Official Buyer or Seller Thread

[beck72]

Also, Ramirez is really starting to piss me off at SS. His head is not in the game or he thinks he's the greatest player ever. All year he's made a bunch of boneheaded plays. Sure, he makes the great play every so often, but that's not gonna help us when he throws away a ball to 1B, drops a feed at 2B because he's scared of getting hit, etc. I don't know if he has no baseball IQ (he's a great natural ball player, but he's probably the dumbest guy on the team regarding baseball), thinks he's the greatest s*** ever out there, or has his mind on something else, but he's becoming a liability out there. If we didn't have PK at first, Ramirez would have had a ton of throwing errors because of that stupid lob toss he does.

 

I love Alexei and all the potential he has, but he's awfully frustrating at times...

Now, say the Red Sox called and offered Michael Bowden or Clay Bucholz for Alexei.... would you hang up?

 

That said, I like Alexei's power and ability to play SS and 2b. But do the sox move Beckham away from his natural position, to play 3b, or move Getz who looks like he's from Minnesota farm system [something sox fans have been wanting more of], and hope teams don't realize he can't hit a decent breaking ball?

[ThunderBolt]

The Angels have been hyping up Wood for the past 5 years and he hasn't done s*** at the major league level. I've seen plenty of him and he can't hit major league pitching. He's a minor league all star but a major league dud.

 

Carlos Quentin was a completely different situation because while he produced and showed a lot of promise for the DBacks, he couldn't stay healthy and they traded him for a pretty good prospect in Chris Carter. Way different scenarios.

The Angels gave also severely mismanaged the majority of their young positional players for the last decade or so. Who aver think Macier Izturis and Erick Aybar are better than a SS who’s capable of putting up 35 homers in the majors, is probably not doing his job correctly.

[BearSox]

The Angels gave also severely mismanaged the majority of their young positional players for the last decade or so. Who aver think Macier Izturis and Erick Aybar are better than a SS who's capable of putting up 35 homers in the majors, is probably not doing his job correctly.

 

Both can actually field and hit at the major league level. In fact, I'd love to get Maicer Izturis on this team, he's a really good ball player.

[BearSox]

Now, say the Red Sox called and offered Michael Bowden or Clay Bucholz for Alexei.... would you hang up?

 

That said, I like Alexei's power and ability to play SS and 2b. But do the sox move Beckham away from his natural position, to play 3b, or move Getz who looks like he's from Minnesota farm system [something sox fans have been wanting more of], and hope teams don't realize he can't hit a decent breaking ball?

I'd definitely listen if the Red Sox offered one of their top pitching prospects, but I'm kind of inbetween. Ramirez possess the potential to be one of the top SS in baseball, if not the best, but he's such a dumbass at times and it's really frustrating. If he could get his head in the game and stop trying to be the Cuban Babe Ruth at bat, he could be a really special player.

[nickofypres]

I don't see Lilli, Wise or Fields as part of next year's picture at all. They'll all be gone - replaced by youngsters, or through trades between now and April '10.

 

ya, the bench I really wasn't sure how that could possibly mold. I agree with you though

[nickofypres]

I really doubt Anderson will be our everyday CF next year. If anything he will continue to be our 4th OF. I truly believe Jordan Danks patrols CF next season (have to remember we are slowly getting younger and younger). Quentin could definitley move to RF and platoon DH with Dye next season, but he could also stay in LF and the Sox could aqcuire an established OF like Crawford to patrol RF.

 

Does Jordan Danks have the experience? Well I guess with modern times, players only spend 2-3 years in the minors, so we drafted him in what 2007? The more I think about it scratching my beard, the more I think he will be ready and be our CF. Rumor has it the guy is fast and him or Shelby can be our lead-off hitter in the future as well

[Balta1701]

Does Jordan Danks have the experience? Well I guess with modern times, players only spend 2-3 years in the minors, so we drafted him in what 2007? The more I think about it scratching my beard, the more I think he will be ready and be our CF. Rumor has it the guy is fast and him or Shelby can be our lead-off hitter in the future as well

We drafted him in 2008 but that was after 3 full years of college ball. He's certainly got leadoff potential and is moving up the system quite well, although his stats still leave a few reasons to worry (Strikeouts). If we go on a 2 week losing skid and fall out of the race I wouldn't be surprised to see him before the end of the season; otherwise he may have a shot to make the big league team in ST next year. HIs ETA is probably 2010, with potentially a year or so of struggling to adapt to big league pitching if he can't make better contact.

[fathom]

Does Jordan Danks have the experience? Well I guess with modern times, players only spend 2-3 years in the minors, so we drafted him in what 2007? The more I think about it scratching my beard, the more I think he will be ready and be our CF. Rumor has it the guy is fast and him or Shelby can be our lead-off hitter in the future as well

 

Shelby's really playing himself out of prospect status. He's going to be 24 soon in AA and is hitting .249. His splits are ridiculous this year, as his OPS against LHP is over .500 pts better than against RHP.

[chw42]

Now, say the Red Sox called and offered Michael Bowden or Clay Bucholz for Alexei.... would you hang up?

 

That said, I like Alexei's power and ability to play SS and 2b. But do the sox move Beckham away from his natural position, to play 3b, or move Getz who looks like he's from Minnesota farm system [something sox fans have been wanting more of], and hope teams don't realize he can't hit a decent breaking ball?

 

I would hang up in a second.

 

[ThunderBolt]

Both can actually field and hit at the major league level. In fact, I'd love to get Maicer Izturis on this team, he's a really good ball player.

Once again explain to me how there is enough evidence to categorically say that Brandon Wood cannot hit or field at a major league level. Also, Erick Aybar's career OBP is .303. That's not exactly what you want for a a guy with no pop.

[Adele_H]

Also, Ramirez is really starting to piss me off at SS. His head is not in the game or he thinks he's the greatest player ever. All year he's made a bunch of boneheaded plays. Sure, he makes the great play every so often, but that's not gonna help us when he throws away a ball to 1B..

 

Ramirez footwork and attitude leave much to be desired so far thi season....... have his haters looked what the hotdog Orlando Cabrera been doing defensively lately? Not only as he not able to make near the spectacular plays Alexei does, he makes just as many bone-headed mishaps for Oakland.

 

Conclusion: Ramirez is the SS of the future and the decision not to bring OCab was a good one.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Now, say the Red Sox called and offered Michael Bowden or Clay Bucholz for Alexei.... would you hang up?

 

That said, I like Alexei's power and ability to play SS and 2b. But do the sox move Beckham away from his natural position, to play 3b, or move Getz who looks like he's from Minnesota farm system [something sox fans have been wanting more of], and hope teams don't realize he can't hit a decent breaking ball?

 

Throw in one of those two guys you mentioned along with Jed Lowrie and you've got a deal, IMO.

 

[Harry Chappas]

Ramirez footwork and attitude leave much to be desired so far thi season....... have his haters looked what the hotdog Orlando Cabrera been doing defensively lately? Not only as he not able to make near the spectacular plays Alexei does, he makes just as many bone-headed mishaps for Oakland.

 

Conclusion: Ramirez is the SS of the future and the decision not to bring OCab was a good one.

 

I think he and Beckham will switch positions next year.

[scenario]

One of the factors I haven't seen discussed yet is the possibility that the young guys who have struggled during the first half of the season might play better in the second half.

 

I wouldn't be at all surprised if one or more of Getz, Beckham, and Anderson step up and play much better as the result of getting regular playing time and experience.

 

(I left Fields out because I think he would need regular playing time to get a hitting rhythm going and I don't see him getting enough at-bats going forward to allow that to happen.)

Edited June 19, 2009 by scenario

[justBLAZE]

One of the factors I haven't seen discussed yet is the possibility that the young guys who have struggled during the first half of the season might play better in the second half.

 

I wouldn't be at all surprised if one or more of Getz, Beckham, and Anderson step up and play much better as the result of getting regular playing time and experience.

 

(I left Fields out because I think he would need regular playing time to get a hitting rhythm going and I don't see him getting enough at-bats going forward to allow that to happen.)

 

I'm pretty sure soon enough we're gonna see production out of the 3B.

 

Gordon looks legit, high contact rate, those balls are gonna fall for hits soon.

[Chicago White Sox]

If we are more than five games out by mid-July, then I'd consider moving some guys who are free agents after the season (Dye, Dotel, Contreras). In this case, I'd hope that KW/JR would be willing to pay a good chunk of their salaries in order to maximize the returns of these players. I have serious doubts JR would sign off on this, but it's not completely out of the realm of possibility (depending on # of players traded). However, I really think this team will be within five games by mid-July and KW will most likely keep what they got.

 

The only way the Sox should buy is if it's for a legitimate #1 or #2 starter who's is under control for 3 - 4 more seasons. If such a player was available and could be had for Poreda and some combination of 2nd tier prospects (Shelby, Omogrosso, Gilmore, D. Carter, etc.), then I would bite on that deal immedietely (extremely unlikely though). Otherwise, I save my surplus of young talent to help address future needs a year or two from now.

 

We are finally in a position to have nice young core to build around, similar to the Indians in the 90's. All the MLB guys below are under our control for at least 3 more seasons. All the prospects I included should be ready in the next season or two and have a solid chance at sticking in the majors.

 

1B Brandon Allen

2B Gordan Beckham

SS Alexei Ramirez

3B Dayan Viciedo

CF Jordan Danks

RF Carlos Quentin

C Tyler Flowers

 

#1 John Danks

#2 Gavin Floyd

#3 Aaron Poreda

#4 Dan Hudson

#5 Clayton Richard

 

Obviously, there is a good chance some of these youngsters will bust. Once you've identified who won't make it, then you can trade some of your young talent or use some of your financial flexibility to fill holes. IMO, the Sox are going to have a great window from 2011 - 2013 to do something special. All moves made in the next year and a half should have this window of opportunity in mind. I'm not saying ignore possible success this year or next, but rather don't throw away a great looking future for a quick fix.

 

If I was KW, I would try and grab a corner outfielder next offseason if possible. With all the money we have coming off the books, I think we have a good shot at Matt Holliday. He's the ideal solution in LF because he's somewhat young and would provide a nice bat in the middle of our lineup. Unless the Yankees offer a ridiculous contract, I think Sox would have a great chance (if interested). I'm not as worried about the Boras factor either, not with the current economy and the way he's been playing in Oakland so far. The bullpen should also be on KW's priority list this offseason. We could lose three big arms after the 2011 season (Jenks, Thornton, Linebrink). Acquiring or developing some young relievers will be critical in the next season and a half.

[GreatScott82]

I'm pretty sure soon enough we're gonna see production out of the 3B.

 

Gordon looks legit, high contact rate, those balls are gonna fall for hits soon.

Yep. Beckham is starting to find his rythm out there. I've actually been more and more impressed by Getz also. If those 2 could all of a sudden start getting on base we could be a dangerous team in the 2nd half- esspecially with the way our starting pitching is going. (wow, never thought i'd say that)

[BearSox]

Brandon Wood can hit fastballs. Brandon Wood can not hit anything else. He is not like Josh Fields (who can't hit a fastball), except that both are going to be enormous busts. I dont' mind seeing if a change of scenery does Wood good but there are plenty of other guys I'd rather acquire, especially since we have Beckham and Viciedo that can play 3B.

 

Defensievly Wood/Fields/Viciedo are all below average.

From what I've seen of Wood, he had a slow bat and struggled to catch up with 90+ mph fastballs... however, you would have likely seen more of him than I would so I'll take your word for it right now.

[beck72]

Throw in one of those two guys you mentioned along with Jed Lowrie and you've got a deal, IMO.

Lately, I've heard Hawk and Stoney dog Alexei, saying how he plays deep in the hole even in double play situations, that he runs across the bag out of control, etc. Hawk mentioned yesterday that "In my 40 years of baseball, I've never seen a guy play that deep of SS". Kind of exasperated. I'm just saying.

 

 

[beck72]

I think he and Beckham will switch positions next year.

Alexei at 3b? If alexei isn't at SS, IMO, he has more value on the trade market than at 2b or the OF.

[BearSox]

Once again explain to me how there is enough evidence to categorically say that Brandon Wood cannot hit or field at a major league level. Also, Erick Aybar's career OBP is .303. That's not exactly what you want for a a guy with no pop.

 

I have seen and read enough about Wood to conclude he isn't good defensively and he has a lot of work to do offensively.

 

As for Aybar, he isn't an OBP power guy. He's a very good defender up the middle at SS who provides a lot of speed, a decent average, and who won't K a lot. He's no world beater, but he's a solid option at the bottom of the order at SS and he's gotten better every year so far.

[BearSox]

Lately, I've heard Hawk and Stoney dog Alexei, saying how he plays deep in the hole even in double play situations, that he runs across the bag out of control, etc. Hawk mentioned yesterday that "In my 40 years of baseball, I've never seen a guy play that deep of SS". Kind of exasperated. I'm just saying.

 

Alexei just doesn't have much baseball IQ or he's not focusing on the game for some reason. What really pissed me off yesterday was how he completely bailed at 2B because he was scared of getting hit and dropped the feed. No harm was done that inning, but come on, show some balls, stay in there, and get the out. That could have been a very costly mistake, but Floyd got around it.

 

Also, what's up with him lobbing the ball every time to 1B? He's come very close to throwing away a lot of balls the past year.

 

Oh, and he has absolutely no communication with the other infielders and even the outfielders. Was it yesterday where we had the play at 3B and Alexei cut the ball off for some reason? And then you got those shallow fly balls where he doesn't back away when the CF calls him off.

 

And offensively, it seems like the 20+ homers he hit last year got him in a bad habit. His approach last year was awesome, he got up there looking to hit and hit the ball hard somewhere. This year, all he is doing is swinging from his heels and trying to drop some bombs into the bleachers.

 

It's very frustrating when a player that talented is playing well below his capabilities.

[BearSox]

Yep. Beckham is starting to find his rythm out there. I've actually been more and more impressed by Getz also. If those 2 could all of a sudden start getting on base we could be a dangerous team in the 2nd half- esspecially with the way our starting pitching is going. (wow, never thought i'd say that)

Getz has been coming up with big hit after big hit lately.

[beck72]

Alexei just doesn't have much baseball IQ or he's not focusing on the game for some reason. What really pissed me off yesterday was how he completely bailed at 2B because he was scared of getting hit and dropped the feed. No harm was done that inning, but come on, show some balls, stay in there, and get the out. That could have been a very costly mistake, but Floyd got around it.

 

Also, what's up with him lobbing the ball every time to 1B? He's come very close to throwing away a lot of balls the past year.

 

Oh, and he has absolutely no communication with the other infielders and even the outfielders. Was it yesterday where we had the play at 3B and Alexei cut the ball off for some reason? And then you got those shallow fly balls where he doesn't back away when the CF calls him off.

 

And offensively, it seems like the 20+ homers he hit last year got him in a bad habit. His approach last year was awesome, he got up there looking to hit and hit the ball hard somewhere. This year, all he is doing is swinging from his heels and trying to drop some bombs into the bleachers.

 

It's very frustrating when a player that talented is playing well below his capabilities.

That's what Stoney and Hawk were alluding to in regards to Alexei. Not physical errors but mental errors.

 

But, if Alexei boosted his numbers a bit by the deadline, the Red sox would have to see him as an offensive and defensive upgrade over the Lowrie, Green, Lugo trio. They were talking about getting Jack Wilson for crying out loud.

 

 

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

That's what Stoney and Hawk were alluding to in regards to Alexei. Not physical errors but mental errors.

 

But, if Alexei boosted his numbers a bit by the deadline, the Red sox would have to see him as an offensive and defensive upgrade over the Lowrie, Green, Lugo trio. They were talking about getting Jack Wilson for crying out loud.

Why would we trade Alexei?