that fashion. Maybe Thornton does go out there and get shelled, but im so tired of losing with our best pitchers still in the pen.

 

If Thornton is going to have to pitch an inning today, let him pitch the 8th with no one on base.

 

If its a 3 run lead, the game is "close" but if its 4, its "in hand". I guess to me it was just to close for comfort and Id rather go with the best and lose with the best, than sit here and say "What if".

 

No one would have questioned if Thornton came in and lost, because hes the best we have.

 

Great post...the ironic thing is Ozzie rarely ever pitches Linebrink in those situations. He usually puts him in if it's a "save" situation in the 8th.

[SoxFan562004]

The funny thing is if you told me before series we'd split, I would have been "perfect, don't tell me any more info, I'm happy". Just disappointing how close we were to winning.

kind of my feeling too, especially with Dempster, who's been OK this year and Zambrano coming off 2 or 3 excellent starts. It was a bad loss, no denying it, but they split a two game on the road. And if the Cubs get hot it won't be because of this game, it will be because some of their hitters are actually hitting more towards their potential.

[SoxFan562004]

I think we need to consider shutting Dye down for a week. Send Wise down for Kroeger, and see what happens.

I think they need to grit their teeth for these next 3 games and see if he can gut it out one more series in a NL park

[fathom]

I think we need to consider shutting Dye down for a week. Send Wise down for Kroeger, and see what happens.

 

Some people on here are a bunch of pansies when it comes to injuries (no offense t'bolt, you know I like your style of posting). He has a calf strain...nothing major. With 3 more games at an NL park, you can't just sit a player, as that will destroy your bench. Also, with Thome and CQ out, we need any power we can get. If we're only going to get 15 homers out of our 1st baseman this year (due to thumb), we need some people to pick up their power production.

[whitesoxbrian]

Scotty PODS hit an HR at wrigley with the wind blowing out, big deal. I was surprised Floyd didnt give up more runs in those conditions.

When?

 

Plus, Hawk said the wind was blowing from right to left. Those conditions favor the pitchers.

[watchtower41]

So you wanted to bring in Thornton against a guy who is a better hitter against LHP and pretty much only hits fastballs?

 

 

No, I thought Gavin was fine to start another inning with his pitch count. Once I saw Linebrink warming up and how he attempted to blow the game yestersay with the first pitch Jake Fox bomb, I knew we'd be in for a rough finish. Dotel would have been fine there as well. hey, it's easy to second guess now. Thorton arguably did worse than Linebrink did. Right now our whole bullpen sucks. Except Carassco. Still trying to figure out why we brought up Poreda?

[Soxbadger]

I thought the Sox should have had this series, the Cubs arent that great of a team. Obviously they can still take 2/3, but these are the type of games that teams who make the playoffs need to win.

 

We tied to make the playoffs last year, I dont want to think back on this game and think "What if"

[fathom]

When?

 

Plus, Hawk said the wind was blowing from right to left. Those conditions favor the pitchers.

 

Last year